Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 0'00" is a joke...

dear rob,

if you see the first page of the score of 4`33``you will see this note  
of cage: "The title of this work is the total lenght in minutes and  
seconds of this performance"...then he explains the woodstock  
performance and also after the irwin performance... and only at the  
end he said that "the movements may last any lengths of time" ... so  
this is VERY DIFFERENT from saying that the piece can last ANY LENGTH  
OF TIME !!! NO !!! only THE PARTS CAN HAVE THE LENTGH OF TIME THE  
PERFORMER WANTS in order TO GIVE 4`33``ON THE TOTAL TIME OF THE PIECE...

this is NOT MY INTERPRETATION... is CAGE INTERPRETATION... but almost  
everybody thinks that when he write that the PARTS (and NOT THE PIECE)  
can last any lentgh of time... thinks the piece can last any length of  
time... its NOT TRUE!

and the true is on the beggining of the note write by cage: "The title  
of this work is the total lenght in minutes and seconds of this  
performance"...

Best regards
vitor rua


On 26 Oct 2011, at 00:11, Rob Haskins wrote:

> 0'00" doesn't last 0'00"--it lasts, like 4'33", for any length of  
> time. I don't see it as a musical koan. The actions are amplified,  
> so there are things to hear!  There's no paradox in that, at least  
> for me.
> Rob
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Richard Friedman <[email protected]>  
> wrote:
> Something that has zero duration is a physical impossibility, unless  
> perhaps we're talking about quantum effects.
> That said, I always considered 0'0" to be not a joke, but a  
> conundrum, perhaps a musical koan, equivalent to the sound of one  
> hand clapping. And very clever.
> <R>
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, Vitor Rua <[email protected]>  
> wrote:
> it´s your vision and i respect... but don´t agree...
>
> if 0`00``is a "part 2" of 4`33``... why should we do interpretations  
> about what is not there?...
> what is there is that the piece is zero seconds of duration...
> if he wants to say absence of time measure he can put (thats the  
> correct notation for that) a "O" !!! thats the sign for "no measure"  
> used by all the contemporary composers...
> but its your opinion ... and its a valid opinion like others... like  
> mine...
> best regards
> vitor rua
>
>
>
> On 25 Oct 2011, at 22:03, matteo pittoni wrote:
>
>> As the partition talks about performing an action, and we try to  
>> recall the devotion to rational thought always showed by John Cage,  
>> I believe there is no reason to think that it should last zero  
>> seconds.
>>
>> As for the reason of the title, maybe he used this to suggest the  
>> absence of a time measure : thus, a temporal indeterminacy.
>>
>> In 4'33', there was a constraint on duration, but no constraint on  
>> any action ; maybe 0'00'' is meant to constrain the action (which  
>> must be disciplined) but not duration...
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Matteo
>>
>>
>> On 25 October 2011 22:38, David Badagnani  
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Great discussion.  I can't think of any better use for this list!
>>
>> If 0'00" is not the duration of the piece, why is it entitled  
>> that?  From all this discussion, I'm still not sure I understand  
>> that.  Is the lack of time in the title metaphorical?  And is there  
>> not at least a hint of humor?  First came the white paintings, then  
>> the silent piece of 4 minutes and 33 seconds' duration, then the  
>> very loud piece of no duration...it simply seems to be taking an  
>> idea to its logical extreme.
>>
>> -- 
>> David Badagnani
>> Kent, Ohio
>> USA
>>
>> From: Matt Rogalsky <[email protected]>
>> To: Vitor Rua <[email protected]>
>> Cc: [email protected]
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 4:09 PM
>> Subject: [silence] Re: Re: Re: 0'00" is a joke...
>>
>> OK, you pulled me in to make one more reply.
>>
>> On 2011-10-25, at 4:01 PM, Vitor Rua wrote:
>>
>> > oh pleaseeeeeee... not even einstein will think that this  
>> composition must be performed... unless they perform on a warm  
>> whole or something...theres no DURATION !!!!!
>>
>> The title of this piece is not its duration. The score instructions  
>> make that clear.
>>
>> >> think of some of the more abstract Fluxus era compositions by La  
>> Monte Young and others, for instance, which really are not really  
>> performable in a concert hall sense).
>> >
>> > I have performed almost all the pieces
>>
>> But not all.. because some cannot be performed in a concert-hall  
>> sense.
>> Such as: "This piece is little whirlpools in the middle of the  
>> ocean" (that's from memory, please forgive if I am paraphrasing)
>>
>> OK, bye! That's the end of my contribution to this discussion!
>>
>> in friendship,
>> Matt R
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Richard Friedman
> Oakland, California
> http://rchrd.com/
>
>
>
> -- 
> Rob Haskins, Ph.D.
> Associate Professor and
>      Coordinator, Graduate Studies
> Department of Music, College of Liberal Arts
> University of New Hampshire
> M-105, Paul Creative Arts Center
> 30 Academic Way
> Durham, NH 03824
> 603-862-3987 (office)
> 603-862-3155 (fax)
> <http://unh.edu/music/>
> <http://robhaskins.net>
> <http://musicandmiscellaneous.blogspot.com/>