Re: [SMARTY-DEV] smarty custom functions namespaces

Fair enough -- but when PHP was still a template language, I think that
the idea was that business-logic was going to be implemented in a
lower-level language like C and plugged into the runtime as a module.
So the language didn't need fancy features under that model. For
certain environments I'm sure that is still a good choice. Yet for
many, that is a tough development proposition. Luckily, PHP (which I'm
sure you agree is not a 1st class GP language) is more or less suitable
for implementing many sorts of business logic and it boasts a
development cycle somewhat less cumbersome -- and more accessible --
than developing PHP modules in a lower-level language.

So PHP "evolved" and moved up the food-chain and in doing so, helped a
lot of people. Yet at the same time, it is now more complicated than a
pure template solution needs to be. While I agree that without
dilligence Smarty can feature creep into pointlessness, I suggest it
probably won't because there isn't the same pressure driving it to do
so. Smarty is addressing the space that PHP vacated.

I think a more interesting question is whether PHP can survive in the
space it moved into. There are a lot of languages with longer
credentials that live at that layer. Besides, PHP isn't all chocolate
and sunshine...it too has ugly warts.

Anyways, it probably doesn't matter -- it will all be Lisp one day. Or
perhaps XLisp once the W3C gets involved.

Best regards.

--- Andrei Zmievski <[email protected]> wrote:

> Ah, but there is a subtle albeit crucial difference. PHP started out 
> as a template language and evolved into a general purpose scripting  
> one. And once you are at the "general-purpose" level, you can no  
> longer contain the explosion of possibilities. Smarty may end on the 
> same route.
> 
> -Andrei
> 
> 
> On Jul 21, 2005, at 10:56 AM, boots wrote:
> 
> > --- Andrei Zmievski <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> Yes, and that's what scares me about Smarty.
> >>
> >> -Andrei
> >>
> >
> > Hi Andrei. I was kidding, you know....but I'm only half-kidding
> when I
> > ask what your take is on the famous principle that every language
> > eventually evolves into Lisp? More seriously, it is good to fight
> the
> > feature creep but things like namespaces really have nothing
> > exclusively to do with PHP or Rasmus' hypothesis.
> >
> > I think your comment is insightful in that it highlights a critical
> > point: some people misuse Smarty and try to build business-logic  
> > with a
> > "template" language. It is reminiscent of how some people misuse
> PHP
> > and try to build desktop applications with a "web" languange --  
> > despite
> > Rasmus' objections to such.
> >
> >
> >
> >> On Jul 21, 2005, at 9:30 AM, boots wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> You know full well that PHP does not have namespaces :)
> >>>
> >>> --- Andrei Zmievski <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Do you people realize that you are proving Rasmus's theorem with
> >>>> every such thing? I am speaking of "Every template language
> >>>>
> >> evolves
> >>
> >>>> until it turns into PHP".
> >>>>
> >>>> -Andrei
> >>>>
> >>>> On Jul 21, 2005, at 3:19 AM, Michael Davey wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> Hi,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I've added a crude form of namespaces to my private copy of
> >>>>>
> >> Smarty.
> >>
> >>>>> A template function like:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> {namespace:test}
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ...causes the test() function in the smarty_function_namespace
> >>>>> class to be called.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I'm planning to use this feature in TikiWiki to provide
> >>>>> accessor-like template functions to access various data:
> >>>>> article::title, article::description and so on.  I though that
> >>>>>
> >> this
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>> might be of more general use, so here is a patch for this
> >>>>>
> >> morning's
> >>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>> CVS snapshot of Smarty.
> >>>>>
> >
> >
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