Re: Ecotopia2003 digest, Vol 1 #111 - 4 msgs

money is a weird thing that we all have to deal with
it  please do not let it take over our hearts and
there is always more important things and people! all
anyone wants is to be happy i dont think any one sets
out to make anyone else unhappy even if they do things
sometimes that hurts others! Roisin
--- [email protected] wrote:
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> > Today's Topics:
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>    1. Settling diffferences
> (=?iso-8859-1?q?Jsvier=20Montellano?=)
>    2. Re: Settling diffferences
> (V=?ISO-8859-1?B?7WN0b3IgR3VpbGxhbfM=?=n)
>    3. Anyone traveling from Kyiv 18 aug?
> ([email protected])
>    4. Re: Settling diffferences (Arman Vermishyan)
> 

> ATTACHMENT part 3.1 message/rfc822 
> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2003 12:52:27 +0200 (CEST)
> From: Jsvier Montellano <[email protected]>
> To: [email protected],
> [email protected]
> Subject: [Ecotopia2003] Settling diffferences
> 
> Hi there!
> 
> There is an ongoing conflict between EYFA and Green
> Dossier about some salaries for organizators which
> where not agreed upon beforehand.
>  
> The conflict between Green Dossier and EYFA also
> states that "any difference will be solved by
> arbitration".
> 
> Can there be space in Ecotopia for a conflict
> resolution exercise?
> 
> (below you find the emails, the most recent first)
> 
>  
> 
> Dear EYFA people, dear Mariel!
> I understand you are not experienced in managment
> and
> financial issues. As well as in Ukrainian rules.
> 
> The first thing I advice you to do - read the
> contract
> which we signed.
> (Do you have it?). Find, please, a point 4.1. about
> financing. It is
> very clear: the whole sum of the project 4493 EUR
> should be transfered
> to Green Dossier after signing the contract. You
> transfered us 3000
> EUR, so, the rest of money is 1493 EUR. Is this
> clear?
> The second point which you should understand ad
> least:
> our country is under
> a special international watch on currency
> regulations.
> There is no
> possibilities to get another sum, only those written
> in the contract.
> Any financial changes in international agreements
> automatically become
> a subject of investigations of our tax police and
> bank
> system, of
> international financial watch. We may agree between
> us
> about
> reallocation of money from one line to other but
> have
> no right to change a
> whole sum. Is this clear?
> About salaries. Yes, we agreed this point a half a
> year ago. That's a
> pity, you don't remember your decisions and don't
> want
> to keep your
> promisses.
> I'm leaving for Sheshory 13th morning, so these
> questions should be
> solved during these two days. Remember: we need
> money
> befor Ecotopia, not after
> it!!!
> 
> Thanks a lot for your help,
> Tamara
> 
> ******************************************
> Charity Information Center "Green Dossier" 
> 
> Tel/fax: 380 44 227 6277
> POB 201, Kiev-25, Ukraine, 01025
> E-mail: [email protected]
> http://www.dossier.kiev.ua/
> ******************************************
> WE ALL BELONG TO THE EARTH
> ******************************************
> 
> 
> 
> m> Dear Green Dossier,
> 
> m> we were a bit shocked this morning after reading
> your e-mail 
> m> because there must be some kind of
> misunderstanding.
> 
> m> Your discussion about paying organisers is out of
> the budget we 
> m> agreed in our contract. In this contract, which
> we
> both signed, 
> m> there is no money for organisers salaries. The
> budget includes 
> m> money for logistics, travel reimbursement to the
> venue and other 
> m> costs related to Ecotopia but never the wages of
> people working in 
> m> Green Dossier or Eyfa. As we ourselves are paid
> from our own 
> m> funds, you too should pay your people with your
> own
> resources.
> 
> m> Furthemore, there is no more money in the budget
> to
> be 
> m> trasnsferred, so we don't know what you mean by
> "the rest of the 
> m> money".
> 
> m> We agreed on paying something to one person from
> the national 
> m> Park, because we consider it fair enough, as they
> are providing us 
> m> the venue and they will take care for many
> things. 
> 
> m> Alexander bagin's salary is also something
> unclear
> for us, which 
> m> we need to discuss. Until now, we have not had
> much
> 
> m> communication with him and we have not received
> any
> budget of 
> m> costs from him. So we wonder what we should pay.
> But in any 
> m> case, this money would also be taken from
> Ecotopia
> budget, not 
> m> from Eyfa funds.
> 
> m> We would like to explain that in the history of
> Eyfa-Ecotopia, the 
> m> host organisation has never received money for
> their own 
> m> employees, and that is something out of question.
> 
> m> So you may understand now our surprise when we
> received your e-
> m> mail stating finances matters that have never
> been
> discussed nor 
> m> mentioned. 
> 
> m> Please notice that we do not mean that you do not
> deserve a 
> m> salary for your work, which we appreciate a lot.
> You have all the 
> m> merit of this organisation but your salaries are
> just not 
> m> responsability of Ecotopia budget.
> 
> m> Best regards,
> m> Eyfa Crew
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> m> On 7 Aug 2003, at 18:38, Tamara Malkova wrote:
> 
> >> 
> >> Dear EYFA people!
> >> There is several issues on financing.
> >> 
> >> 1. We discussed here possible payment for the
> organisers. Looks like we
> >> need more finance for this. So, there were
> follows
> Green Dossier people working for
> >> Ecotopia:
> >> Ira Rozmaritsa - worked for Ecotopia since
> september 2002 till march
> >> 2003 as a coordinator, was already paid 100 eur
> >> Olga Mykhaylyuk paid 100 eur for preparations
> since
> september 2002
> >> till middle May 2003, is working now as well for
> press events, all
> >> information materials in Russian and Ukrainian,
> prepares the festival
> >> program, garbage actions, filming - on our mind
> should be paid 200 eur
> >> more.
> >> Miroslava - the same information activities,
> should
> be paid 150 eur
> >> Tanya - prparing English reader (finding out all
> materials from
> >> Ukraine, a lot of logistics for reader,
> translation
> into russian,
> >> helped with some translation in e-mail - 100 eur
> 
=== message truncated ===

> ATTACHMENT part 3.2 message/rfc822 
> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2003 13:17:03 +0200
> Subject: Re: [Ecotopia2003] Settling diffferences
> From: Víctor Guillamón <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>,
> 	<[email protected]>
> 
> If it's an ongoing conflict between Eyfa and Green
> Dossier, what's about to
> resolve it between Eyfa and Green Dossier???
> I think you must have some ways to resolve this
> economic and personal
> problems, not spreading it here. The first conflict
> resolution principle
> it's to resolve it in the correct place. And salary
> problems are too
> personal and delicate to spread to a list like this.
> I think this list it's
> not the place were this kind of problems. If it's
> not so, please, take me
> off the list. I'm not interesed in problems I can
> not solve, nor in
> forwarded mails I have not information about
> context.
> 
> On 12/8/03 12:52, "Jsvier Montellano"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> > Hi there!
> > 
> > There is an ongoing conflict between EYFA and
> Green
> > Dossier about some salaries for organizators which
> > where not agreed upon beforehand.
> > 
> > The conflict between Green Dossier and EYFA also
> > states that "any difference will be solved by
> > arbitration".
> > 
> > Can there be space in Ecotopia for a conflict
> > resolution exercise?
> > 
> > (below you find the emails, the most recent first)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Dear EYFA people, dear Mariel!
> > I understand you are not experienced in managment
> and
> > financial issues. As well as in Ukrainian rules.
> > 
> > The first thing I advice you to do - read the
> contract
> > which we signed.
> > (Do you have it?). Find, please, a point 4.1.
> about
> > financing. It is
> > very clear: the whole sum of the project 4493 EUR
> > should be transfered
> > to Green Dossier after signing the contract. You
> > transfered us 3000
> > EUR, so, the rest of money is 1493 EUR. Is this
> clear?
> > The second point which you should understand ad
> least:
> > our country is under
> > a special international watch on currency
> regulations.
> > There is no
> > possibilities to get another sum, only those
> written
> > in the contract.
> > Any financial changes in international agreements
> > automatically become
> > a subject of investigations of our tax police and
> bank
> > system, of
> > international financial watch. We may agree
> between us
> > about
> > reallocation of money from one line to other but
> have
> > no right to change a
> > whole sum. Is this clear?
> > About salaries. Yes, we agreed this point a half a
> > year ago. That's a
> > pity, you don't remember your decisions and don't
> want
> > to keep your
> > promisses.
> > I'm leaving for Sheshory 13th morning, so these
> > questions should be
> > solved during these two days. Remember: we need
> money
> > befor Ecotopia, not after
> > it!!!
> > 
> > Thanks a lot for your help,
> > Tamara
> > 
> > ******************************************
> > Charity Information Center "Green Dossier"
> > 
> > Tel/fax: 380 44 227 6277
> > POB 201, Kiev-25, Ukraine, 01025
> > E-mail: [email protected]
> > http://www.dossier.kiev.ua/
> > ******************************************
> > WE ALL BELONG TO THE EARTH
> > ******************************************
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > m> Dear Green Dossier,
> > 
> > m> we were a bit shocked this morning after
> reading
> > your e-mail 
> > m> because there must be some kind of
> > misunderstanding.
> > 
> > m> Your discussion about paying organisers is out
> of
> > the budget we 
> > m> agreed in our contract. In this contract, which
> we
> > both signed, 
> > m> there is no money for organisers salaries. The
> > budget includes 
> > m> money for logistics, travel reimbursement to
> the
> > venue and other 
> > m> costs related to Ecotopia but never the wages
> of
> > people working in
> > m> Green Dossier or Eyfa. As we ourselves are paid
> > from our own 
> > m> funds, you too should pay your people with your
> own
> > resources.
> > 
> > m> Furthemore, there is no more money in the
> budget to
> > be 
> > m> trasnsferred, so we don't know what you mean by
> > "the rest of the 
> > m> money".
> > 
> > m> We agreed on paying something to one person
> from
> > the national 
> > m> Park, because we consider it fair enough, as
> they
> > are providing us 
> > m> the venue and they will take care for many
> things.
> > 
> > m> Alexander bagin's salary is also something
> unclear
> > for us, which 
> > m> we need to discuss. Until now, we have not had
> much
> > 
> > m> communication with him and we have not received
> any
> > budget of 
> > m> costs from him. So we wonder what we should
> pay.
> > But in any 
> > m> case, this money would also be taken from
> Ecotopia
> > budget, not 
> > m> from Eyfa funds.
> > 
> > m> We would like to explain that in the history of
> > Eyfa-Ecotopia, the
> > m> host organisation has never received money for
> > their own 
> > m> employees, and that is something out of
> question.
> > 
> > m> So you may understand now our surprise when we
> > received your e-
> > m> mail stating finances matters that have never
> been
> > discussed nor 
> > m> mentioned. 
> > 
> > m> Please notice that we do not mean that you do
> not
> > deserve a 
> > m> salary for your work, which we appreciate a
> lot.
> > You have all the 
> > m> merit of this organisation but your salaries
> are
> > just not 
> > m> responsability of Ecotopia budget.
> > 
> > m> Best regards,
> > m> Eyfa Crew
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
=== message truncated ===

> ATTACHMENT part 3.3 message/rfc822 
> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2003 21:43:16 +0200 (CEST)
> From: <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>,
> <[email protected]>
> Subject: [Ecotopia2003] Anyone traveling from Kyiv
> 18 aug?
> 
> Ecotopians!
> 
> Are anyone of you going from Kyiv with train (bus?)
> to Ivano-Frankivsk on
> 18th of aug?? (probably the train at 18:03 o'clock)
> 
> I'm now visiting friends at the black sea. but I
> will go to ecotopia on
> 17-18th aug and will very much like company! On my
> way to (not-)find
> Ecotopia! :0)!
> 
> Please contact me on e-mail [email protected]
> 
> See ya all soon!
> best regards
>  MALIN
> ----
> Webaid stöder just nu ett gatubarnsarbete i St.
> Petersburg. 
> Besök gärna http://www.webaid.se och läs mer.
> 
> 
> 

> ATTACHMENT part 3.4 message/rfc822 
> From: "Arman Vermishyan" <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Ecotopia2003] Settling diffferences
> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2003 11:20:16 +0500
> 
> I'm agree with you.
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Víctor Guillamón" <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>;
> <[email protected]>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2003 4:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ecotopia2003] Settling diffferences
> 
> 
> > If it's an ongoing conflict between Eyfa and Green
> Dossier, what's about
> to
> > resolve it between Eyfa and Green Dossier???
> > I think you must have some ways to resolve this
> economic and personal
> > problems, not spreading it here. The first
> conflict resolution principle
> > it's to resolve it in the correct place. And
> salary problems are too
> > personal and delicate to spread to a list like
> this. I think this list
> it's
> > not the place were this kind of problems. If it's
> not so, please, take me
> > off the list. I'm not interesed in problems I can
> not solve, nor in
> > forwarded mails I have not information about
> context.
> >
> > On 12/8/03 12:52, "Jsvier Montellano"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi there!
> > >
> > > There is an ongoing conflict between EYFA and
> Green
> > > Dossier about some salaries for organizators
> which
> > > where not agreed upon beforehand.
> > >
> > > The conflict between Green Dossier and EYFA also
> > > states that "any difference will be solved by
> > > arbitration".
> > >
> > > Can there be space in Ecotopia for a conflict
> > > resolution exercise?
> > >
> > > (below you find the emails, the most recent
> first)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear EYFA people, dear Mariel!
> > > I understand you are not experienced in
> managment and
> > > financial issues. As well as in Ukrainian rules.
> > >
> > > The first thing I advice you to do - read the
> contract
> > > which we signed.
> > > (Do you have it?). Find, please, a point 4.1.
> about
> > > financing. It is
> > > very clear: the whole sum of the project 4493
> EUR
> > > should be transfered
> > > to Green Dossier after signing the contract. You
> > > transfered us 3000
> > > EUR, so, the rest of money is 1493 EUR. Is this
> clear?
> > > The second point which you should understand ad
> least:
> > > our country is under
> > > a special international watch on currency
> regulations.
> > > There is no
> > > possibilities to get another sum, only those
> written
> > > in the contract.
> > > Any financial changes in international
> agreements
> > > automatically become
> > > a subject of investigations of our tax police
> and bank
> > > system, of
> > > international financial watch. We may agree
> between us
> > > about
> > > reallocation of money from one line to other but
> have
> > > no right to change a
> > > whole sum. Is this clear?
> > > About salaries. Yes, we agreed this point a half
> a
> > > year ago. That's a
> > > pity, you don't remember your decisions and
> don't want
> > > to keep your
> > > promisses.
> > > I'm leaving for Sheshory 13th morning, so these
> > > questions should be
> > > solved during these two days. Remember: we need
> money
> > > befor Ecotopia, not after
> > > it!!!
> > >
> > > Thanks a lot for your help,
> > > Tamara
> > >
> > > ******************************************
> > > Charity Information Center "Green Dossier"
> > >
> > > Tel/fax: 380 44 227 6277
> > > POB 201, Kiev-25, Ukraine, 01025
> > > E-mail: [email protected]
> > > http://www.dossier.kiev.ua/
> > > ******************************************
> > > WE ALL BELONG TO THE EARTH
> > > ******************************************
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > m> Dear Green Dossier,
> > >
> > > m> we were a bit shocked this morning after
> reading
> > > your e-mail
> > > m> because there must be some kind of
> > > misunderstanding.
> > >
> > > m> Your discussion about paying organisers is
> out of
> > > the budget we
> > > m> agreed in our contract. In this contract,
> which we
> > > both signed,
> > > m> there is no money for organisers salaries.
> The
> > > budget includes
> > > m> money for logistics, travel reimbursement to
> the
> > > venue and other
> > > m> costs related to Ecotopia but never the wages
> of
> > > people working in
> > > m> Green Dossier or Eyfa. As we ourselves are
> paid
> > > from our own
> > > m> funds, you too should pay your people with
> your own
> > > resources.
> > >
> > > m> Furthemore, there is no more money in the
> budget to
> > > be
> > > m> trasnsferred, so we don't know what you mean
> by
> > > "the rest of the
> > > m> money".
> > >
> > > m> We agreed on paying something to one person
> from
> > > the national
> > > m> Park, because we consider it fair enough, as
> they
> > > are providing us
> > > m> the venue and they will take care for many
> things.
> > >
> > > m> Alexander bagin's salary is also something
> unclear
> > > for us, which
> > > m> we need to discuss. Until now, we have not
> had much
> > >
> > > m> communication with him and we have not
> received any
> > > budget of
> > > m> costs from him. So we wonder what we should
> pay.
> > > But in any
> > > m> case, this money would also be taken from
> Ecotopia
> > > budget, not
> > > m> from Eyfa funds.
> > >
> > > m> We would like to explain that in the history
> of
> > > Eyfa-Ecotopia, the
> > > m> host organisation has never received money
> for
> > > their own
> > > m> employees, and that is something out of
> question.
> > >
> > > m> So you may understand now our surprise when
> we
> > > received your e-
> > > m> mail stating finances matters that have never
> been
> 
=== message truncated ===>
_______________________________________________
> Ecotopia2003 mailing list
> [email protected]
>
https://aseed.antenna.nl/mailman/listinfo/ecotopia2003
> 
> 


=====
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