Re: 2nd gen Io
Scott Solmonson <[email protected]> Thu, 6 Mar 2014 23:51:33 -0800
| Newsgroups | gmane.comp.lang.io |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <CAOBv=xC0BHZNCkTGiRFcd+bX_zC75ceOm7yyZtEAxCP=2K+Xfg@mail.gmail.com> |
--001a11c2cba4cd65be04f3ff850d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Why stop there? Why not sign every object from a root instance seed from the initial Lobby? Startup time would be increased hilariously, but in the "reusable object" paradigm once they're up, they're up. And a chain of authorization can then exist that effortlessly overflows across cores, systems, and distance automagically. -SS -- NUNQUAM NON PARATUS =E2=98=A4 INCITATUS =C3=86TERNUS =E3=83=BD(=C2=B4=E2=97= =87=EF=BD=80)=E3=83=8E V/T: 00.1.408.718.6290 Skype: Scott Solmonson On Thu, Mar 6, 2014 at 4:28 PM, Steve Dekorte <[email protected]> wrote: > > I=E2=80=99d like to make the things that tend to be re-implemented in typ= ical > projects part of the language - security, persistence, concurrency, > distribution and user interaction. All of these could be seen as mapping > problems and their solution as adding explicit mapping boundaries. > > The first idea (which was probably already done in Smalltalk in 1980s) is > to add a pointer to each object in the system to it=E2=80=99s =E2=80=9Cow= ner=E2=80=9D and have > object ownership domains where the domain leader is an actor/process whos= e > execution thread is used for processing all messages sent to objects with= in > it=E2=80=99s domain. Any object can become a domain of the objects below = it in the > ownership graph. Domain boundaries are used to solve the problems of > security (tracking and verifying authority to invoke behaviors), > concurrency (avoid unexpected state changes, closely associate execution > with the state it will be working on), distribution and persistence > (boundaries determine the state which needs to be persisted or moved). > > Part of the persistence component is to support the indexing and lazy > loading of individual objects and standard representations that can be > externally manipulated and returned and merged with an optimistic locking > mechanism. > > The user interaction part involves extending slots to have metadata and a > standard set of properties which are used for the interface mapping. > > This would be a big project but hopefully there will be time in the futur= e > to take a stab at it. > > Sorry for the delay in responding, > Steve > > On Feb 24, 2014, at 6:06 AM, [email protected] wrote: > > Come on Steve, there are Io fans who wanna hear about it! Let us chat. > > > > Selon Steve Dekorte <[email protected]>: > >> > >> On Feb 19, 2014, at 1:28 AM, [email protected] wrote: > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> When there's no matching slot, the "forward" slot is activated. > >>> > >>> I have this idea about a "before" slot: > >>> > >>> If "before" doesn't exist, everything works as usual. > >>> > >>> If "before" exists, it is always activated (and it receives the > message) > >> before > >>> the slot lookup. Then, it produces a message (possibly the same) whic= h > will > >> be > >>> treated as usual. > >>> > >>> This could be used to test whether the sender as the "right" to acces= s > a > >>> particular slot, for example. > >> > >> Hi Julien, > >> > >> I like the idea. On my list for a 2nd gen Io is some form of support f= or > >> rights on all objects. > >> > >>> Is there already a way to do this at user level? > >> > >> You can get the same effect using a proxy to forward message to the re= al > >> object. > >> Io uses proxies for futures and supports turning all references of one > object > >> to another. > >> > >>> Also, would anybody have a little constructive criticism about Io? > >> > >> Always welcome! :) > >> > >> Steve > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo Groups Links > > > > --001a11c2cba4cd65be04f3ff850d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/htm= l4/strict.dtd"> <html> <head> </head> =20 <body style=3D"background-color: #fff;"> <span style=3D"display:none"> </span> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStartT|**|-~--> <div id=3D"ygrp-mlmsg" style=3D"position:relative;"> <div id=3D"ygrp-msg" style=3D"z-index: 1;"> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEndT|**|-~--> <div id=3D"ygrp-text" > =20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20 <p><div dir=3D"ltr">Why stop there?<div><br></div><div>Why not sign e= very object from a root instance seed from the initial Lobby? Startup time = would be increased hilariously, but in the "reusable object" para= digm once they're up, they're up. And a chain of authorization can = then exist that effortlessly overflows across cores, systems, and distance = automagically.</div> <div><br></div><div>-SS</div> </div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br clear=3D"all"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <p>--</p><p>NUNQUAM NON PARATUS =E2=98=A4 INCITATUS =C3=86TERNUS =E3=83=BD(= =C2=B4=E2=97=87=EF=BD=80)=E3=83=8E</p><p>V/T: 00.1.408.718.6290</p><p>Skype= : Scott Solmonson</p></div></div> <br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 6, 2014 at 4:28 PM, Steve De= korte <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"= _blank">[email protected]</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gma= il_quote" style=3D"border-left:1px #ccc solid;"> <br> I=E2=80=99d like to make the things that tend to be re-implemented in typic= al projects part of the language - security, persistence, concurrency, dist= ribution and user interaction. All of these could be seen as mapping proble= ms and their solution as adding explicit mapping boundaries.<br> <br> The first idea (which was probably already done in Smalltalk in 1980s) is t= o add a pointer to each object in the system to it=E2=80=99s =E2=80=9Cowner= =E2=80=9D and have object ownership domains where the domain leader is an a= ctor/process whose execution thread is used for processing all messages sen= t to objects within it=E2=80=99s domain. Any object can become a domain of = the objects below it in the ownership graph. Domain boundaries are used to = solve the problems of security (tracking and verifying authority to invoke = behaviors), concurrency (avoid unexpected state changes, closely associate = execution with the state it will be working on), distribution and persisten= ce (boundaries determine the state which needs to be persisted or moved).<b= r> <br> Part of the persistence component is to support the indexing and lazy loadi= ng of individual objects and standard representations that can be externall= y manipulated and returned and merged with an optimistic locking mechanism.= <br> <br> The user interaction part involves extending slots to have metadata and a s= tandard set of properties which are used for the interface mapping.<br> <br> This would be a big project but hopefully there will be time in the future = to take a stab at it.<br> <br> Sorry for the delay in responding,<br> Steve<br> <br> On Feb 24, 2014, at 6:06 AM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">omenv= [email protected]</a> wrote:<br> > Come on Steve, there are Io fans who wanna hear about it! Let us chat.= <br> ><br> > Selon Steve Dekorte <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">steve@dek= orte.com</a>>:<br> >><br> >> On Feb 19, 2014, at 1:28 AM, <a href=3D"mailto:omenvironment@free.= fr">[email protected]</a> wrote:<br> >>> Hi all,<br> >>><br> >>> When there's no matching slot, the "forward" slo= t is activated.<br> >>><br> >>> I have this idea about a "before" slot:<br> >>><br> >>> If "before" doesn't exist, everything works as u= sual.<br> >>><br> >>> If "before" exists, it is always activated (and it r= eceives the message)<br> >> before<br> >>> the slot lookup. Then, it produces a message (possibly the sam= e) which will<br> >> be<br> >>> treated as usual.<br> >>><br> >>> This could be used to test whether the sender as the "rig= ht" to access a<br> >>> particular slot, for example.<br> >><br> >> Hi Julien,<br> >><br> >> I like the idea. On my list for a 2nd gen Io is some form of suppo= rt for<br> >> rights on all objects.<br> >><br> >>> Is there already a way to do this at user level?<br> >><br> >> You can get the same effect using a proxy to forward message to th= e real<br> >> object.<br> >> Io uses proxies for futures and supports turning all references of= one object<br> >> to another.<br> >><br> >>> Also, would anybody have a little constructive criticism about= Io?<br> >><br> >> Always welcome! :)<br> >><br> >> Steve<br> <br> <br> <br> <br> <br> ------------------------------------<br> <br> Yahoo Groups Links<br> <br> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:<br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage/" target= =3D"_blank">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage/</a><br> <br> <*> Your email settings:<br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Individual Email | Traditional<br> <br> <*> To change settings online go to:<br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage/join" tar= get=3D"_blank">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage/join</a><br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 (Yahoo! ID required)<br> <br> <*> To change settings via email:<br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">iolangua= [email protected]</a><br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">io= [email protected]</a><br> <br> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:<br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">iol= [email protected]</a><br> <br> <*> Your use of Yahoo Groups is subject to:<br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/"= target=3D"_blank">https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/</a><br= > <br> </blockquote></div><br></div> </p> </div> =20=20=20=20=20 <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~--> <div style=3D"color: #fff; height: 0;">__._,_.___</div> =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20=20 <div style=3D"clear:both"> </div> <table cellspacing=3D4px style=3D"margin-top: 20px; margin-bottom: 10px= ;"> <tbody> <tr> <td style=3D"font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; font-weight: bo= ld; padding: 7px 5px 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1= px solid #EAEAEA " > <a style=3D"text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD= " href=3D"https://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage/post;_ylc=3DX3oDMTJxaTc= 5Y2d2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzY2Nzc0NzYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDA2NzY0BG1zZ0lkAz= EzMzUzBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTM5NDE3ODY5Nw--?act=3Dreply&messageN= um=3D13353">Reply via web post</a> </td> <td style=3D"font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5p= x 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; "= > <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]?subject=3DRe%3A%20%5BIo%5D%= 202nd%20gen%20Io" style=3D"text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;"> Reply to sender </a>=20 </td> <td style=3D"font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5p= x 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; "= > <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]?subject=3DRe%3A%20= %5BIo%5D%202nd%20gen%20Io" style=3D"text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD"> Reply to group </a>=20 </td> <td style=3D"font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5p= x 5px; color: #FFF; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA; "= > <a href=3D"https://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage/post;_ylc= =3DX3oDMTJlNDdzY2xrBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzY2Nzc0NzYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDA2= NzY0BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTM5NDE3ODY5Nw--" style=3D"text-decorat= ion: none; color: #2D50FD">Start a New Topic</a> </td> <td style=3D"font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5p= x 5px; color: #2D50FD; background-color: #F2F2F2; border: 1px solid #EAEAEA= ; " > <a href=3D"https://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolan= guage/message/13345;_ylc=3DX3oDMTM2ZWRxOWNzBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzY2Nzc0= NzYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDA2NzY0BG1zZ0lkAzEzMzUzBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWU= DMTM5NDE3ODY5NwR0cGNJZAMxMzM0NQ--" style=3D"text-decoration: none; color: #= 2D50FD;">Messages in this topic</a> (6) </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 <!------- Start Nav Bar ------> <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| --> =20 <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> <div id=3D"ygrp-vital" style=3D"background-color: #f2f2f2; font-family: Ver= dana; font-size: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 10px;"> <span id=3D"vithd" style=3D"font-weight: bold; color: #333; text-transf= orm: uppercase; "><a href=3D"https://groups.yahoo.com/group/iolanguage;_ylc= =3DX3oDMTJlM2NrNmc2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzY2Nzc0NzYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDA2= NzY0BHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTM5NDE3ODY5Nw--" style=3D"text-decorat= ion: none;">Visit Your Group</a></span> <ul style=3D"list-style-type: none; margin: 0; padding: 0; display: in= line;"> </ul> </div> <div id=3D"ft" style=3D"font-family: Arial; font-size: 11px; margin-top: 5p= x; padding: 0 2px 0 0; clear: both;"> <a href=3D"https://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=3DX3oDMTJkcmswZnYzBF9TAzk3NDc2N= TkwBGdycElkAzY2Nzc0NzYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDA2NzY0BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGlt= ZQMxMzk0MTc4Njk3" style=3D"float: left;"><img src=3D"http://l.yimg.com/ru/s= tatic/images/yg/img/email/new_logo/logo-groups-137x15.png" height=3D"15" wi= dth=3D"137" alt=3D"Yahoo! Groups" style=3D"border: 0;"/></a> <div style=3D"color: #747575; float: right;"> • <a href=3D"https://i= nfo.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/groups/details.html" style=3D"text-decoratio= n: none;">Privacy</a> • <a href=3D"mailto:iolanguage-unsubscribe@yahoo= groups.com?subject=3DUnsubscribe" style=3D"text-decoration: none;">Unsubscr= ibe</a> • <a href=3D"https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/= " style=3D"text-decoration: none;">Terms of Use</a> </div> </div> <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| --> </div> <!-- ygrp-msg --> =20 <!-- Sponsor --> <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> <div id=3D"ygrp-sponsor" style=3D"width:160px; float:right; clear:none; m= argin:0 0 25px 0; background: #fff;"> <!-- Start Recommendations --> <div id=3D"ygrp-reco"> </div> <!-- End Recommendations --> </div> <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| --> <div style=3D"clear:both; color: #FFF; font-size:1px;">.</div> </div> <img src=3D"http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=3D97359714/grpId=3D6677476/grpspI= d=3D1705006764/msgId=3D13353/stime=3D1394178697" width=3D"1" height=3D"1"> = <br> <div style=3D"color: #fff; height: 0;">__,_._,___</div> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~--> </body> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~--> <head> <style type=3D"text/css"> <!-- #ygrp-mkp { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; font-family: Arial; margin: 10px 0; padding: 0 10px; } #ygrp-mkp hr { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; } #ygrp-mkp #hd { color: #628c2a; font-size: 85%; font-weight: 700; line-height: 122%; margin: 10px 0; } #ygrp-mkp #ads { margin-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-mkp .ad { padding: 0 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad p { margin: 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad a { color: #0000ff; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc { font-family: Arial; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd { margin: 10px 0px; font-weight: 700; font-size: 78%; line-height: 122%; } #ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad { margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 0 0; } #actions { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 11px; padding: 10px 0; } #activity { background-color: #e0ecee; float: left; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; padding: 10px; } #activity span { font-weight: 700; } #activity span:first-child { text-transform: uppercase; } #activity span a { color: #5085b6; text-decoration: none; } #activity span span { color: #ff7900; } #activity span .underline { text-decoration: underline; } .attach { clear: both; display: table; font-family: Arial; font-size: 12px; padding: 10px 0; width: 400px; } .attach div a { text-decoration: none; } .attach img { border: none; padding-right: 5px; } .attach label { display: block; margin-bottom: 5px; } .attach label a { text-decoration: none; } =20=20 blockquote { margin: 0 0 0 4px; } .bold { font-family: Arial; font-size: 13px; font-weight: 700; } .bold a { text-decoration: none; } dd.last p a { font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span { margin-right: 10px; font-family: Verdana; font-weight: 700; } dd.last p span.yshortcuts { margin-right: 0; } div.attach-table div div a { text-decoration: none; } div.attach-table { width: 400px; } div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.fi= le-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div= .photo-title a:visited { text-decoration: none; } div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts { font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; font-weight: normal; } .green { color: #628c2a; } .MsoNormal { margin: 0 0 0 0; } o { font-size: 0; } #photos div { float: left; width: 72px; } #photos div div { border: 1px solid #666666; height: 62px; overflow: hidden; width: 62px; } #photos div label { color: #666666; font-size: 10px; overflow: hidden; text-align: center; white-space: nowrap; width: 64px; } #reco-category { font-size: 77%; } #reco-desc { font-size: 77%; } .replbq { margin: 4px; } #ygrp-actbar div a:first-child { /* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/ margin-right: 2px; padding-right: 5px; } #ygrp-mlmsg { font-size: 13px; font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif; *font-size: small; *font: x-small; } #ygrp-mlmsg table { font-size: inherit; font: 100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea { font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; } #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code { font:115% monospace; *font-size:100%; } #ygrp-mlmsg * { line-height: 1.22em; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo { padding-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-msg p a { font-family: Verdana; } #ygrp-msg p#attach-count span { color: #1E66AE; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco #reco-head { color: #ff7900; font-weight: 700; } #ygrp-reco { margin-bottom: 20px; padding: 0px; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a { font-size: 130%; text-decoration: none; } #ygrp-sponsor #ov li { font-size: 77%; list-style-type: square; padding: 6px 0; }=20 #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul { margin: 0; padding: 0 0 0 8px; } #ygrp-text { font-family: Georgia; } #ygrp-text p { margin: 0 0 1em 0; } #ygrp-text tt { font-size: 120%; } #ygrp-vital ul li:last-child { border-right: none !important;=20 }=20 --> </style> </head> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~--> </html> <!-- end group email --> --001a11c2cba4cd65be04f3ff850d--