Re: Trying to do some research on the effects of biofeedback
Peter Little <[email protected]> Sat, 3 Apr 2021 10:58:22 -0700
| Newsgroups | gmane.comp.science.openeeg.general |
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| Message-ID | <CAG4ZH4ERPAJKE7sae2FezDhma8VTTypiyGe__KSA1FhS+KMUmg@mail.gmail.com> |
--===============2477053451484488180== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000091098c05bf1536b2" --00000000000091098c05bf1536b2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable As a neurofeedback provider and someone who has spent a few years pretty interested in the expanse of the field, I would say that Jens' broad description of the branches of the field is accurate, that they all seem to have some efficacy, but in my own experience and those of many others in the field, moving into lower frequencies (in the slow cortical potential or infralow frequency realm) and away from training to a statistical average seems to be generally much more efficacious and powerful (though does require a trained provider guiding the process since it can move so quickly). This is in no way to denigrate the other approaches, which I do believe may have their own specific advantages. For those interested in the symptom based, low frequency approach, Id strongly recommend looking into the Othmers and their work. eeginfo.com is a good place to start On Sat, Apr 3, 2021 at 1:59 AM Jens K=C3=B6rner <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Laura, > > my experience with neurofeedback is mainly as a patient of severe > early childhood brain trauma. > > In my opinion the main source of confusion in the field originates in > a lack of differentiation: > > Broadly speaking, there are two very different kinds of > neurofeedbacktrainig: 1. The generalized way: trainig each > participant's brain to match a statistical average. That's done by > most providers. It's a little bit scalable and sometimes has some > useful effect. > 2. The individualized approach (Sebern Fisher, Jim Hardt): totally > unscalable; therefore expensive; with allegedly spectacular results. > > Perhaps this is of some use to you. > Regards > Jens > > > > 2021-04-03 10:03 GMT+02:00, Stefan Jung <[email protected]>: > > Hi Laura > > > > This site is DEAD. It feels like a lifetime ago that I last posted her= e > > > > Firstly, I think you should speak / search Neurofeedback (NFB) rather > than > > biofeedback. > > > > If someone tells me he is interested in biofeedback I think about: > > > > - Hand temperature biofeedback to reduce migraines > > - GSR / SCL skin resistance biofeedback for meditation, hypertension, e= tc > > - HRV (Heart Rate Variance), for similar uses as SCL > > - etc. > > > > Here are three group recommendations: > > > > Brain-trainer > > brain-trainer.com run by Peter van Deusen. Peter used to be a hospita= l > > administrator (I think), many years ago in the US. I think the man mus= t > > have at least 20 years of NFB experience by now. Very helpful and > > knowledgeable. For the last few years he has been operating from > > Brazil. He has a very active community and a forum where they discuss > > various NFB applications, etc. > > > > OpenBCI > > https://openbci.com/ > > Their main goal is to use BCI ( Brain Computer Interfacing) for command > and > > control. For instance, a handycaped person that can control a wheelcha= ir > > or computer with a BCI interface. > > > > OpenVIBE > > http://openvibe.inria.fr/ > > A research organisation based in France > > They seem to concentrate on the software layer running on various BCI > > equipment. Not sure how active they are these days. > > > > Regards > > Stefan > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Openeeg-list mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/openeeg-list > Go to the above address to change your > subscription options, e.g unsubscribe. > --00000000000091098c05bf1536b2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr"><div>As a neurofeedback provider and someone who has spent= a few years pretty interested in the expanse of the field, I would say tha= t Jens' broad description of the branches of the field is accurate, tha= t they all seem to have some efficacy, but in my own experience and those o= f many others in the field, moving into lower frequencies (in the slow cort= ical potential or infralow frequency realm) and away from training to a sta= tistical average seems to be generally much more efficacious and powerful (= though does require a trained provider guiding the process since it can mov= e so quickly). This is in no way to denigrate the other approaches, which I= do believe may have their own specific advantages.</div><div>For those int= erested in the symptom based, low frequency approach, Id strongly recommend= looking into the Othmers and their work. <br></div><div><a href=3D"http://= eeginfo.com">eeginfo.com</a></div><div>is a good place to start<br></div></= div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On= Sat, Apr 3, 2021 at 1:59 AM Jens K=C3=B6rner <<a href=3D"mailto:jnskrnr= @gmail.com">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"= gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(20= 4,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hi Laura,<br> <br> my experience with neurofeedback is mainly as a patient of severe<br> early childhood brain trauma.<br> <br> In my opinion the main source of confusion in the field originates in<br> a lack of differentiation:<br> <br> Broadly speaking, there are two very different kinds of<br> neurofeedbacktrainig: 1. The generalized way: trainig each<br> participant's brain to match a statistical average. That's done by<= br> most providers. It's a little bit scalable and sometimes has some<br> useful effect.<br> 2. The individualized approach (Sebern Fisher, Jim Hardt): totally<br> unscalable; therefore expensive; with allegedly spectacular results.<br> <br> Perhaps this is of some use to you.<br> Regards<br> Jens<br> <br> <br> <br> 2021-04-03 10:03 GMT+02:00, Stefan Jung <<a href=3D"mailto:bio.sens.eng@= gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>>:<br> > Hi Laura<br> ><br> > This site is DEAD.=C2=A0 It feels like a lifetime ago that I last post= ed here<br> ><br> > Firstly, I think you should speak / search Neurofeedback (NFB) rather = than<br> > biofeedback.<br> ><br> > If someone tells me he is interested in biofeedback I think about:<br> ><br> > - Hand temperature biofeedback to reduce migraines<br> > - GSR / SCL skin resistance biofeedback for meditation, hypertension, = etc<br> > - HRV (Heart Rate Variance),=C2=A0 for similar uses as SCL<br> > -=C2=A0 etc.<br> ><br> > Here are three group recommendations:<br> ><br> > Brain-trainer<br> > <a href=3D"http://brain-trainer.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_bla= nk">brain-trainer.com</a>=C2=A0 run by Peter van Deusen.=C2=A0 Peter used t= o be a hospital<br> > administrator (I think), many years ago in the US.=C2=A0 I think the m= an must<br> > have at least 20 years of NFB experience by now.=C2=A0 Very helpful an= d<br> > knowledgeable.=C2=A0 For the last few years he has been operating from= <br> > Brazil.=C2=A0 He has a very active community and a forum where they di= scuss<br> > various NFB applications, etc.<br> ><br> > OpenBCI<br> > <a href=3D"https://openbci.com/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">= https://openbci.com/</a><br> > Their main goal is to use BCI ( Brain Computer Interfacing) for comman= d and<br> > control.=C2=A0 For instance, a handycaped person that can control a wh= eelchair<br> > or computer with a BCI interface.<br> ><br> > OpenVIBE<br> > <a href=3D"http://openvibe.inria.fr/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_bl= ank">http://openvibe.inria.fr/</a><br> > A research organisation based in France<br> > They seem to concentrate on the software layer running on various BCI<= br> > equipment.=C2=A0 Not sure how active they are these days.<br> ><br> > Regards<br> > Stefan<br> ><br> <br> <br> _______________________________________________<br> Openeeg-list mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">Ope= [email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/openeeg-list" rel= =3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listi= nfo/openeeg-list</a><br> Go to the above address to change your<br> subscription options, e.g unsubscribe.<br> </blockquote></div> --00000000000091098c05bf1536b2-- --===============2477053451484488180== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline --===============2477053451484488180== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline