Re: Zope3 name

On mardi, f=E9v 11, 2003, at 20:23 Europe/Paris, Jim Fulton wrote:

>
> Paul Everitt wrote:
>> On Tuesday, Feb 11, 2003, at 11:07 Europe/Paris, seb bacon wrote:
>>> There has been a discussion about naming Zope3, which I would like=20=

>>> to revive.
>>>
>>> First (and what got me thinking about it again): was it appropriate=20=

>>> to call the pre-New-Year-release  an 'alpha'?  On the one hand, I=20
>>> know Jim is keen to keep up the momentum among developers.  On the=20=

>>> other, it suggests (to me) a level of maturity which the product has=20=

>>> not yet reached, which could damage perceptions from the outside.
>> I had a couple of business people, e.g. folks in the government, ask=20=

>> me such questions last week at the conference.
>
> What were the questions?

Things like, will my site still work, should I deploy a new application=20=

today or wait, can we use the expertise we've acquired, will Plone=20
work.  The first two were the big ones with decision makers.

>  > I'm sure my responses gave
>> the impression of some rather tortured tap dancing.
>
> I'm puzzled by this. I thought that the schedule I posted, the note=20
> that Rob
> posted, and out commitment for supporting the transition would have=20
> prepared
> you to answer questions, which is why I'm curious about the questions.

I'm puzzled that you're puzzled. :^)  The nature of the transition has=20=

been in a "we'll figure that out later" status.  Well, clearly I can't=20=

field too many questions with that stance.

My challenge is getting into the first level of detail beyond the broad=20=

strokes outlined in the two documents you mentioned.  Examples:

1) Will Zope 3 support the Zope 2 API, or even a subset?

2) Will Zope 2 support the Zope 3 API, or even a subset?  (This is=20
discussed below.)

3) If the community isn't interested in working on migration, will ZC=20
devote the resources to complete the job?

4) During 2003, developers will have three APIs to choose from (Zope 2,=20=

CMF, Zope 3).  Will they know when to choose one versus the other?

5) Will ZC participate in the ongoing development of Zope 2 and CMF,=20
keeping it "active" with (reasonably compelling) features until the=20
time Zope 3 is capable of doing all that Zope 2 + CMF can do?

The challenge for me is in the nature of itch-scratching.  As some of=20
these topics have come up, the reply has been "well, if somebody wants=20=

to do it or if a company pays for it, it will get done."  And that's=20
largely true.  But this weakens a bit the commitment made in the two=20
documents you cited.  Unless, of course, ZC will fill in the places=20
that don't attract development, but are necessary for smooth migration.

> Maybe we all (who are involved in answering these questions) need to =
to
> a better job of being armed with the answers.

True.

>> I think we have to give up on discussions of backporting.  There's=20
>> simply little interest amongst the core team for such an approach. =20=

>> It's a shame, because I think history has proven that such an=20
>> approach (forward or backwards) is Exhibition Number One in a=20
>> transition strategy. :^(
>
> I don't understsnd why you would say this.  I specifically discussed
> migrating some Zope 3 technologies back to Zope 2 as part of the=20
> transition
> strategy.

Hmm, then I completely misunderstood.  I was recalling a private=20
exchange you and I had in December when (at least I thought) you were=20
underwhelmed by such an idea.  I also was referencing comments made by=20=

others on the core team, in IRC and on this list.

My apologies, I certainly got this wrong.  If meaningful parts of Zope=20=

3 are introduced back into Zope 2, then we're in good shape.

>> Regarding 2.x, one part I'm not clear on is the status of 2.x.  Based=20=

>> on the ZC official stance, 2.x is not being "terminated", meaning,=20
>> applications will still be supported and new projects initiated.
>> However, is 2.x "end-of-lifed"?
>
> Someday, yes, but not today.
>
>  > Meaning, will new features be added?
>
> Yes. How long this will be the case depends on the needs and interests=20=

> of
> users and developers.

Ok, that's good news too.

This has been a very good email, thanks.

--Paul=