Archetypes needs Plone

The first message I found when searching for Archetypes+CMF includes
the following:

Christian Heimes wrote at 2004-8-23 19:21 +0200:
>Currently we are trying to keep Archetypes CMF compatible but nobody is
>really testing it with a pure CMF installation.

That was nearly two years ago. As of today's current releases,
Archetypes is no longer compatible with a pure CMF install. There's no
unit test for it- the Archetypes unit testing depends on PloneTestCase
- but there is example code to try out.

My test setup includes out-of-the-box Zope 2.9.3, python 2.4.2 +
Python Imaging Library + Archetypes 1.4.0-final

With CMFPlone 2.5 + its bundle, I can install examples AOK. I used an
external method instead of Portal Quickinstaller, to be fair.

With CMFCore (CMF-2.0.0) + its bundle and CMFFormController (2.0.4),
calling the example's "install" with an external method gives

  Module Products.Archetypes.Extensions.utils, line 414, in filterTypes
  AttributeError: listDefaultTypeInformation

As a new Zope developer, it took a little digging to discover the
preferred method of adding a custom content type, and took another day
to discover that Archetypes no longer works in a pure CMF site.

Please, please help future application developers by making clear that
Archetypes requires Plone- which it does, if it's being maintained and
tested only with Plone. There hasn't been interest in a CMF-agnostic
Archetypes for two years, might as well make it official. Put it in
the README, modify the project description where it says "Archetypes
is a Zope Product which simplifies the creation of new content types
under Zope 2 and the Content Management Framework (CMF)" and make it
say "...Zope 2 and Plone."

ps. before I get emails saying "just bite the bullet and install
Plone"- well- this is a documentation issue. As for my project and
what I'm going to use with it, I have to decide if the size and more
importantly- the complexity Plone adds- is worth it, since all I want
is the ability to run Archetypes, and I don't need anything else Plone
has. My app is rather simple, it could use CMF's workflow and
Archetypes' help but... let me put it this way: If Archetypes required
Smalltalk, but my project didn't require Smalltalk- yes it's a cool
thing, but should I add that dependency?

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