Re: Licensing question
"Mustafa Abbasi" <[email protected]> Sun, 19 Mar 2006 15:06:36 +0500
| Newsgroups | gmane.comp.video.xvid.user |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
--===============1567852610== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_5706_27355935.1142762796942" ------=_Part_5706_27355935.1142762796942 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 3/9/06, Michael Militzer <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Chris, > > I agree one should not rely on FAQs or interpretations about the GPL but > instead read the actual license text. However, then one should read it > carefully. And I don't consider the conclusions you've drawn to be > correct. Actually, the terms of the GPL are rather clear: > > Quoting from section 0 of the GPL: "the output from the Program is covere= d > only if its contents constitute a work based on the Program (independent > of having been made by running the Program)". Hence, videos encoded using > XVID are of course _not_ covered by the GPL. > > Then regarding the linking discussion: This has been discussed many times > before already, so I'll try to keep it short. First, remember that the GP= L > restricts _distribution_ of a copyrighted works licensed under the terms > of the GPL (the "Program"). It's not at all about "usage", "making use" > etc. So let's also just stick to the distribution case here. > > The GPL clearly states that you are allowed to "form a work based on the > Program" and that you can also redistribute such work provided you meet > the requirements of the license. One of this requirements is that "You > must cause any work that you distribute or publish, that in whole or in > part contains or is derived from the Program or any part thereof, to be > licensed as a whole at no charge to all third parties under the terms of > this License" (Section 2b of the GPL). > > As you correctly quoted yourself from section 0: "a 'work based on the > Program' means either the Program or any derivative work under copyright > law". A derivative work under copyright law is any work that includes/ > derives from/contains preexisting copyrighted works. The GPL also gives > a quick explanation as "a work containing the Program or a portion of it"= . > > Now let's consider an example: you distribute a video player application, > where you developed the frontend (GUI, user interaction etc.) and that > includes XVID and a mp3 decoder library for video and audio playback. No > matter how you link to XVID here (static/dynamic/through a third-party > interface), you're clearly distributing a derivative work as it contains > preexisting copyrighted works. Hence, you can only distribute this player > containing XVID if you publish it as a whole under the GPL. That means > your new part (the frontend) but also other parts (like the mp3 decoder i= n > the above example) must be licensed under the GPL. If you can't do this > or don't want to do this, you must refrain from redistributing XVID. > Simple as that. but many programs that are based on gpl works keep part of the source open and part closed. just look at linux distros. The GPL expressily permits you to keep your seperate/independent works > proprietary "when you distribute them as separate works" (Section 2 of th= e > GPL). So in the above example: if you consider your player software > independent and seperate enough (e.g. XVID is just an optional plugin to > the player), then you don't have to publish your player under the GPL. > However, you _must_ distribute it as a seperate work then, that means the > XVID plugin cannot be distributed together with your proprietary player. > As > soon as you want to combinedly distribute your player with XVID, you must > publish it as a whole under the GPL (see Section 2 of the GPL). > > The 'mere aggregation' clause is no exception to this rule. It just point= s > out that two entirely different works put onto the same data carrier don'= t > create a derivative work under the GPL license. So you can e.g. distribut= e > XVID together with Ad-Aware as part of a software collection on the same > CD without running into any problem with the GPL... > > Regards, > Michael > > > Quoting Chris <[email protected]>: > > > > > Christoph Lampert wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > >>On 3/9/06, Chris <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >>> > > >>>according to the GPL if my app loads xvid or similar then it must be > open > > >>>source. > > > > > > > > > No. GPL does not restrict the _usage_ of the codec in any kind. If a > > > user has XviD installed on his/her machine, your program is free to > > > use it. > > > > I agree with this. > > > > > > > > > > What you are not allowed to do is _distribute_ XviD together with a > > > proprietary software, i.e. make a bundle for download, > > > have your player's installer directly install XviD as well, > > > > No thats is quite incorrect. > > > > You are referring to the mere aggregation of the work. That it is > installed > > onto a machine by a > > common installer does not bring the works under the GPL. > > > > from the gpl... > > > > In addition, mere aggregation of another work not based on the Program > > with the Program (or with a work based on the Program) on a volume of > > a storage or distribution medium does not bring the other work under > > the scope of this License. > > .......... > > > > > > > > The gpl uses the words "based on" for a program to come under the gpl i= t > must > > be derived from > > the gpl'd works. > > > > > > from section 0 of the GPL.... > > > > The "Program", below, refers to any such program or work, and a "work > based > > on the Program" > > means either the Program or any derivative work under copyright law: > > that is to say, a work containing the Program or a portion of it, > > either verbatim or with modifications and/or translated into another > > language. (Hereinafter, translation is included without limitation in > > the term "modification".) Each licensee is addressed as "you". > > ............. > > > > Thus a work must be based upon at least in part the gpl'd software. Thu= s > if > > your program "Makes > > use of" but is not derived from (think parent child relationship) then > even > > static linking is an > > acceptable method of making use of the software without ever being > derived > > from the gpl'd > > software. I searched for the phrase static or dynamic and neither are > > mentioned in the licence > > thus neither or included nor excluded from the licence. > > > > Clearly making use of a codec does not fall into this category, even if > they > > are distributed on > > the same medium. > > > > Interestingly the video encoded using xvid MUST be gpl'd as it is > clearly > > "based upon or derived > > from" the gpl'd software. so all videos encoded using xvid MUST carry > the > > appropriate copyright > > and licence clearly displayed as is specified in the GPL. > > > > > > > > My error was to read the FAQ it is in fact quite inaccurate in its > portrayal > > of the licence. the > > FAQ even on the gnu.org site is also innacurate and represents at best > an > > idealised view of the > > licence. > > > > The licence is quite clearly in its design and intent meant to prevent > the > > use or modification > > of the open source software with the purpose of then making it closed > source. > > in other words one > > cannot take xvid make some minor changes call it chrisvid and publish i= t > as > > their own work. > > > > I am sorry for the bother I have caused. I should have read the licence > > itself rather than take > > the shortcut of relying on someones interpretation of the licence, ie > The gnu > > GPL faq. > > > > Chris > > _______________________________________________ > > XviD-users mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://list.xvid.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > XviD-users mailing list > [email protected] > http://list.xvid.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users > ------=_Part_5706_27355935.1142762796942 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline <br><br><div><span class=3D"gmail_quote">On 3/9/06, <b class=3D"gmail_sende= rname">Michael Militzer</b> <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">michael= @xvid.org</a>> wrote:</span><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"b= order-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; paddin= g-left: 1ex;"> Hi Chris,<br><br>I agree one should not rely on FAQs or interpretations abo= ut the GPL but<br>instead read the actual license text. However, then one s= hould read it<br>carefully. And I don't consider the conclusions you've dra= wn to be <br>correct. Actually, the terms of the GPL are rather clear:<br><br>Quotin= g from section 0 of the GPL: "the output from the Program is covered<b= r>only if its contents constitute a work based on the Program (independent <br>of having been made by running the Program)". Hence, videos encode= d using<br>XVID are of course _not_ covered by the GPL.<br><br>Then regardi= ng the linking discussion: This has been discussed many times<br>before alr= eady, so I'll try to keep it short. First, remember that the GPL <br>restricts _distribution_ of a copyrighted works licensed under the term= s<br>of the GPL (the "Program"). It's not at all about "usag= e", "making use"<br>etc. So let's also just stick to the dis= tribution case here. <br><br>The GPL clearly states that you are allowed to "form a work ba= sed on the<br>Program" and that you can also redistribute such work pr= ovided you meet<br>the requirements of the license. One of this requirement= s is that "You <br>must cause any work that you distribute or publish, that in whole or in= <br>part contains or is derived from the Program or any part thereof, to be= <br>licensed as a whole at no charge to all third parties under the terms o= f <br>this License" (Section 2b of the GPL).<br><br>As you correctly quo= ted yourself from section 0: "a 'work based on the<br>Program' means e= ither the Program or any derivative work under copyright<br>law". A de= rivative work under copyright law is any work that includes/ <br>derives from/contains preexisting copyrighted works. The GPL also gives= <br>a quick explanation as "a work containing the Program or a portion= of it".<br><br>Now let's consider an example: you distribute a video = player application, <br>where you developed the frontend (GUI, user interaction etc.) and that<= br>includes XVID and a mp3 decoder library for video and audio playback. No= <br>matter how you link to XVID here (static/dynamic/through a third-party <br>interface), you're clearly distributing a derivative work as it contain= s<br>preexisting copyrighted works. Hence, you can only distribute this pla= yer<br>containing XVID if you publish it as a whole under the GPL. That mea= ns <br>your new part (the frontend) but also other parts (like the mp3 decoder= in<br>the above example) must be licensed under the GPL. If you can't do t= his<br>or don't want to do this, you must refrain from redistributing XVID. <br>Simple as that.</blockquote><div><br>but many programs that are based o= n gpl works keep part of the source open and part closed. just look at linu= x distros. <br></div><br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-= left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left= : 1ex;"> The GPL expressily permits you to keep your seperate/independent works<br>p= roprietary "when you distribute them as separate works" (Section = 2 of the<br>GPL). So in the above example: if you consider your player soft= ware <br>independent and seperate enough (e.g. XVID is just an optional plugin t= o<br>the player), then you don't have to publish your player under the GPL.= <br>However, you _must_ distribute it as a seperate work then, that means t= he <br>XVID plugin cannot be distributed together with your proprietary player= . As<br>soon as you want to combinedly distribute your player with XVID, yo= u must<br>publish it as a whole under the GPL (see Section 2 of the GPL). <br><br>The 'mere aggregation' clause is no exception to this rule. It just= points<br>out that two entirely different works put onto the same data car= rier don't<br>create a derivative work under the GPL license. So you can=20 e.g. distribute<br>XVID together with Ad-Aware as part of a software collec= tion on the same<br>CD without running into any problem with the GPL...<br>= <br>Regards,<br>Michael<br><br><br>Quoting Chris <<a href=3D"mailto:xvid= @rebel.com.au"> [email protected]</a>>:<br><br>><br>> Christoph Lampert wrote:<br>= > > Hi,<br>> ><br>> >>On 3/9/06, Chris <<a href=3D"= mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br>><br>> = >>> <br>> >>>according to the GPL if my app loads xvid or similar t= hen it must be open<br>> >>>source.<br>> ><br>> ><b= r>> > No. GPL does not restrict the _usage_ of the codec in any kind.= If a <br>> > user has XviD installed on his/her machine, your program is f= ree to<br>> > use it.<br>><br>> I agree with this.<br>><br>&= gt;<br>> ><br>> > What you are not allowed to do is _distribute= _ XviD together with a <br>> > proprietary software, i.e. make a bundle for download,<br>>= ; > have your player's installer directly install XviD as well,<br>><= br>> No thats is quite incorrect.<br>><br>> You are referring to t= he mere aggregation of the work. That it is installed <br>> onto a machine by a<br>> common installer does not bring the wo= rks under the GPL.<br>><br>> from the gpl...<br>><br>> In addit= ion, mere aggregation of another work not based on the Program<br>> with= the Program (or with a work based on the Program) on a volume of <br>> a storage or distribution medium does not bring the other work und= er<br>> the scope of this License.<br>> ..........<br>><br>><br= >><br>> The gpl uses the words "based on" for a program to = come under the gpl it must <br>> be derived from<br>> the gpl'd works.<br>><br>><br>> f= rom section 0 of the GPL....<br>><br>> The "Program", below= , refers to any such program or work, and a "work based<br>> on the= Program" <br>> means either the Program or any derivative work under copyright la= w:<br>> that is to say, a work containing the Program or a portion of it= ,<br>> either verbatim or with modifications and/or translated into anot= her <br>> language. (Hereinafter, translation is included without= limitation in<br>> the term "modification".) Each = licensee is addressed as "you".<br>> .............<br>><br>= > Thus a work must be based upon at least in part the gpl'd software. Th= us if <br>> your program "Makes<br>> use of" but is not derived f= rom (think parent child relationship) then even<br>> static linking is a= n<br>> acceptable method of making use of the software without ever bein= g derived <br>> from the gpl'd<br>> software. I searched for the phrase static = or dynamic and neither are<br>> mentioned in the licence<br>> thus ne= ither or included nor excluded from the licence.<br>><br>> Clearly ma= king use of a codec does not fall into this category, even if they <br>> are distributed on<br>> the same medium.<br>><br>> Intere= stingly the video encoded using xvid MUST be gpl'd as it is clearly<br>>= "based upon or derived<br>> from" the gpl'd software. so all = videos encoded using xvid MUST carry the <br>> appropriate copyright<br>> and licence clearly displayed as is = specified in the GPL.<br>><br>><br>><br>> My error was to read = the FAQ it is in fact quite inaccurate in its portrayal<br>> of the lice= nce. the <br>> FAQ even on the <a href=3D"http://gnu.org">gnu.org</a> site is als= o innacurate and represents at best an<br>> idealised view of the<br>>= ; licence.<br>><br>> The licence is quite clearly in its design and i= ntent meant to prevent the <br>> use or modification<br>> of the open source software with the p= urpose of then making it closed source.<br>> in other words one<br>> = cannot take xvid make some minor changes call it chrisvid and publish it as <br>> their own work.<br>><br>> I am sorry for the bother I have c= aused. I should have read the licence<br>> itself rather than take<br>&g= t; the shortcut of relying on someones interpretation of the licence, ie Th= e gnu <br>> GPL faq.<br>><br>> Chris<br>> ___________________________= ____________________<br>> XviD-users mailing list<br>> <a href=3D"mai= lto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br>> <a href=3D"http://= list.xvid.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users"> http://list.xvid.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users</a><br>><br><br><br><br= ><br>_______________________________________________<br>XviD-users mailing = list<br><a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"http://list.xvid.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users">http://list.xv= id.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users</a><br></blockquote></div><br> ------=_Part_5706_27355935.1142762796942-- --===============1567852610== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ XviD-users mailing list [email protected] http://list.xvid.org/mailman/listinfo/xvid-users --===============1567852610==--