Re: strengths and weaknesses of Gnutella
Bill Pringlemeir <[email protected]> Wed, 14 Apr 2010 11:59:44 -0700 (PDT)
| Newsgroups | gmane.network.gnutella.devel |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
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Am Montag, 12. April 2010 22:39:33 schrieb Bill Pringlemeir:
>> I think any reg-ex type of search suffers a barrier to entry for general
>> consumption. This is better solved using the 'user community' approach
>> previously suggested. I was wondering about a 'gnutella library list'
>> that users could share collaboratively. The list would group content
>> according to some general interest.=20=20
Arne Babenhauserheide replied:
>I don=E2=80=99t think I really understand what you propose =E2=80=94 and h=
ow it is contrary to=20
>allowing more complex searches=E2=80=A6=20
>How would the list group content, and would the users have to work to achi=
eve=20
>the grouping?=20
I was proposing a meta file that could be shared. This file would be a col=
lection of SHA entries (and possibly other hashes). In you previous Reg-ex=
example, you were searching for a tag related to anime and you wanted movi=
es. So, some one would create a 'list' file that was digitally signed. Th=
e file would list a bunch of SHA and movie titles along with any other meta=
data that the list creators need to add (such as bit rate, resolution, etc=
). The referenced files may or may not include tags with this information.=
The files can be found through the traditional means of an exact search=
=20
(Mojito/Kadmelia lookup, etc).
The idea was that this list would be a small data base that uses 'distribut=
ed revision control' to keep a latest version for retrieval. People could =
rate these lists and use a credence type scheme to determine if the list wa=
s bogus or worthwhile to them. The 'list' represents a community view on a=
subset of gnutella files. Generally it could be browseable, but many more=
advanced search options are available as it is 'off-line'. A user would h=
ave to attempt to download the list before using it.
The idea with the digital signing is that several authors can share authori=
ty over the list and collaboratively build it. Perhaps several public keys=
would be included in the package and nodes merging changes would verify th=
at list additions are from authorized sources. A 'browse host' or regular =
fixed string query would locate lists. Alternative out of band (web sites,=
etc) could provide the lists.
The lists would have to represent a fraction of the target file size. Ther=
e wouldn't be much use for haiku text files index, but I think that even a=
udio files, stills, etc would still be much bigger than these mini-database=
s.
I guess the credence idea is completely separate. Initially I had thought=
that the public keys would be part of the credence ID mechanism. But real=
ly it would possibly only require that nodes rate lists for credence to wor=
k. The keys within the list are probably best *only* used for the distribu=
ted revision control. A member of the public can verify authorized updates=
to the lists, but only nodes with private keys can update the list (obviou=
sly keys can not be added at all (or at the very least naively)).
Basically mini-distributed magnet databases might best summarize what I am =
talking about.
fwiw,
Bill Pringlemeir.
__________________________________________________
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<p><br>
Am Montag, 12. April 2010 22:39:33 schrieb Bill Pringlemeir:<br>
<br>
>> I think any reg-ex type of search suffers a barrier to entry for g=
eneral<br>
>> consumption. This is better solved using the 'user community' app=
roach<br>
>> previously suggested. I was wondering about a 'gnutella library l=
ist'<br>
>> that users could share collaboratively. The list would group cont=
ent<br>
>> according to some general interest. <br>
<br>
Arne Babenhauserheide replied:<br>
>I don=E2=80=99t think I really understand what you propose =E2=80=94 an=
d how it is contrary to <br>
>allowing more complex searches=E2=80=A6 <br>
<br>
>How would the list group content, and would the users have to work to a=
chieve <br>
>the grouping? <br>
<br>
I was proposing a meta file that could be shared. This file would be a col=
lection of SHA entries (and possibly other hashes). In you previous Reg-ex=
example, you were searching for a tag related to anime and you wanted movi=
es. So, some one would create a 'list' file that was digitally signed. Th=
e file would list a bunch of SHA and movie titles along with any other meta=
data that the list creators need to add (such as bit rate, resolution, etc=
). The referenced files may or may not include tags with this information.=
The files can be found through the traditional means of an exact search =
<br>
(Mojito/Kadmelia lookup, etc).<br>
<br>
The idea was that this list would be a small data base that uses 'distribut=
ed revision control' to keep a latest version for retrieval. People could =
rate these lists and use a credence type scheme to determine if the list wa=
s bogus or worthwhile to them. The 'list' represents a community view on a=
subset of gnutella files. Generally it could be browseable, but many more=
advanced search options are available as it is 'off-line'. A user would h=
ave to attempt to download the list before using it.<br>
<br>
The idea with the digital signing is that several authors can share authori=
ty over the list and collaboratively build it. Perhaps several public keys=
would be included in the package and nodes merging changes would verify th=
at list additions are from authorized sources. A 'browse host' or regular =
fixed string query would locate lists. Alternative out of band (web sites,=
etc) could provide the lists.<br>
<br>
The lists would have to represent a fraction of the target file size. Ther=
e wouldn't be much use for haiku text files index, but I think that even a=
udio files, stills, etc would still be much bigger than these mini-database=
s.<br>
<br>
I guess the credence idea is completely separate. Initially I had thought=
that the public keys would be part of the credence ID mechanism. But real=
ly it would possibly only require that nodes rate lists for credence to wor=
k. The keys within the list are probably best *only* used for the distribu=
ted revision control. A member of the public can verify authorized updates=
to the lists, but only nodes with private keys can update the list (obviou=
sly keys can not be added at all (or at the very least naively)).<br>
<br>
Basically mini-distributed magnet databases might best summarize what I am =
talking about.<br>
<br>
fwiw,<br>
Bill Pringlemeir.<br>
<br>
____________<wbr>_________<wbr>_________<wbr>_________<wbr>_________<wbr>__=
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font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 11px;
padding: 10px 0;
}
#activity {
background-color: #e0ecee;
float: left;
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 10px;
padding: 10px;
}
#activity span {
font-weight: 700;
}
#activity span:first-child {
text-transform: uppercase;
}
#activity span a {
color: #5085b6;
text-decoration: none;
}
#activity span span {
color: #ff7900;
}
#activity span .underline {
text-decoration: underline;
}
.attach {
clear: both;
display: table;
font-family: Arial;
font-size: 12px;
padding: 10px 0;
width: 400px;
}
.attach div a {
text-decoration: none;
}
.attach img {
border: none;
padding-right: 5px;
}
.attach label {
display: block;
margin-bottom: 5px;
}
.attach label a {
text-decoration: none;
}
=20=20
blockquote {
margin: 0 0 0 4px;
}
.bold {
font-family: Arial;
font-size: 13px;
font-weight: 700;
}
.bold a {
text-decoration: none;
}
dd.last p a {
font-family: Verdana;
font-weight: 700;
}
dd.last p span {
margin-right: 10px;
font-family: Verdana;
font-weight: 700;
}
dd.last p span.yshortcuts {
margin-right: 0;
}
div.attach-table div div a {
text-decoration: none;
}
div.attach-table {
width: 400px;
}
div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.fi=
le-title a:visited {
text-decoration: none;
}
div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div=
.photo-title a:visited {
text-decoration: none;
}
div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts {
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 10px;
font-weight: normal;
}
.green {
color: #628c2a;
}
.MsoNormal {
margin: 0 0 0 0;
}
o {
font-size: 0;
}
#photos div {
float: left;
width: 72px;
}
#photos div div {
border: 1px solid #666666;
height: 62px;
overflow: hidden;
width: 62px;
}
#photos div label {
color: #666666;
font-size: 10px;
overflow: hidden;
text-align: center;
white-space: nowrap;
width: 64px;
}
#reco-category {
font-size: 77%;
}
#reco-desc {
font-size: 77%;
}
.replbq {
margin: 4px;
}
#ygrp-actbar div a:first-child {
/* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/
margin-right: 2px;
padding-right: 5px;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg {
font-size: 13px;
font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif;
*font-size: small;
*font: x-small;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg table {
font-size: inherit;
font: 100%;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {
font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {
font:115% monospace;
*font-size:100%;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg * {
line-height: 1.22em;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg #logo {
padding-bottom: 10px;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg a {
color: #1E66AE;
}
#ygrp-msg p a {
font-family: Verdana;
}
#ygrp-msg p#attach-count span {
color: #1E66AE;
font-weight: 700;
}
#ygrp-reco #reco-head {
color: #ff7900;
font-weight: 700;
}
#ygrp-reco {
margin-bottom: 20px;
padding: 0px;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li a {
font-size: 130%;
text-decoration: none;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li {
font-size: 77%;
list-style-type: square;
padding: 6px 0;
}=20
#ygrp-sponsor #ov ul {
margin: 0;
padding: 0 0 0 8px;
}
#ygrp-text {
font-family: Georgia;
}
#ygrp-text p {
margin: 0 0 1em 0;
}
#ygrp-text tt {
font-size: 120%;
}
#ygrp-vital ul li:last-child {
border-right: none !important;=20
}=20
-->
</style>
</head>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~-->
</html>
<!-- end group email -->
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