Re: schema.org

I wonder if Topic Maps doesn't suffer from a business analysis 
problem. It seems that "better" should at some point translate into 
significant savings of time/money.  Can you identify a business model 
based directly on appealing to those who will save time/money by 
using Topic Maps?
Bob

At 11:29 AM +1000 6/7/11, Alexander Johannesen wrote:
>Hiya,
>
>On Tue, Jun 7, 2011 at 9:58 AM, Patrick Durusau <patrick-Q/[email protected]> wrote:
>>  The Semantic Web has gone from intelligent agents wandering the
>>  semanticsphere to simply linking data which may or may not be consistent,
>>  useful or documented. According to some linked data advocates, we sort all
>>  that out after it is all linked together. If that is your idea of 
>>a winning strategy,
>>  then we may have different opinions about what it means to win.
>
>It *is* a winning strategy even if both you and I think it sucks
>balls, they're still winning even if they'll be worse off in the
>future (when they do try to sort it all out). I don't think for a
>second our definition of "winning" are different, but I think the
>difference is that I refuse to call this struggle "winning." We're not
>winning, and I think it's easy to read from my post the notion that I
>think we're outright losing. But yes, not losing from a technology
>perspective, but from a use and embrace perspective.
>
>>  I think most of our problems have been self-inflicted.
>>  In part by advocating a model rather than results.
>>  I am as guilty as anyone in that regard.
>
>Me too, I'm afraid. Back in my days I thought the data model argument
>was a slam dunk for database geeks all over, up and down the
>technology stack, but apparently there's something eerily comforting
>about those tables and rows. Again I think the distance between the
>actuality of tables and rows, and the abstract conceptual thinking
>behind "tables and rows" are simply too great for people to grok and
>care about.
>
>>  Topic maps could start winning by delivering a useful result that allows the
>>  user of a topic map based search to be more informed than users of other
>>  systems.
>
>Not sure what that even means these days. Beating Google at search
>seems like an insurmountable task, especially with a rigid tool like
>Topic Maps where Google's strength lies within the chaotic nature of
>language and semantics, and how to suck meaning from that. I'm not
>sure that TM is even capable of adding much to the field of search,
>and I'm sure that's somewhat of an insulting statement right there :)
>but I just don't see it. Semantic searching is great for rigid and
>highly structured data, but the state of most datasets kills that
>dream. I don't think TM is the problem in itself, it's more that the
>reality of data management gets in the way of doing it well. But
>that's kinda off-topic, I'd admit.
>
>>  But the user in the topic map case need know nothing of topics, associations
>>  and occurrences. What they need to know is that a particular solution is
>>  delivering the information they need faster and more accurately than
>>  another.
>
>But then the problem is just that; if Google deliver results that we
>can't match, why go with us? How does TM add anything to the current
>state of search? Hooks to subjects, yeah, yeah, we know that one, but
>even that is not as simple as it sounds. What subject? We don't have a
>solution to semantic mismatch as you well know, even though that would
>make a killer app, I don't see why Topic Maps could do that any better
>than any other technology.
>
>Isn't that the problem, though? Topic Maps is food for geeks, but if
>we can't convince the geeks, then what's the point of Topic Maps?
>
>>  We have to remember that none of the software architecture, language, model,
>>  etc., issues are religious issues for users. And it is a mistake to try to
>>  educate users or convince them of one way or the other on such issues.
>
>You keep going on about "users", and as much as I hear your argument
>and kinda agree with it, we're ultimately talking about Topic Maps. If
>the user don't care about Topic Maps but only the results, then why
>should anyone care about Topic Maps? The answer; it's a better tool to
>deal with a whole bunch of stuff, but somehow geeks through the world
>do not agree with us for some reason.
>
>>  What constructive steps would you suggest?
>
>At this point, none. Me and a lot of others here have done it all,
>from presentations, demos, hacks, articles, debates, online
>discussions, applications, you name it. But there seems to be
>something about the TM paradigm that just don't appeal to most geeks.
>It could be the times, it could be the premise, it could be the
>effort, the mental capacity of people, we didn't have a larger backer,
>some company embrace, the right people, a whole number of things.
>
>Don't read this as "give up", I'm just tired of it all. For me Topic
>Maps don't bring any better results to most of the work out there
>available. (Unless you live in Oslo, Norway ... there's a disturbance
>on the time-space continuum there for some reason) People like the
>sound of it, for sure. And a minuscule bunch of enthusiasts make sure
>there's still a few apps and portals around to bear its name, but the
>fervent glory of the early days are gone, lost in a struggle for doing
>the right thing in a world which prefers things done normative.
>
>
>Regards,
>
>Alex
>--
>  Project Wrangler, SOA, Information Alchemist, UX, RESTafarian, Topic Maps
>--- http://shelter.nu/blog/ ----------------------------------------------
>------------------ http://www.google.com/profiles/alexander.johannesen ---
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