RE: pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 17

Hello Jeff
What is the cost that a person incurs by having to treat the wash water
before entering the septic tank?  Seems that over time there is a =
potential
to cause damage to septic tank if water is untreated. =20

I ask because I am looking at property with septic system. =20

Mark

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
[email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2008 1:07 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 17


Send pdx-biodiesel mailing list submissions to
	[email protected]

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-biodiesel
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
	[email protected]

You can reach the person managing the list at
	[email protected]

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
"Re: Contents of pdx-biodiesel digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. RE: pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 16 (Mark Darula)
   2. Re: dealing with wast (Jeff Brandt)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 14:38:41 -0800
From: "Mark Darula" <[email protected]>
Subject: [pdx-biodiesel] RE: pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 16
To: <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <004201c878c8$5a445880$6400a8c0@XP>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"us-ascii"

Hello John
Emulsions occur because the biodiesel becomes "imprisoned" in these soap
spheres. These soap spheres can be broken apart by pushing them tightly
together by freezing the whole emulsion. Or we can break the emulsion by
lowering the surface tension between the soap molecules using a solvent =
like
alcohol. The alcohols (methanol and glycerin) in the biodiesel =
by-product
are a readily available solvent to break emulsions; much easier than
freezing a large emulsion solid.

The above came from the link below.  This is a great explanation on
emulsions and how to avoid them.  I think you will find this article
interesting. =20
http://www.biodieselcommunity.org/breakingemulsions/

Mark

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
[email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:54 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 16


Send pdx-biodiesel mailing list submissions to
	[email protected]

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-biodiesel
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
	[email protected]

You can reach the person managing the list at
	[email protected]

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
"Re: Contents of pdx-biodiesel digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. dealing with wast (John Harris)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:13:41 -0700
From: "John Harris" <[email protected]>
Subject: [pdx-biodiesel] dealing with wast
To: "Bio Diesel co-op" <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <000801c8789a$efea3720$01fea8c0@homeo278bja379>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"iso-8859-1"

I have two questions.
1.  I live in the country and have a septic tank.  Do I have to do =
anything
to treat my septic tank when I pour the wast water into my septic system
that I used to wash my bio diesel? 2.  A while ago I wrote about my wash
test when I used 100ml processed bio and 100ml water and ended up with a
white film between the two. I was advised to freeze it.  Freezing was
supposed to get rid of the soap, which it did. Freezing also cleard up =
the
foggy bio to a clear golden color.  Why did my finnished bio become so =
clear
when it was frozen?  What does this tell me about my test bio?

------------------------------

_______________________________________________
pdx-biodiesel mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-biodiesel

End of pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 16
*********************************************




------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2008 14:58:11 -0800
From: "Jeff Brandt" <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [pdx-biodiesel] dealing with wast
To: "General Biodiesel discussion"
	<[email protected]>
Message-ID:
	<[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-1

On 2/26/08, John Harris <[email protected]> wrote:

> I have two questions.

> 1.  I live in the country and have a septic tank.  Do I have to do=20
> anything to treat my septic tank when I pour the wast water into my=20
> septic system that I used to wash my bio diesel?

I also live in the country and have dealt with the same situation.

The waste water is just very alkaline soapy water with methanol in it. =
So
other than neutralizing the pH in order not to kill the environment in =
your
septic system, it should be fine.

We previously used citric acid to neutralize our wash water. You just =
add
some universal pH indicator, pour in a little citric acid, stir and =
watch
for the color to go yellow. Once the color is yellow (not green, not =
orange)
you can pour it down the drain into your septic.

> 2.  A while ago I wrote about my wash test when I used 100ml processed =

> bio and 100ml water and ended up with a white film between the two. I=20
> was advised to freeze it.  Freezing was supposed to get rid of the=20
> soap, which it did. Freezing also cleard up the foggy bio to a clear=20
> golden color.  Why did my finnished bio become so clear when it was=20
> frozen?  What does this tell me about my test bio?

Biodiesel will absorb small amounts of water that can make it look =
cloudy or
hazy.

Depending on the temperature and the barometric pressure, the water can =
get
pushed in an out of the biodiesel like a sponge.

You are looking for high clarity, this means you should be able to use a
sample of biodiesel in a test tube as a magnifiying glass to read small
print in a newspaper.

You can remove the water from larger quantities of biodiesel by bubbling =
air
through it with a bubbler stone for a few hours. However when you bubble =
air
through your fuel you are reducing the shelf life a little bit by means =
of
oxidation.

Personally I don't think this is a big deal as long as you don't intend =
on
saving the fuel for a rainy day and use it fairly soon. If you are =
really
paranoid about it, you could get a bottle of nitrogen and bubble =
nitrogen
through your fuel to dry it. I'm told this works very well and uses very
little nitorgen gas to accomplish the task.

If you want to dry a small sample, you could do it outside in a pan with =
a
coleman stove or equivelant. Please do not do this indoors as your =
biodiesel
will still contain small amounts of methanol that will quickly evaporate =
and
is toxic.


--
Jeff Brandt
Sun Break Biofuels, LLC
http://www.sunbreakbiofuels.com mailto:[email protected]


------------------------------

_______________________________________________
pdx-biodiesel mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.gobiodiesel.org/mailman/listinfo/pdx-biodiesel

End of pdx-biodiesel Digest, Vol 61, Issue 17
*********************************************