Re: Weekly update

By the way, just a reminder.  This list source is for the mixmaster
committee's direct communication between members about coop business.
We are trying to reduce the amount of material that members have to
filter through to get the info they need about meetings, workparties
and plans.
I don't mind answering questions but if they are not directly related
to the mixmaster committee and the business of it related to the coop
then those questions need to be directed to the general list.

that said!!

The questions that I have been answering are very good and directly
relate to the process we are discovering at this time.
We need more members of the mixmaster committee to do research and ask
questions in their own time in this way.  This will drive the learning
curve up much faster at mixmaster work parties.

...but we cannot allow this to degenerate into off topic chit chat.


Seth



On 5/29/06, Seth Moody <[email protected]> wrote:
> Morning Brian,
> quick answers?
>
> > What is the 5% prewash method again?
>
> 5% prewash is the procedure used to help drop out unreacted FFA's,
> Glycerin and any soap that was just created during reation.
>
> > Do you put the water right into the processor?  Before or after draining off the glycerin?
>
> Yes you put the hotwater in directly after processing and then mix
> again for 5 minutes.
>
> >How do you not get emulsification when mixing the water and glycerin
> like that?  Or do you drain off the glycerin first?
>
> No you don't drain glycerin off first, that is the key to this process.
> You are using waters affinity for making an emulsion witht he FFA's,
> attaching to soaps and then attaching to the glycerin.  It happens
> pretty much in this order and then since this mix is still hot(from
> reacting) and has a specific gravity much greater that the Biod, it
> drops out much more cleanly.  One side benefit is that the glycerin
> wants to lock up with the water more that it wants to remain attached
> to any biod so you get a better reaction since the glycerin is
> detaching itself from biod to actively attach to the water.
> Again the water must be added when glycerin is still in suspension,
> immediatly after mixing.
>
> > And if you are not using the bubblewash method, how
> > are you getting the rest of the glycerin out?  I would
> > love to lessen the amount of water that I am using so
> > if you are able to do this using only 5% water total,
> > I would be prety excited!
> We use mechanical mixing at the coop and I have used mechanical mixing
> with 2 other processors I have been working on, basically a drill
> motor with a paint stirrer will work for batch's up to 35 gal.
> You can use pump mixing but it needs to be vigorous.
> With vigorous mixing you create more surface area for the water to
> attach to any remaining contaminants thereby reducing amount of water
> necessary.  You will have to still test the ph of your water to
> determine when your done washing.
>
> In my opinion bubble washing is too touchy feely with the biod and is
> only promoting oxidization of the fuel as well as allowing homebrewers
> to use poor reactions.
> Refine your process, make it efficient.  Your results will be 2 fold
> on both ends.
>
> S
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Brian S
> >
> > --- Joyce Castilloux <castillouxjo-/[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Seth,
> > >   We have not come to any of your meetings yet as we
> > > just learned about your group.  BUT - we are coming
> > > Tuesday June 6th to meet and get started.
> > >   Meanwhile, since you are in charge of making the
> > > biodiesel - maybe you can answer a question for me.
> > > It is about the oil I am using - or should say -
> > > trying to use.  It is second hand but according to
> > > the container it comes in - the brand name is SYCSO
> > > -a creamy liquid frying oil.  Do you have any
> > > experience with this type oil??
> > >   Quick back ground on us.  We bought a unit to make
> > > biodiesel.  First batch was a failure- the lye
> > > didn't mix properly.  2nd one a success, 3rd one - a
> > > failure- reason unknown.  Then cold weather set in
> > > and the barn wasn't heated and we gave up for the
> > > winter.  Comes warmer weather - another failure.  So
> > > why did we have one success??  Might have been oil
> > > from another source but frankly - I can't recall - I
> > > think it was a mix of the SYSCO and another oil
> > > source.  So - either I am doing the titration
> > > incorrectly - (or my titration mix itself is
> > > incorrect) or the oil is not usable for this
> > > purpose.
> > >   Making biodiesel is not that difficult with the
> > > unit we have - so I am really frustrated at our lack
> > > of success.  Any suggestions or ideas on how to
> > > locate the source of my problems would be greatly
> > > appreciated.  Sincerely, Joyce & Phil
> > >
> > >
> > > Seth Moody <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >   Trying to reinforce the idea that fuel doesn't
> > > just appear out of
> > > the sky. We make it and if we don't make it and
> > > train more people to
> > > make it there will be very little or none for
> > > distribution. I think
> > > you all know this but beginning to get mystified
> > > looks when I have to
> > > tell people that there is no fuel for distribution
> > > because a we have a
> > > backlog in washing. Hopefully we will not have this
> > > problem nearly as
> > > much as the mixmasters on Friday and Saturday spent
> > > time getting more
> > > totes cleaned up so that we have a full tote
> > > available for our second
> > > stage washing
> > >
> > > You guys did a great job when I just threw you into
> > > titration mode.
> > > We had a few technical difficulties(methoxide mixer
> > > leaking(fixed),
> > > cold scale doesn't like to operate(engine preheat
> > > for the scale), poly
> > > lines disintegrating(make new line), shortage of
> > > power,(Generator now
> > > operational(thanks Tom)) but just have to remember
> > > to cut
> > > the problem into little bits and solve each little
> > > bit.
> > >
> > > By the way, Tom spent a bit of time troublshooting
> > > the generator and
> > > found all it really needs is to be moved out of its
> > > cover when running
> > > so it gets better intake airflow and cooling, so we
> > > now have an
> > > additional energy source for pumping crews and
> > > mixmasters.
> > > YEEAAHHH!!!
> > >
> > > I want to give the Mixmaster crew and oil support
> > > crew a huge hand this week.
> > > 1. Oil consolidation is moving rapidly toward
> > > sustainable levels with
> > > the addition of two more
> > > clean totes for oil and a clean tote for the new
> > > wash vessel.
> > > 2. Generator back online so we now have an
> > > additional source of power
> > > for both crews.
> > > By the way, we need to find some fat tires for the
> > > generator cart
> > > so it can be easily
> > > moved from spot to spot on the site.
> > > 4. Batch of fuel made
> > > 5. Batch of fuel filtered
> > > 6. Batch of fuel washed.
> > > 7. The South side of the Conex is nearly clear of
> > > totes, barrels and pallets.
> > > This means we will be able to begin leveling and
> > > preping the
> > > 10X12 area for ground
> > > breaking on our new processor shed.
> > >
> > >
> > > Should have 100 gallons of dry fuel ready for
> > > distribution on
> > > Saturday, keep the fingers crossed, if things go
> > > well Friday and
> > > Saturday morning.
> > >
> > > Food for thought:
> > > Something I have been doing is trying to give people
> > > an idea of what
> > > is coming for the weekend work party. It really
> > > helps to take a look
> > > at what is on tap for the work party and
> > > imagine(visualize) yourself
> > > doing each step of the task. I find this works for
> > > me very well and
> > > especially when a problem occurs I am able to
> > > identify and solve a
> > > problem much more quickly.
> > >
> > >
> > > Here is the June Calender.
> > > It looks very empty at this time.
> > > Again let me know days that you are available for a
> > > work party, be it
> > > a Friday or Saturday I will then put you on the
> > > calender for the
> > > requested day and when I make the weekly
> > > announcements with the
> > > calender attached you will be able to see where
> > > you've been tasked.
> > >
> > > Have a great week.
> > >
> > > Hope to see you at the work party.
> > >
> > >
> > > Not so oily anymore(moving a bit quicker),
> > >
> > > Seth
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mixmasters mailing list
> > > [email protected]
> > >
> > http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/mixmasters
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > >  Get on board. You're invited to try the new Yahoo!
> > > Mail Beta.>
> > _______________________________________________
> > > mixmasters mailing list
> > > [email protected]
> > >
> > http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/mixmasters
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > mixmasters mailing list
> > [email protected]
> > http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/mixmasters
> >
>