Re: Re: about your concept

On Thu, Jul 22, 2004 at 12:27:14PM +0100, Andrew Suffield wrote:
> Now you're back to the "You people must help me build something that
> you don't want" idea.

Not quite. Discussing is not quite the same as writing code. It is also
not the same as asking people to write code for you.


> That's not how it works. If *you* want
> something, then *you* must do the work.

Of course. It is still good to bounce ideas off like-minded and
-interested people before writing lots of code that may not even work in
theory. Which is why a discussion list is useful. Which, in turn, is why
being rude on it is not helping anybody except with getting frustrated.


> You cannot expect anybody else
> to do it for you, especially when they can see out of hand why it's a
> dumb idea.

If they can see that out of hand they can also explain it out of hand.
That'd be useful, and welcomed. Calling people names does not quite
convey as much useful information.


> > So you're saying that Y-devel is not a list for what you consider the
> > clueful but more of what you think of as a courtesy to people you don't
> > really deem worthy to talk with. Something like a pacifier for the
> > wannabees to be ignored.
> 
> You said that. And you pulled it out of thin air, it appears apropos
> of nothing.

If ``it all but was literally in your last post'' is your definition of
``out of thin air'', then yes. The odd hyperbole is inconsequential to
the point I tried to drive home.


> > Glad to clear that up then. I'd encourage you to put your money where
> > your mouth is and indeed do just that. But as some others on the list
> > have assured me, you should be a quite clueful and capable coder. I'm
> > sure there's many a person eager to learn and improve with help from
> > a master. Calling them insane or other names doesn't really help them
> > getting clued in.
> 
> You're not going to get it.

Well, you're not going to tell anyone why you think or know something is
not a good idea just because of spite to one person, that'd be just sad.

It is just amazing how you can disappoint people that express interest
by telling them they're pigshit. Even, or maybe especially, if they
already know and are trying to actively do something about it. It'd be
only courteous to point them in the right direction. At least it'd beat
farting in their general direction and refusing to say what way the
right direction would be. To you it may be obvious, apparently it is
not to others. It'd be useful and social to spread that knowledge.

A lot of answering can be covered by FAQs and such, but those things tend
to get written along the way. As we're trying to go a rather untrodden
path there isn't much yet written. So material is needed. Answers on
mailinglists are great material for someone to pick up and condense into
a FAQ or technical primer, but I don't count profanity as answer.


> > > Mark's project report (which is *not* a thesis;
> > 
> > Someone called it that and it stuck.
> 
> Just because people act like sheep does not make them right.

A sheep is a sheep by any other name. That some are easily deluded by
details and get all warm and fuzzy when they're now called ``four-legged
woolly mammals'' is something frequently exploited by marketing and
politicians. A different name doesn't change the nature of the beast,
though.

I took whatever name was at hand for the thing and got the point across.
Despite you not liking the name used. You seem to have missed ample
opportunity to explain people the wrongness of their ways, until now.

I'm open to suggestions for a new and improved name for what is, if not
design document, at least great marketing material for the Y project.
Any takers?


-- 
  j p d (at) d s b (dot) t u d e l f t (dot) n l .