Reactor upgrades - Gen2.5?

Friends,

I think the "stacked batches" method is the best for the short term.  
Part of the work Gregg B. has done using the eductor for mixing reactor 
3 is to move forward to 3 completely stand alone processors.  Each will 
have it's own pump, controls (eventually), and piping.  The only thing 
they will share is a common inlet for WVO, methoxide and prewash water.  
The common outlet will be to pump to a common settling tank.  This will 
allow us to react what we can; 50, 100 or 150 gal per day or some 
multiple of that.  Processing will only be delayed by the methoxide 
recycle time assuming some water heaters heating oil or a 275 gal tank 
with elements in it (not a new idea).  When Gregg is done with the lid 
for Processor 3, I will take it home, buy another pump and plumb the 
whole mess in steel pipe.  This has been the plan all along and matches 
Tom's vision of a bunch of appleseeds in a row.  Besides, if we get away 
from changing hoses around (quick disconnects) then we should be able to 
do Class 1/Div 2 in the conex and go ahead and put in our 200 amp panel 
legally.

I would like to discuss the heating element end of things.  I know we 
are currently using the in-line heater (thanks to Ron's persistence) for 
heating oil.  I know until recently we were using the elements in the 
reactors to heat oil.  Can we switch back to that method when there's 
enough juice in the conex?  Can we do that with the power we have now?

A good thing to discuss at a processor development meeting that we need 
to have soon.

Does anyone have contact for Brent (hyphenated last name) who is a 
pipefitter working on the google project?  We could use his help on the 
reactor piping.  Please put him in touch with me.

I will work up a drawing of how I think the processor should be piped 
and post a link on the siteplan and mixmaster lists for comment.

Chet, did you ever work up a process diagram?  I did one a while back 
that I could post for comment and get the piping plan going from there.

Sorry, pipefitting is a professional skill that we won't turn untrained 
hands loose with, but we could run a workshop for those who would like 
to learn.

Thanks,

Felix
503-231-0779

p.s.  If anyone knows someone who wants to be part of this discussion, 
please direct them to the mixmaster or siteplan list.  I think it's best 
to keep this discussion on those forums.

p.p.s. start collecting #1 plastic water bottles to replace the glass 
bottles in the dryer.  Greg Rhode and Amanda Rice feel they will hold up 
equally well to bioD and will be a lot lighter (but no where near as fun 
to empty).  With the cold wheater upon us, I would like to build a 
second cell for the dryer and would like to find someone to take up a 
heater project, solar, dryer coil or ????




Zac Imboden wrote:
> Agreed. And my last email, I think, was before we met. I just got off 
> the phone with Generx, who is our methanol supplier. I'm trying to get 
> a bead on how often we need to order.
> Do you know if there is a limit to how much methanol we can store on 
> site at a time?
> We're currently producing 100-200 gallons of fuel a week, which means 
> we're using 20-40 gallons of methanol. If we ordered monthly, we would 
> need 80-160 gallons a month, which would be 2-4 drums.
>
> On the methoxide mixer front, we do need to push forward with either 
> making the mixer larger or figuring out a better way to mix it. There 
> are two approaches. What are the pros and cons of each?
>
> 1) Methoxide concentrate
> Seth talked about making a methoxide concentrate. Doubling the amount 
> of lye we mix into the 10 gallons of methanol, pumping in that 
> concentrate then pumping an additional 10 gallon of straight methanol 
> after it.
>
> 2) Stacked batches
> Mix lye and 10 gallons methanol and pump into first reactor (keep it 
> closed off from 2nd reactor).
> Mix lye and 10 gallons methanol and pump into 2nd reactor. (closed off 
> from first reactor).
> Open the pipes between the reactors and use pump and paddle to mix 
> their contents together.
>
> Are there ramifications to either approach in terms of affecting the 
> reaction?
> Perhaps we could simply react two batches simultaneously but 
> independently, but this would require two pumps, one for each tank.
>
> On Oct 29, 2006, at 8:43 PM, Felix Kersting wrote:
>
>> Closed reactors can be within 5 or 10 feet of the property line, but 
>> the methanol storage needs to be 25' from the property line.  Note 
>> that the methoxide mixer is actually open to the atmosphere, so it 
>> needs to be far away with the methanol.
>>
>> Another processor related project is to expand the capacity of the 
>> mixer.  That's an important and engineer intensive project since the 
>> fumes are so flammable and toxic.  That needs to graduate to a sealed 
>> container.
>>
>> Felix
>>
>> Zac Imboden wrote:
>>> So the methoxide shed is way out from the shelter. Any issues with 
>>> the long line needed to pump the methoxide into the reactor vessels 
>>> (looks like a tote) under the shed? Or the fact that the actual 
>>> reaction will occur under the shed and less than 20 feet from one 
>>> property boundary? Just curious.
>>>
>>> On Oct 26, 2006, at 11:32 PM, Felix Kersting wrote:
>>>
>>>> Zac, thanks for pointing out that I didn't send the link!!
>>>>
>>>> http://www.gobiodiesel.org/index.php?title=User:Fjkersting
>>>>
>>>> Let me know if that works or not. It's the page that I can create 
>>>> as a user.  I couldn't figure out how to add to the Site page that 
>>>> Pete and Brian posted on.
>>>>
>>>> Felix
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>>
>>>> Friends,
>>>>
>>>> Sorry about the sloppy posting with attachments yesterday.  Special
>>>> apologies to Brian.
>>>>
>>>> I created a page on the wiki and uploaded some files and posted the
>>>> links on the page.
>>>>
>>>> Is that the right way to do it?  I couldn't get the [[Image:]] command
>>>> to work - that's why it's basically a list of links.
>>>>
>>>> Links to what?  BlueSky layout, Code based Coop site layout & June 
>>>> 2006
>>>> processor shed layout.
>>>>
>>>> If there is a better way to do this, please let me know.
>>>>
>>>> Zac - thanks for that segment at the end of the Brew Book on Wiki - 
>>>> you
>>>> got me started.
>>>>
>>>> Felix
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> mixmasters mailing list
>>>> [email protected]
>>>> http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/mixmasters
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Zac Imboden
>>> [email protected]
>>> 1534 SE 35th Place
>>> Portland, OR
>>> 97214
>>> 971-563-2477
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> Zac Imboden
> [email protected]
> 1534 SE 35th Place
> Portland, OR
> 97214
> 971-563-2477
>
>
>
>