Re: A credit/debit card reader for the home ??

Hi Bill,

A card reader only provides the illusion of security.

Look at it this way.  You want a card that holds its own balance on it,
secure from theft and the like.

However, such a card is *more* susceptible to theft, in another way.  If
someone steals it, they can empty it without worry, if it is not tied
into a central authentication system.

Right now, our debit and credit cards are all centrally authenticated.
So, if someone steals it, you can cancel it.

I'd say, do away with the card reader.  First, it's an extra expense, and
you'd have problems with software and drivers. 

Then, go ahead with your plan!  There is no reason you can't be given two
cards whenever you sign up for a bank account.  One you can restrict, and
an 'unlimited' card.

The restricted card can be loaded, by you visiting your bank via online
banking.  Essentially, your card uses one account, and one account only.
It's also a Visa or Mastercard.  Its limit is what you set, by
transferring money into that account... or removing money from that
account.

I believe US bankers already can do such, with a debit credit card.

Really, though, I think people simply don't care enough to see this
move.  Paypal and the like, protect you by acting as an intermediary
online.  Paypal even has debit cards now.

Your bank could do the same as paypal, you're right.  They've started with
Debit Online.  In such a case, they protect all your credentials... and
it is much like an email money transfer.

As for the rest?  Sure, it could be done now.  I'd say, lobby the banks!
They'd have to use Visa or Mastercard in order to take advantage of their
sales network though.  Perhaps this is why they are reluctant, and are
pushing Interac Online.




On Wed, 23 Sep 2009 12:46:29 -0400
William Case <[email protected]> wrote:

> Hi;
> 
> On Wed, 2009-09-23 at 11:42 -0400, Brad Barnett wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > Security is indeed the problem.
> > 
> > However, this is a method that is workable, for now.
> > 
> > I know that several supermarkets in the area sell Visa cards with $100
> > pre-loaded onto them.  As far as I know, you can also top these cards
> > up, or add additional currency to them.
> > 
> > So, you are at least protected to a certain extent, this way...
> > 
> > 
> 
> Yes.  And, buying pre-loaded Visa cards would make it safer on the
> Internet.  However, my suggestion was in search of security and
> *convenience*.  I could just as easily open a new account at a Bank I
> don't now use and make email transfers up to $1,000.  Places like Tim
> Horton's have rudimentary cash cards that record a cash balance, paid in
> cash, which tabulates a running balance until reaching $0, that you then
> use at Tim's.
> 
> I can currently purchase online, do my banking online, email inter-bank
> amounts.  ATM machines allow me to do almost all of the common financial
> transactions I might want.
> 
> It seems to me, all the bits and pieces including security are already
> available to make my suggestion work.  All you need is a home card
> reader.  Keeping such a thing off the market won't prevent the crooks
> from reading stolen cards.  They can do that already.
> 
> None of the existing safety checks have to be removed.  It just means
> that the identity and transaction signals are coming from an
> identifiable source other than an ATM.
> 
> The user would have the security of knowing that they are carrying
> around and using a card and an identity they can 'afford' to lose, while
> credit and debit cards can be kept in a much safer place until needed.
> 
> By using a 'cash' card and credit/debit card in conjunction with each
> other a thief has to get hold of both.  By just keeping the cards
> separately, say, the 'cash card' in a wallet and your credit and debit
> cards in a purse, at home, with a spouse etc. etc. theft of banking info
> becomes much harder.
> 
> > 
> > On Wed, 23 Sep 2009 11:00:44 -0400
> > William Case <[email protected]> wrote:
> > 
> > > Hi;
> > > 
> > > Just had a thought!  But it has probably been thought before.
> > > 
> > > I was about to buy a magazine article from Scientific American.
> > > They wanted $7.95 which I was willing to pay.  Of course when I
> > > clicked on the appropriate screen button to purchase it, they
> > > wanted credit card info.  I have used my Visa to purchase online
> > > before but I am always very reluctant to do so.  In this case I
> > > cancelled my purchase.
> > > 
> > > What I think would work for me is having a personal card reader
> > > attached to my computer.  If I wanted to make an online purchase,
> > > the communication of account numbers and passwords would be
> > > directly between me and my bank with only the purchase amount and
> > > name and some kind of purchased item ID being transferred to the
> > > vendor by my bank.
> > > 
> > > Similarly, I could then use a 'cash' card.  A cash card would be a
> > > swipe-able card to which I could transfer an amount from a bank
> > > account from home using my home card reader, debit/credit card and
> > > the cash card.  While I am out at a restaurant, bar, store etc.,
> > > any vendor would have access only to the amount of money registered
> > > on the cash card and would deduct the amount spent from the cash
> > > card total.  If the cash card were lost or stolen, only the
> > > remaining amount on the cash card, plus the cash card passwords
> > > would be at risk.  I would have to keep topping up the amount on
> > > the cash card, but I could do that safely from home.
> > > 
> > > Of course, I don't understand all the security problems this might
> > > introduce, but on the surface, it would make me feel as if I was in
> > > more control of my money and transaction security.
> > > 
> > > I would really like to see any thoughts, criticisms or comments
> > > anyone might have.
> 
> -- 
> Regards Bill
> Fedora 11, Gnome 2.26.3
> Evo.2.26.3, Emacs 23.1.1
> 
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