Re: Should we just go ahead and redesign the website?

Florent Daigniere <[email protected]> Sun, 07 Aug 2016 08:01:20 +0200
Newsgroups	gmane.network.freenet.devel
Message-ID	<[email protected]>
On Sat, 2016-08-06 at 18:17 +0000, Ian Clarke wrote:
> Well, I have Florent criticizing me for being too democratic, and Xor
> criticising me for not being democratic enough, so how about if you
> guys just debate it directly.
> Ian.
> 

That came out wrong... I have no problem with you attempting to take
decisions in a democratic manner; what I have a problem with is the
obvious shortcomings of the method:

- it's very slow (prior to my email, there was a 2 month silence),
we're already 3 months in the process and we still don't have a
decision!

- by involving everyone, it's very inefficient (direct-democracy has
its limits), you can't have "referendums" all the time. Experience has
shown that asking more than "yes/no" doesn't work in practice. Getting
everyone to decide on everything just doesn't work.

- it will never be fair (nor perceived as such), since you haven't
spelt the rules in advance... Experience has also shown that the said
rules won't be considered fair either.

- it's "new" for the project, to this date it's the first time that
we're attempting it... we've given it a go, but as far as I'm
concerned, it's already a failure (all of the reasons above AND the
very low participation rate).

Overall, I'm far from convinced that it's superior to alternatives.

Florent

> 
> On Sat, Aug 6, 2016 12:56 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> > If nobody else does, I'll take the ungrateful duty of alerting us
> > of the
> > elephant in the room :(
> > 
> > 
> > You said you wanted more democracy by having the poll on how to
> > spend the
> > money. You blocked the funds with that for 3 months.
> > I am absolutely OK with that and think we should go through with
> > it! :)
> > 
> > Now you want to bypass your own democracy by taking a large sum of
> > money and
> > spending it how you please.
> > This opposes your own agenda.
> > 
> > Thus please wait for the results of the poll and only suggest a
> > website
> > redesign if people actually want it.
> > Sorry :(
> > 
> > I don't enjoy saying this but it's a natural conclusion and thus
> > needs to be
> > said.
> > Especially considering this statement of your own:
> > > When I've raised the subject of a website redesign in the past,
> > the only
> > > voices I heard in response were opposed to it.
> > 
> > Something which you have felt lots of opposition against is the
> > last thing you
> > should bypass a poll for.
> > Also, something which matters on personal *taste* is a poll-thing
> > as well:
> > Design preferences are highly personal. Whether a design sucks can
> > only be
> > answered in a poll in the first place.
> > 
> > So please, if you want to bypass the poll, do it with something
> > less
> > controversial, and with something which costs a lot less money than
> > $5000 :)
> > 
> > 
> > Thanks :)
> > 
> > --
> > hopstolive (keyword for Ians spam
> > filter)_______________________________________________
> > Devl mailing list
> > [email protected]
> > https://emu.freenetproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devl
> > 
> 
> 
> --
> Ian Clarke
> Stacks - The AI CFO for your personal finances
> http://trystacks.com/ 

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