Re: Mac stuff

> On Jan 22, 2005, at 2:32 AM, Roger Binns wrote:
>> And it has all the annoyances of Windows (eg dumping what would be 
>> drive letters on your desktop,
> 
>  Easily turned off. In fact, this was turned off in the first versions 
> of MacOS X but user demand made them bring it back.

I would disagree with "easy".  There is no right click menu item
nor anything in the finder menus nor anything in the help.  Presumably
it is somewhere and easy once you know where just like various
things on Windows :-)

>> trying to hide the distinction between files, packages, executables 
>> and shortcuts)
> 
>  This is a perfect case of making it simple and manageable for people 
> who don't know any better and would break things, but it's easy to work 
> around if you know what you're doing. A ctrl-click on a package will 
> give you a "Show Package Contents" for example.

As an example I got bitten the first time I installed Firefox before 
reblasting the machine.  You end up with something on your desktop
labelled Firefox that when double clicked on produces another icon
with a Firefox label that produces a container with a Firefox icon
in it that can be dragged into a Finder window that has a Firefox
icon in it.  I also dragged the Firefox icon to the dock.  At that
point I tried deleting every single Firefox icon except the one
in the dock, since that is the only one I actually wanted.

Yes I understand it all now and did right after reblasting.

>>  with the amateurishness of Linux (crappy help,
> 
>  I haven't seen a good example of help yet on any system, IMNSHO.

In general the best help is the help you don't actually have to
use.  In this case I wanted to access an Exchange server.  I
had just configured Evolution on Linux to do that - it uses
Outlook Web Access behind the scenes.  I noticed Apple Mail had
an 'Exchange' type.  Try and work out from the help how to use
it.  (eg it asks for the server in no less than 4 different 
places)

The best help I have seen has been for some parts of Windows
but as you rightly point out, the bar wasn't set that high.
And then of course there was the help system I worked on
10 years ago at IXI ...

>  Non-obvious to a geek or non-obvious to someone who knows nothing of 
> computers?  

The latter :-)  

>  In the case of odd dialogs, I'd love to see your examples. I'd say 
> Windows is far and above the king of useless confirmation dialogs and 
> meaningless errors. Just curious which ones you are referring to.

Deleting files on a network drive, deleting a directory tree where
some of the files can't be deleted.  I don't remember the specifics
of others since I kept reconfiguring things.

It really annoys when bringing up preferences for various things.
For some programs changes take effect immediately - there is no
cancel or undo preference changes and other programs require you
to apply, or bring up confirmation requests as you navigate away.
 
>> I was also amazed at just how primitive many of the apps are such as 
>> Mail or the Browser.
> 
>  This is a different view of making programs for the users that cover 
> the basic functions, but don't overload you with tons of options and 
> obscure functions. 

Yes, and Windows and Linux do *exactly* the same thing with their
default mailers and browsers.  The Mac ones definitely come last
in terms of functionality.  I guess I also had my hopes high for
a mailer that actually understands IMAP properly.  I keep trying
to find a good IMAP mailer on *any* operating system, and Outlook
Express is still it.   (They need to understand that you use 
multiple computers and that you use IMAP because you want everything
stored on the server).

>  Most applications respect what I think are largely emacs bindings. I 
> didn't use emacs that much, so I don't remember. ^A and ^E go to 
> start/end of line for example.  Ctrl-left/right arrow go to start/end 
> of line as well, and option-left/right arrow go to previous/next word.  
> (option is the ALT on a windows keyboard)

The key mappings to a PC keyboard are horrible (which I didn't include
in my rant since the Mac has the right to do things the way it has
done historically).

In Windows and Linux, operations on items use the Control key.
eg Ctrl-C to copy, Ctrl-arrows to jump around words etc   The
Alt key is used for bigger picture stuff and menu accelerator
keys.

Using Mac the Ctrl, Windows Key and Alt map to a completely different
class of functions than they do for Windows and Linux.  Things no
longer become shortcuts if you have to try and think which of the 
4 keys under your left thumb to press in order to do something.

I found some good discussion at this site:

http://macslash.org/article.pl?sid=04/07/06/2310205

>  Not at all, it's interesting to see how your experience will progress 
> and as a system support person as well, it gives me better insight on 
> things other users may encounter that I gloss over.

I still haven't figured out how to really work well with lots of 
windows.  On Linux I use virtual desktops.  On Windows I have a
dual screen setup and the taskbar works really well.  On Mac the
dock doesn't really do it for me.  For example if I have two
terminal windows open, I want to select them individually.  I
also tried a virtual desktop program, but it wouldn't let me
move windows around by dragging them in the panner.  So I'll
keep trying things until I find something that works.

Roger


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