Re: Releases in three months?

A Quarta, 10 de Julho de 2013 09:56:24 Anne Wilson escreveu:
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> On 09/07/13 20:54, Nuno Pinheiro wrote:
> > A Terça, 9 de Julho de 2013 20:54:00 Ingo Klöcker escreveu:
> >> On Tuesday 09 July 2013 12:42:43 Nuno Pinheiro wrote:
> >>> A Terça, 9 de Julho de 2013 13:07:02 Àlex Fiestas escreveu:
> >>>> On Tuesday 09 July 2013 06:12:03 Carl Symons wrote:
> >>>>> On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 7:38 PM, Àlex Fiestas
> >>>>> <[email protected]>
> >> 
> >> wrote:
> >>>>>> Hi there, how is the promo team doing?
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> Today I've sent a proposal to kde-core-devel about
> >>>>>> making a release every 3 months. While developers discuss
> >>>>>> on that list whether it works for them or not I'd like to
> >>>>>> ask you separately your PoV on the matter.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> Without commenting on what Lydia, Jos and Nuno have
> >>>>> written...
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> Why? What is the reasoning behind a 3 month release cycle?
> >>>>> What advantages does it bring to KDE, KDE users,
> >>>>> downstream folks?
> >>>> 
> >>>> You have information there:
> >>>> http://community.kde.org/KDE_Core/ReleasesProposal
> >>>> 
> >>>> Mostly, be more agile, release ready features faster, etc.
> >>>> 
> >>>> Promo wise,. we have to compete with the Web these days, the
> >>>> Web can make releases everyday and they are automatically
> >>>> delivered to the end user. Applications on phones do the
> >>>> same. We should follow.
> >>> 
> >>> I dont agree with those points. Some one on the other side
> >>> comented on firefox.. and personly the new way they release
> >>> the thing I dont like it much, they went from to far apart to,
> >>> "I dont care any more"
> >>> 
> >>> I still see value on bulding up a desire for the new thing,
> >>> building up hype around it, aka  "im working on this amazing
> >>> feature for the upcoming foo" and making people having to wayt
> >>> for it hads value to it. having to wayt for somthing values
> >>> the thing... intsnt gratification does not take you very far.
> >>> the key is how much is to long ??? I personaly think that 9/8
> >>> months would be perfect from that POV. and that 6 months is
> >>> alarady to fast,.
> >> 
> >> Have you ever worked with an agile development process where you
> >> make a small release every other week and then get feedback from
> >> your customer or your users so that you can improve the features
> >> in the next iteration? If you haven't then you might not be able
> >> to get what's so great about fast release cycles.
> >> 
> >> FWIW, the team I work with currently has a release cycle of one
> >> week. Obviously, those releases are no huge feature releases
> >> that bring tons of new features. No, every release brings just a
> >> few new features and/or improves a few existing features.
> >> 
> >> I, personally, don't buy your "we need slow release cycles so
> >> that we can build up a hype". IMHO this is nonsense because
> >> almost each hype is followed by disillusionment or even
> >> disappointment. Hypes never live up to the expectations of the
> >> users.
> >> 
> >> I'm a friend of being modest in what we promise so that we can
> >> surprise and delight our users with what we deliver.
> >> 
> >> I'll close with a citation from Eric S. Raymond "The Cathedral
> >> and the Bazaar": Release early. Release often. And listen to
> >> your customers.
> >> 
> >> (http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/cathedral-bazaar/ar01
> >> s04
> .html)
> 
> > Im a rooling distro guy, and try to use bleding edge.. but i
> > remember wen i was not and how exyted I got close to a major relese
> > wen i was just a mere user, How upset I got at my distro wen thye
> > made me wayt longuer than I had 2... All this contrubuted to the
> > experience .
> > 
> > if we fine grain the releses to nothing then it just becomes part
> > of the scenery, thare is nothing to get exyted about. Agile
> > development process, is grat for a certain tpe of users or
> > client... but for the general consumer and media, closure is
> > important, new* and improved* as well, sure we dont "buy into that"
> > , but most people do.
> 
> - From the general user perspective I have to dispute some of this.  You
> have only to look at forums and mailing lists to see how often hype
> tells users that all will be well in the next release.  The next
> release comes, and what they were promised is only half fulfilled.
> The result is disappointment and often anger.
> 
now imagine if we dont even do that... Dont under extimate Hope, "in next 
relese it will be fixed/improved/foo" is beter than "oo we dont know wen its 
gona bve fixed maybe in 3 months maybe in 6 maybe never"


Any way, I think that from a media and general awareness prespective having 
big releases is important "its news"  if we continualy have releses then its 
no longuer "news" a bit like no one cares about a new relese of firefox now!
I think there is  clear midle grownd here were we can have big releses and 
small releases. (the destinction beeing that they are only difrent from a 
media comunication POV) new artwork buiguer releseanouncment more hype. 

> What the average user wants is not huge feature changes, but small
> steady improvements that make their experience more pleasant.  You've
> only to look at how long people will stay with a particular Windows
> version to appreciate how great stability is in their minds.  They
> don't see, and don't want to see, the 'behind-the-scenes' changes,
> just what impacts on their usage.

Ok that depends alot on the user, and what is our traget user?
AFIK our traget user is early adopters. 

Any again I think thre is a very interesting midle ground here that can make 
everybody happy, 

> I've no opinion on whether this proposal would take us nearer or
> further away from user goals - it's clearly something that needs a
> good deal of debate.
> 
> Anne
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