Re: Re: A strawman proposal for X.org & XFree86.org

On Sun, Mar 30, 2003 at 10:12:01PM +0400, Vadim Plessky wrote:
> On Sunday 30 March 2003 20:48, Christoph Hellwig wrote:
> |  On Sun, Mar 30, 2003 at 07:23:47PM +0400, Vadim Plessky wrote:
> |  > Well, GNOME and KDE cover together about 95% of Linux Desktops.
> |
> |  Where did you get this estimate from?
> 
> That number has been discussed/quoted many times.
> Estimation I have seen and feel comfortable with os that KDE has 60% share, 
> and GNOME - 30%, while the rest is splitted around other WMs or environments.
> My estimationn though that KDE has slightly higher share (about 65%), so 
> combined GNOME+KDE is about 95%

Well I'm glad we have an estimate that you feel comfortable with instead of a
solid emperical result. I don't know of any reliable studies done which
can give a number to this statistic. Forums polls just wont do for accurate
data.

> |
> |  > Should XFree86 make focus on 95% of its users or focus on needs of
> |  > minority?
> |
> |  XFree86 should not enforce policy on toolkits/windowmanagers _at all_.
> 
> Well, toolkit/desktop users want , say, window transparency - and developers 
> for those toolkits/desktops can't implement transparency until it's get done 
> on XFree86 level.
> Like it or not, but XFree86 has influence on all GUI-based Linux/*BSD apps.

Everything seems to always come down to transparency. In my option, this is a
small issue to the overall development of the XFree project. I think far to
much emphasis is put on this in arguments for server enhancements.

> |  successfull because it doesn't enforce policy.  You can use gnome/kde
> |  or twm+xterm over the same protocol, with the same hardware drivers and
> |  even use some gnome app under twm or the other way around.  Changing
> |  this is a very bad idea.
> 
> You can't use modern X apps (KDE, GNOME) with TWM, or other not NetWM-enabled 
> Window Manager. This is just one example.

While this is not even entirely true, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt
since _some_ things about these applications may not behave correctly in a
WM without NetWM support. This is not an example of how the X server needs
to be updated to meet the needs of the "95%" however. This is entirely a
protocol between one client and another.

Ben
-- 
I am damn unsatisfied to be killed in this way.

http://www.icculus.org/openbox/

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