Re: Islamic criticism

>On Thu, Nov 25, 2012 at 18:45 AM, Rami Rustom  wrote:

>>On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 5:00 AM, Ismail Atalay <i_c_atalay-/[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>Islam aimed to rectify this horrible situation and has had some level success. But over time, old culture and political practices (arabic and 
>>mesopotamian) resurrected more and more and found ways to twist and to deteriorate Islam via manufactured hadith and misinterpretations of 
>>Quran. A very clear proof of this is the current state of affairs in non-Arabic or non-mesopotamian Islamic countries like Turkey, Malaysia, 
>>Bosnia etc. The reason this countries are better of (in terms of democracy, human rights etc)  is that they can easily differentiate what is coming 
>>from real Islam (like peace, love, justice, human rights) and what is coming from the cultural traditions and sociopolitic dynamics of middle-
>>east.

>Are you sure they are able to differentiate what is coming from "real"
>Islam vs what is coming from cultural traditions and sociopolitical
>dynamics of middle-east?

>http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/11/modern-moderate-malaysia-islamic-court-allows-marriage-of-12-year-old-girl.html

> Modern, moderate Malaysia: Islamic court allows marriage of 12-year-old girl

>http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/10/modern-moderate-secular-turkey-pianist-goes-on-trial-for-offending-muslims-and-insulting->islam.html

> Modern, moderate, secular Turkey: Pianist goes on trial for offending Muslims and insulting Islam


I have said they are "better". I did not say they (Malaysia and Turkey) are perfect or even near-perfect implementations of Islam._,_.___

The issue you have raised for Malaysia has a lot to do with conservatism and patriarchal thinking as the article clearly shows. These two diseases have unfortunately made a lot of progress in embedding themselves to Islam.

The second issue in Turkey is more political in nature. Nothing will come up from it as there is nothing particularly insulting and demonizing in what he has spread in social media. (the pianist in this news is an internationally renowned figure that is very critical of current government and conservative thinking)

Implementing Islamic principles in personal/social life looks very easy but yet seems difficult for human-beings (including myself). It requires %100 sincerity, good-will with well-suppressed ego and rational thinking (without sincerity and goodwill everything will collapse, there will not be Islam). You have to be fair towards everyone even if you completely disagree. All (yes literally all) public decisions affecting your life should have your explicit consent (right of subject rule). Ruthless self-interrogation and self-suspect is a must against the strife (essential jihad, physical and spiritual not converted to "spiritual only" by christian clergy) towards the "self" (without belittling or torturing the "self" as in some radical Christian theology). There should not be poor, desolated, suppressed or lonely people in the society (also related with jihad). 

So your "jihadwatch" list should have normally followed what type of positive moral/social contributions muslims are doing as part of their primary strife duty :) Instead, it follows authoritarian/manipulative decision makers hiding their agenda behind perverted Islam. And this type of thinking unfortunately play to their hands by insisting to misunderstand and to skew Islamic concepts. (wrong and biased perception of Islam in west contributes to strengthen their status). 

I am not a type of guy who favors conspiracies but I would not be surprised to learn that thes type of websites are secretly sponsored by some middleeastern regimes.

Ismail