Re: [PHP4BETA] Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [PHP4BETA] PHP 4.0.0 Release packaged

Hello Christian,

On 21-May-00 19:50:14, you wrote:

>> Picture this situation some time soon in a IT department next to you:
>>
>> Joe Webby, a paid Web developer rushes into his boss office:
>[...]

>In my opinion, Joe has the IQ of a handful of beer nuts, but that's a

I know, but you'd be surprised by how many Joe Webby's you will find doing
Web development these days!  :-)


>different story. Here's another story: I introduced PHP in a company I work
>for around one year ago. Today, the company uses PHP for several different
>projects, and prefers it over ASP and Perl. However PHP was almost banned,
>as on the first project we had to access a Database via ODBC, since that was
>really poorly documented. "Arrogance towards Windows users" was one of the
>nicer terms I encountered from colleagues scanning the documentation. The

Thanks for your testemony.  From the response I was getting here, it sounded
like I was bringing up irrelevant problems with PHP acceptance that didn't
matter to address.


>problem was solved quite quickly after posting to the mailing list, but the
>scepticism remained. Another project refused to continue working after
>upgrading from 3.0.x to 3.0.y (I think that was around 3.0.12). The reason:
>the infamous mail()-bug; if you omit the last, optional parameter for
>mail(), mail() will not work on Win32 any longer. Thank god I very quickly
>found the problem (and the solution) in the PHP online bug system, but it is
>still not fixed in 3.0.16, and not documented.

Yes, I have been through that several times.  You report a bug, but no
developer likes the face of the report or yours, the report will hang on
the database for a very long time.  You can't complain because you are
relying on good will, but if you bother to remind that there is a
outstanding bug there, you are accused of demanding fixes.

Maybe it is a problem with my English, because I am perfectly aware that
people that work on good will can't be obligated to do anything, so I just
ask and remind.


>functions is properly documented. As I said - I am already convinced of PHP,
>but in order to reach more people, there's a lot to do, and there were
>already some good ideas in another thread (keyword: marketing :-) ). So what

In which list? I haven't found that thread anywhere.


>I want to say is - I have to support some of Manuel's points, even if I know
>that it will be painful (and maybe even not possible in the next few months)
>to implement them.

Right.


>What really saddens me however is the reaction on the list. If Manuel tries
>to point out what could hinder PHP from conquering the world, please don't
>blame him for that. I know a lot of people that associate with PHP a certain
>kind of arrogance of the supporters. Most of those people are Windows users,
>so they are used to suffering with their OS :-) However I agree with them on
>some point. The reaction to criticism may be justified (hey, if I was one of
>the core people behind PHP, I'd kill everybody who'd say just one word
>against it), but from a marketing point of view, it's sub-optimal. I think

If you only half of the people that contests my message would reckon that,
I would be happier and wouldn't feel that I have been talking to the walls.
Anyway, I sense some progress. You know what, this is happening to me again,
but while I present my justified criticisms and improvement suggestions, I
get a lot of personal mail of people that understand the importance what I
am saying and offer their support.


>everybody here respects the endless, unpaid hours of work that were put into
>PHP and into php.net, but if there's no bug-free software, there's also no
>error-free concept, and (constructive) suggestions to amend that should be
>given a forum and should be discussed without bias.

Right.  Too bad that some people don't value constructive criticism.  In
the real world people are paid to judge and criticise.  Many of those are
called consultants. I guess I get some hostile feedback to my criticisms
because I am not charging for it. Maybe I should. :-)


Regards,
Manuel Lemos

Web Programming Components using PHP Classes.
Look at: http://phpclasses.UpperDesign.com/[email protected]
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