Re: Re: Re: Have you looked at UIML?

On Saturday 31 August 2002 12:08 pm, Gerald Bauer wrote:
> > > of junk.
> >
> > Hey -- why the rough tone?
>
>   I'm not sure what you would call it, but a piece of
> junk is almost a compliment if you look at it closer.

Please be more specific. Calling something junk is not constructive, but 
stating that X, Y, or Z is deficient and explaining why is. The comments 
about the tone have to do with the delivery of a pronouncement, not that we 
would disagree with you if we were to give more details of your claim. 

Comments are generally constructive on Python mailing lists, even if they are 
pointing out flaws. An excellent example of constructive criticism is Andrew 
Kuchling's paper on "Python's Warts" [1] The Python developers take Andrew's 
critique very seriously and many of his original observations of weaknesses 
have been fixed in subsequent revisions of the language. I recommend reading 
this paper to anyone who is interested in Python. Andrew keeps the document 
up to date sites when a wart has been removed. It provides an interesting 
historical perspective on the language's evolution. 

Deliver a critique of Anygui, UIML, and Anygui that is like Andrew's insights 
and you will find many friends on this list.

>   For a start, Luxor has more downloads than anygui.
> It's not yet a match to Internet Exploder, but it
> beats .Nyet Windope Forms anytime.

And VB is more widely used than Python, but that doesn't make it better. 
Popularity is sometimes just a sign of a fad or the availability of more 
marketing dollars. Take Java for instance:-)

> PS: I won't torture you anylonger with my heretic XUL
> thoughts. 

The thoughts are not good or bad. They just lack detail. 

> Accepting change is never easy.

Perhaps you need to look in a mirror regarding this comment.  The Python 
community may be conservative about adopting new ideas, but good design often 
requires being careful not to include a kitchen sink just because someone 
thinks it includes several essential feature. It's often what is left out 
that defines a good design. I think XUL could potentially be good complement 
to Anygui, but it needs to be evaluated for it's own set of warts before it 
is added to the mix. We don't need another shiny kitchen sink, we need well 
thought out and effective solutions to real problems.

 [1] http://www.amk.ca/python/writing/warts.html



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