Re: KDE Neon and how to handle this?

No, it does not upset me. It just confirm that you do not want to help
anyone but yourself. You have already bumped your readership by spreading
doubts instead of informing. That's pretty clear to anyone that have read
your article. Users are not dumb, they know what you are doing.

Lamarque V. Souza
On Feb 11, 2016 23:46, "Bryan Lunduke" <[email protected]> wrote:

> The KDE board itself describes Neon as a distro.  That's already been
> talked about in this thread.  So... no.  You're absolutely wrong.  The
> article is demonstrably right there based on the statements from your
> own board.  Saying it is "not a distro" also doesn't pass the sniff
> test.
>
> Also the original KDE Neon Faq explicitly stated that Ubuntu is a
> technologically superior distro.  This has since been updated
> (slightly) to be the opinion of the "KDE Neon" team.
>
> Again.  You are wrong.  The article is accurate.  I understand this
> may upset you... but it's the reality.  Now focus on how best to
> present your community to the rest of the world and I will work with
> you to help you do that.
>
> -Bryan
>
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 5:24 PM, Lamarque Souza <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Hi Bryan,
> >
> > In the first sentence of your article you wrote 'KDE announced its own
> Linux
> > distribution, dubbed "KDE Neon.' where "Linux distribution" is linked to
> > this article https://dot.kde.org/2016/01/30/fosdem-announcing-kde-neon.
> > There is no word "distribution" written in that article. Neon is always
> > called a "KDE Project", not "KDE Distribution" there.
> >
> > In the link attached to "interview by Swapnil Bhartiya over at CIO.com"
> > sentence Riddel answers the question "Is it a KDE distribution? If so,
> what
> > is the base?" with "It’s a KDE project just like hundreds of other
> projects
> > are part of KDE.  As KDE makes a lot of great software it makes sense to
> > work as part of that team directly rather than be in some separate
> project."
> > You seemed to completely ignore his answer and continue calling Neon a
> KDE
> > distribution instead of a KDE Project during your article.
> >
> > The sentence "The KDE neon team is familiar with Ubuntu" in Neon's FAQ
> > pretty much explains why they used Ubuntu LTS as base. Anyone in Open
> Source
> > world would like to work with what they know better, a LTS distribution
> > makes a lot of sense for a project like Neon, that is also explained in
> >
> http://www.cio.com/article/3027639/linux/kubuntu-founder-jonathan-riddell-to-announce-project-neon-at-fosdem.html
> .
> >
> > Using Ubuntu in no way implies that other distributions are bad like you
> > insinuated with "That's right, Arch users. And openSUSE users. And
> Gentoo,
> > Fedora, Debian, Mageia, and Slackware users (among others). KDE now has a
> > FAQ declaring that Ubuntu is "the best technology." and "... they all
> > stink". That last sentence was really rude and you implied that the whole
> > KDE (not only Neon team) thinks that about distributions other than
> Ubuntu.
> > That is not nice and not fair with KDE. OBS: I use Gentoo, I do *not*
> feel
> > offended by Neon using Ubuntu LTS as base and I voted in favor of Neon to
> > become a KDE *project*.
> >
> > Sorry but Valorie is right. You did that just to bump your readership. If
> > you really wanted to help you should have used Riddel's answer to "Is it
> a
> > KDE distribution? If so, what is the base?" and not just plain ignoring
> it.
> > You can do the right thing now and edit your article and quote Riddel's
> > answer in your article. Something you should have done from the
> beginning.
> >
> >
> > Lamarque V. Souza
> >
> > http://planetkde.org/pt-br
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 10:41 PM, Bryan Lunduke <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Everything I wrote was accurate based on the information provided in
> >> Riddell's announcement (and linked interview) and the Neon website.
> >> If those are not accurate (or are misleading) then there is (possibly)
> >> the root of the problem.  If you can point to something I wrote that
> >> is demonstrably inaccurate based on those sources of information (as
> >> they stood at the time of publication) then please do so and I will
> >> quickly, and gladly, issue a correction in the follow-up article.
> >>
> >> As for the attacks... those have been talked about to death and have
> >> been covered in this thread and elsewhere (including over on G+).  I
> >> have no need to press on that topic as it does nothing productive.  I
> >> do, however, hope that you can work with your community members to
> >> prepare a statement for the next article that will better represent
> >> the KDE community.
> >>
> >> -Bryan
> >>
> >> On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 4:30 PM, Valorie Zimmerman
> >> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> > Woah, woah, woah. Please everyone stop and take a breath. Remember our
> >> > lovely code of conduct.
> >> >
> >> > On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 1:05 PM, Boudewijn Rempt <[email protected]>
> >> > wrote:
> >> >> On Thu, 11 Feb 2016, Bryan Lunduke wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> No.  That's criticism.  Criticism is cool.  I disagree with you, but
> >> >>> you're totally entitled to your opinion.  :)  (SUSE hired me knowing
> >> >>> full well who I am and what I do.  They've never censored me.
> That's
> >> >>> one of the great things about, not just SUSE, but many in the FOSS
> >> >>> world.)
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Ad hominem and person attacks?  Not great.  Those sorts of attacks
> >> >>> should be dealt with swiftly and publicly in order to keep bad
> >> >>> backlash from occurring.
> >> >
> >> > Brian, you wrote an article based on inaccuracies to bump up your
> >> > readership. You got a reaction with some anger about that. Please
> >> > state what personal attacks you received?
> >> >
> >> >> Well, so should dumb and knee-jerk articles with out-of-order
> headlines
> >> >> be dealt with: swiftly, and at the knees. You should not have written
> >> >> this
> >> >> shit. Now, of course, the question is, why did you write it? I guess
> >> >> it's
> >> >> simply stupid fear. Suse has been left behind. Gnome has, of course,
> >> >> its
> >> >> own pet distribution, Fedora. Unity has its own, Ubuntu. Suse has
> >> >> vacillated
> >> >> and dropped the ball. It never cared for anybody in particular, and
> now
> >> >> nobody cares for suse. And when Canonical kicked out Kubuntu, the
> team,
> >> >> who
> >> >> have always been KDE community members, decided to strike out on
> their
> >> >> own.
> >> >> And Suse is, once again, left out in the cold, because you guys were
> >> >> vacillating when you needed to be decisive. To be extremely
> impolitic,
> >> >> you've turned yourselves into the spinsters or perennial bachelors of
> >> >> the Linux
> >> >> world. Too afraid too choose, you're now to old to have anything to
> >> >> chose between.
> >> >
> >> > Canonical didn't kick out Kubuntu. They stopped directly supporting
> >> > the project with paid work. And please remember the CoC -- no matter
> >> > what Brian said, or SuSE did, or Canonical did, etc. -- we should
> >> > remain measured in our response.
> >> >
> >> >> And now you're pissed, and you write dumb screeds and you're pissed
> >> >> when
> >> >> people take the piss; I don't envy you.
> >> >>
> >> >> But not to worry; as has been clear from the start, KDE is a project
> >> >> that
> >> >> transcends your worries. You want Suse to become an "official" KDE
> >> >> project,
> >> >> just like gcompris, krita, neon or amarok: join up and become one.
> >> >> You're
> >> >> welcome.
> >> >
> >> > This bit is true; I'm a small part of the Neon team, but I say: if you
> >> > want to do what Neon is doing within KDE rather then under the wings
> >> > of a distro, go do it! The more ways we get to use KDE software, the
> >> > more users we have.
> >> >
> >> >>> -Bryan
> >> >>>
> >> >>> On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 11:07 AM, Boudewijn Rempt <[email protected]
> >
> >> >>> wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> On Thu, 11 Feb 2016, Bryan Lunduke wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>> Let me start by saying that I am a *huge* fan of KDE.  I've been
> an
> >> >>>>> incredibly vocal supporter and advocate for many years -- and plan
> >> >>>>> to
> >> >>>>> continue to be well into the future.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> That said, I was confused and disappointed by the way the KDE Neon
> >> >>>>> announcement occurred.  Causing me to write the following article:
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> http://www.networkworld.com/article/3032063/opensource-subnet/kdes-new-linux-distro-terrible-idea-or-simply-a-huge-mistake.html
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> The response from the likes of Jonathan Riddell (and a small
> number
> >> >>>>> of
> >> >>>>> others) was nothing short of... terrible.  Personal, ad hominen
> >> >>>>> attacks that just make KDE look terrible.
> >> >
> >> > Link to those attacks please.
> >> >
> >> >>>> Maybe the "social marketing manager for suse" shouldn't have
> written
> >> >>>> an article with as inflammatory a title as that one? Was that a
> >> >>>> really
> >> >>>> smart, savvy move? I've been a suse user and fan for over a
> decade...
> >> >>>> But you're making me wonder why.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Of course you'll assume that me saying that is a personal attack as
> >> >>>> well, I don't doubt that...
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> In any case, as far as I am concerned, the relation between Neon
> and
> >> >>>> KDE is the same as between my project and KDE: both are KDE
> projects.
> >> >>>> Some people don't like that, but tant pis.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> --
> >> >>>> Boudewijn Rempt | http://www.krita.org, http://www.valdyas.org
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Boudewijn Rempt | http://www.krita.org, http://www.valdyas.org
> >> >
> >> > Valorie, for the CWG (Community Working Group)
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > http://about.me/valoriez
> >> >
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