Re: [ox-en] No more money trickery propaganda please

>
> Regarding the views of Genevieve, it doesn't seem to me that they understand
> the non-reciprocal nature of free software, and rather subsume everything to
> the gift economy. I have the feeling their views are very binary, gift
> economy = female = good; exchange = male = bad ...
>

Bring on the conscious  hybrid combinatorial systems!

a

> Michel
> On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 3:41 AM, Franz Nahrada <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Very strong expression, Stefan, and I wonder if your view is really shared
>> by many in this list. I for my part could live with a peaceful agreement
>> to accept that some people in here think that monetary patterns are an
>> important part of peer production why others dont. There is a fundamental
>> division in interest, and we have to deal with it. But not in denying each
>> other respect, I really hate this tone.
>>
>> I myself had just one hour ago a very moving conversation with Genevieve
>> Vaughan here in Vienna and it was really interesting to talk to this lady
>> about the logic of gift versus the logic of market. I understood now much
>> better that we are on the track of something substantial here, which goes
>> far beyond our understanding of what usually is talked about as gift
>> economy so far. I presented Oekonux to her and said we are not really that
>> fond of the idea of mothering or maternal heritage as paradigm or the
>> traditional indigenous cultures with their giving celebrations. as a role
>> model for a future society.
>>
>> But, in fact, she said that the issue is much much deeper than that, the
>> market relation being simply not only a product of scarcity but also a
>> very primordial creator of scarcity. Free economy and (equivalent)
>> exchange economy are opposed in principle, and an economy based on
>> unilateral action is by far more productive than a monetary or
>> equivalent-exchange economy.
>>
>> In a market relation, the exchange terminates the positive interest of
>> both parties in the material effect of their production; whilst in the
>> "unilateral action" economy, the transfer of "value" from one person to
>> the other creates a "syllogism" of its own, a self multiplying structure
>> of enabling and empowerment. If we bring it to this abstract level, we
>> could find the parallel between the gift economy and the
>> selbstentfaltung-structure that the Stefans try to explain.
>>
>> There is focus on enacting social relation, a positive interest in the
>> unfolding of the party that I support and a transitive relation. If I (A)
>> do something for B, then B does something for C, it really is "A->C".
>>
>> Genevieve thinks that we have to to reject the whole theoretical construct
>> that the world of Free Software is an issue of reputation economy ( a
>> hiiden exchange of effort versus attention or reputation). Actually it was
>> the first time I heard a feminist theorist talk positively about the Logic
>> of Free Software. She said that the Logic of Free Software corrsponded
>> with the gift logic in a very abstract way, by simply enacting "empowering
>> transitive unilateral social acts".
>>
>> She also critizised a lot of linguistic theories from Chomsky to
>> Wittgenstein and Umberto Eco, for disregarding the very basic nature of
>> language. "While Chomsky thinks language is coming from somewhere deepla
>> inside the brain, Eco thinks its simply a tool for lying". In fact she
>> said, language is the archetype of a gift economy. "We dont loose words if
>> we give them away. We keep them alive and refine them that way. That is
>> the root of linguistic creativity and not any generative apparatus deep
>> inside. Thus language is the lead paradigm of a gift economy".
>>
>> I googled and found she had written about that subject, maybe for deeper
>> reading one could turn to this:
>> http://www.gift-economy.com/articlesAndEssays/languageAsGift.html
>>
>> So with all this in mind, maybe we really can fork here and declare that
>> the Oekonux list is somewhat dedicated to the functioning of an economy
>> based on unilateral transitive productions of common informational or
>> information-based infrastructures and their effects on the economy as a
>> whole. I can understand Stefans frustration about the list filling up with
>> more and more sophisticated exchange-based schemes and totally loosing
>> focus. But that does not dequalify the question of experimenting with
>> alternative monetary exchange schemes at all; they must also be tried out.
>> We must allow for different patterns to be tested in reality, and we must
>> not engage in meaningless wars of belief.
>>
>> Franz
>>
>> _________________________________
>> Web-Site: http://www.oekonux.org/
>> Organization: http://www.oekonux.de/projekt/
>> Contact: [email protected]
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Working at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhurakij_Pundit_University -
> http://www.dpu.ac.th/dpuic/info/Research.html -
> http://www.asianforesightinstitute.org/index.php/eng/The-AFI
>
> Volunteering at the P2P Foundation:
> http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net -
> http://p2pfoundation.ning.com
>
> Monitor updates at http://del.icio.us/mbauwens
>
> The work of the P2P Foundation is supported by SHIFTN,
> http://www.shiftn.com/
>
>
> [2 text/html]
> _________________________________
> Web-Site: http://www.oekonux.org/
> Organization: http://www.oekonux.de/projekt/
> Contact: [email protected]
>



-- 
Alex
I cannot teach anybody anything, I can only make them think.- Socrates
_________________________________
Web-Site: http://www.oekonux.org/
Organization: http://www.oekonux.de/projekt/
Contact: [email protected]