Re: My visit to Campione d'Italia

yes 
nice
with you loud & clear

& yet even having all this fully clarified 
the tripoint situation itself still isnt crystal clear

all indications are that the brook bottom marks both
arbi & chit4bica

so perhaps the arbica tripoint isnt directly marked by
either rock
but might be the unmarked point where the drain passes
directly between these 2 rocks here
http://campione.enclaves.org/image/124-2462_img.jpg
or 
perhaps more likely 
the intersection point at the extreme lower right
corner of this pic
where the visible alignment of rock 14 & post 14 hits
the brook bottom

for i would trust both of them at least to be standing
directly upon chit
wouldnt you

& so the smaller stone may thus mark the arbi brook
bottom diagonally or even indirectly 
rather than orthogonally & directly
inasmuch as there do appear to be 1 or 2 other as yet
unexplained stone markers in this pic too

& wouldnt that drain outlet be about 7 meters from
rock 14

well not quite 7

so maybe the true tripoint & turnpoint is a bit off
frame there beyond the corner



& similarly 

with regard to the other dry campione tripoint of
arcalu
up near the northeast corner 
which btw i garbled into arluca in a previous post 
oops

in the first few paragraphs of this same 11th article
you quote
tho i cant necessarily make out all the german there
either 
the text does at least appear to place the other
arogno border in another brook bottom in the vicinity
of markers number 1 & or 2 
without mentioning its expected lugano counterpart by
name 
but rather a predecessor municipality named castagnola
instead
since this was castagnola commune before it became
lugano in 1972
as indicated here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Municipalities_of_the_canton_of_Ticino
so arcalu was arcaca from 1861 to 1972


but as we are still not necessarily able to nail
either of these tripoints
it certainly wouldnt hurt if someone could provide
perfectly smooth translations of these 2 most relevant
passages of the german text

--- "Lowell G. McManus" <[email protected]> wrote:

> If you will go to http://campione.enclaves.org/ and
> view the second page 
> of the "Elfer Anstand" of the 1861 treaty that
> delimits the boundary, 
> you will find in the very center of that page:
> 
>     Die Richtung von Nr. 13 zu Nr. 14 auf weitere
>     sieben Meter über Nr. 14 hinaus verfolgend,
>     kommt man zum Tobel genannt Valle della
>     Punta, und bei diesem hört die Grenze der
>     Gemeinde Arogno auf und bginnt diejenige
>     der schweizerischen Gemeinde Bisssone.
> 
>     Von besagtem Punkte an bezeichnet das Tobel
>     selbst auf eine Länge von 610 Meter, seinen
>     Krümmungen nach gemessen, die Grenze bis
>     zu seiner Kreuzung durch die Fahrstrasse
>     zwischen Campione und Bissone, wo eine
>     kleine Kapelle steht.
> 
> To me, this seems to say that CHIT runs, on the same
> bearing as between 
> rocks 13 and 14, seven meters onward past rock 14 ,
> then comes to the 
> Tobel Valle della Punta, where Arogno stops and
> Bissone begins.  From 
> there, it runs down the Tobel for 610 meters until
> it crosses the 
> Campione-Bissone road where a small chapel stands.
> 
> We thought that rock 14 was the southeast corner of
> Campione, but the 
> treaty says different.  This explains the curious
> markings on its top. 
> The dimple is on the long leg of the L, not at its
> corner.  This 
> indicates that the boundary runs on a ways before
> making the turn, just 
> as the treaty says.  So, the municipal rock in the
> background of the 
> photo seems to be the actual tripoint and the corner
> of Campione!
> 
> If you will look at the map at the enlarged
> black-and-white map at 
> http://campione.enclaves.org/ , you will see that
> the boundary does 
> indeed follow the valley, which the map calls
> "Posero," down from 14 to 
> the road crossing at 15.
> 
> Lowell G. McManus
> Leesville, Louisiana, USA
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "aletheia kallos" <aletheiak-/[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2006 6:10 PM
> Subject: Re: [BoundaryPoint] My visit to Campione
> d'Italia
> 
> 
> > in fact
> > & in all fairness to craig of mississauga
> > & with extra honors to lowell of leesville too for
> not
> > overplaying this point
> > it was already clear from craigs report that he
> had
> > indeed paid a call on this very arogno bissone
> > campione or arbica trimunicipal point in the
> course of
> > his hair raising ramble
> > by simply visiting the southeast corner of
> campione
> > along the way
> > for he says
> >> I continued along the road until it ended in a
> small
> > park. From here
> >> it was a very short walk to find the sign and
> > boundary stone in
> >> Campione d'Italia's southeast corner, and there
> was
> > an "L" marked in
> >> the top of the stone to indicate where the corner
> > stood.
> > so perhaps we can still look forward to his
> posting an
> > updated photo of this corner marker rock number 14
> > tho in fairness also to mats of lund
> > it would be extremely hard to improve in any way
> on
> > his earlier photo
> >
> http://campione.enclaves.org/image/124-2463_img.jpg
> > even tho a slight question remains about the exact
> > arbica tripoint location within it
> >
> > for is the tripoint simply centered in the top
> center
> > hole of the marker as i would guess
> > or could it be at the outer bend of the ell shaped
> > turnpoint diagram
> > or midway between the outer & inner corners of
> this
> > thick line
> > or at the inner corner point of it
> > or even somewhere else entirely among these
> perhaps as
> > many of 4 different markers
> >
> http://campione.enclaves.org/image/124-2462_img.jpg
> > & thus not on this ell diagram nor even on this
> ell
> > marker at all
> >
> > --- aletheia kallos <aletheiak-/[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> sharp shooting maestro
> >> for thats the international quaternary tripoint
> of
> >> chit2lmti3colg4arbica youve found there
> >> thus obviating any need to find a more obscure
> >> quintenary one within the campione city
> >> administration
> >>
> >> --- "Lowell G. McManus" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Mike D. wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > campione doesnt appear to have any major
> >> tripoints
> >> > > as it is situated entirely within the lugano
> >> > district
> >> > > of the ticino canton of switzerland
> >> >
> >> > It does have at least one minor tripoint,
> however.
> >>
> >> > On the page at
> >> > http://campione.enclaves.org/ , please see the
> >> left
> >> > photo under "Marker
> >> > 14," which is the southeast corner of Campione.
> >> In
> >> > addition to the CHIT
> >> > monument at the base of the red signpost, there
> is
> >> a
> >> > smaller rock
> >> > marking the bounds of the Swiss municipalities
> of
> >> > Arogno and Bissone.
> >> >
> >> > Lowell G. McManus
> >> > Leesville, Louisiana, USA
> >
> >
> >
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> 
> 



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