Re: IMA and PQC

On Thu, Feb 26, 2026 at 12:22:32PM -0500, Stefan Berger wrote:
> > I see that IMA indeed never upgraded full file hashes to use
> > 'struct ima_file_id'.  Building a new feature that relies on this seems
> > like a bad idea though, given that it's a security bug that makes the> IMA
> protocol cryptographically ambiguous.  I.e., it means that in IMA,
> > when the contents of some file are signed, that signature is sometimes
> > also valid for some other file contents which the signer didn't intend.
> 
> You mean IMA should not sign the digest in the ima_file_id structure but
> hash the ima_file_id structure in which this file digest is written into
> (that we currently sign) and sign/verify this digest? And we would do this
> to avoid two different files (with presumably different content) from having
> the same hashes leading to the same signature? Which hashes (besides the
> non-recommended ones) are so weak now that you must not merely sign a file's
> hash?
> 
> The problem with this is that older kernels (without patching) won't be able
> to handle newer signatures.

IMA needs to sign the entire ima_file_id structure, which is indeed what
IMA already does when it uses that structure.  (Well, actually it signs
a hash of the struct, but that's best thought of an implementation
detail of legacy signature algorithms that can only sign hashes.  For a
modern algorithm the whole struct should be passed instead.)  Just IMA
uses that structure only for fsverity hashes, which is a bug that makes
the IMA protocol ambiguous.  It needs to use ima_file_id consistently,
otherwise a signed message sometimes corresponds to multiple unique file
contents even without a break in the cryptographic hash function.

Sure, when that bug is fixed, old kernels won't support the new
signatures for files that use a full-file hash.  But the same applies to
starting to use a new signature algorithm, such as ML-DSA.

- Eric