Re: beyondhom LM taken in F Series
"'Dr. J Rozencwajg, NMD' [email protected] [beyondhomeopathy]" <[email protected]> Tue, 15 Jul 2014 14:10:07 +1200
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--------------070805000900090103020201 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit An F series consists of 3, 5, 8 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, nothing else. Now, you are asking interesting and complicated questions for which I have no answer. I used LMs for around 10 years, used to skip potencies and used often only the odd ones but in dilution glasses. I do not know how Will Taylor got this equivalence system, and I do not think it is wise to look at equivalences as the systems are based on different dilutional methodologies, with different actions in depth, speed and safety. The F series is nothing else but C potencies (or X) prescribed according to a law of nature. How it would work with LMs, well, as I said, try experiment with other people and let us know. Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD. "The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind" www.naturamedica.co.nz On 15/07/2014 1:49 p.m., [email protected] [beyondhomeopathy] wrote: > > Dr. Joe, > When your order an F series from Homeodel or other supplier, what > potencies do they provide? (not shown on websites) > Do you get the same set of potencies from any supplier? > Meaning, have you instructed pharmacies that an F series must consist > of these potencies? Or what is in a FULL set? > 3C, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, ... ?? > LM is considered "weak" when compared on a mathematical scale to C > since they only span 5C to 73C but their action is much > stronger/deeper than their math equivalent C's because the dilution is > 1:50,000 vs 1:100 which acts differently, supposedly gentler and > deeper than if taking as their C equivalents. > Using this table, from Will Taylor's WHN dosing and potency course, > differs from yours, as recently posted by Kari Kindem on SN: > LM1 – 5C > LM2 – 8C > LM3 – 10C > LM4 – 12C > LM5 – 15C > LM6 – 18C > … > LM12 – 31C > … > LM30 – 73C > Varun had commented on this: > > /*Dilutional equivalent doesn't tell the potency,* as the "absorption > coefficient of alcohol" is not taken into account in this... Alcohol > is expected to absorb more power on more dilution (including > succession), and that's what happens in LM scale... So, each LM > absorbs far more power than what happens in each C scale dilution, coz > of more dilution ratio... The difference is quite a lot, 1 : 100, and > 1 : 50,000... That's why LM potencies are scared too, even otherwise > in general, and considered more strong... Now you can say LM potencies > rather act more gently... Then that's also true, and I won't like to > go into the details of why both the aspects hold, (provided used > rightly)... > > And you are assuming that, "Each LM potency goes up by around 2C - per > each LM level increasing." Let me know your mathematics behind this. > Quite difficult to even expect or assume this, as the difference in > dilution is 1 : 100 to 1 : 50,000./ > // > Irene De Villiers wrote in 2011: > /"That said one could in theory use LMs in F series - or any chosen > potency in F series....it is the F series that matters, not the X, C, > LM, etc aspect. > But the C potencies in series are the ones most studied and proved."/ > http://www.otherhealth.com/homeopathy-list-discussion/11481-lms.html > Dr.Joe wrote: > /"So how do you plan to do that? LM1, LM3, LM5, LM8, etc,...? it is of > course possible but then you miss out on the intermediate LM potencies > that are prepared differently than the C or X potencies and on the slow, > constant progression and exponential multiplication of the C potencies > given in an F series."/ > I would start LM3 then go LM5 which based on Fibonacci, should then > act like an LM15 (?) > Here at first I'm only skipping LM4, which should be tolerable, and I > would know fairly quickly if that works. > Not clear on why you feel missing out on intermediate LM potencies and > their different preparation would matter in Fibonacci theory? > Possibly, I'll miss out on the gentler action by skipping a gradual > progression of LMs > You're comparing mathematical equivalency between LM and C, by showing > what an LM equates to as a C and then what the resulting extrapolation > in C potency theoretical action is when taken as Fibonacci. > But LM action is different because the dilutions are different (1:100 > C, 1: 50000 LM) > Without Fibonacci, LMs taken in sequential order from LM1 to LM30 have > much stronger/deeper/gentler action than if taken as their C > equivalents from 5C to 73C. > So why compare LM to C if taken in F series?? > They already don't compare in action when not taken as Fibonacci. > For example, taken as F series: LM3, LM5 (should act as LM15), LM8 > (should act like LM120) > When equating to C, LM3=10C, LM5=15C which are not Fibonacci and > the action shouldn't extrapolate as Fibonacci C's do. > So taking LM as F series shouldn't work if it your theory depends on > it's C equivalency for it to work > Then again, doesn't seem likely you would only need LM3, 5 and 8 to > reach LM120 by Fibonacci, which would be considered quite high in action. > I don't know if by taking an LM in F series I'm defeating the inherent > nature of LMs, mainly best for daily administration necessary for long > term management of chronic diseases which besides being miasmatic are > genetic in themselves. > Most of the cases discussed using F series have seemed to resolve > themselves after series use and you once mentioned mostly having > non-miasmatic cases of your ~ 1000 cases. > I don't expect final resolution or "cure" just hoping to speed up > whatever help I'm receiving from the new antipsoric remedy. > Having moved upto LM25 on my constitutional/core antipsoric remedy and > LM13 on an antimiasmatic nosode, maybe I can bypass having to > do a monthly LM progression with a new remedy I've only taken as 200C, > 2 pills, 25 water doses. > Since it takes over a week to receive from Helios or Homeodel, . > I'll order LM3, 5 and to play it safe LM6, 7, 8. > If I run into problems skipping LM4 after starting LM5, I'll continue > on LM 6 in non F series mode > I don't think it will be too detrimental to skip LM4 for a test. ;) > Susan > -----Original Message----- > From: Dr. J Rozencwajg, NMD <[email protected]> > To: healthyinfo6 <[email protected]> > Sent: Sun, Jul 13, 2014 10:31 pm > Subject: Re: [H] LM taken in F Series > > LM/Q are linear potencies. > > LM1 is the equivalent of a 5C with a constant multiplicator of 2 (the > maths are in "The Potency", page 152 and 153) > LM2 = 2*6C > . > . > . > LM10 = 2*14C > LM20 = 2*24C, etc..... > > So how do you plan to do that? LM1, LM3, LM5, LM8, etc,...? it is of > course possible but then you miss out on the intermediate LM potencies > that are prepared differently than the C or X potencies and on the slow, > constant progression and exponential multiplication of the C potencies > given in an F series. > > I am not saying it would not work, I have no idea and would welcome any > trial of combining both systems. It might give yet another avenue of > prescribing.....practitioners need to try... > > Who has published cases that do not need to go past 55C????? the whole > point of doing the FULL series is to NOT miss any potential action of > extremely (admittedly calculated) potencies. > > My own experience has been that if I stop somewhere in the middle, I > have eventually to complete the series to get rid of residual complaints > still covered by the same remedy, as described in the book. > > But if it appeals to anybody, who prevents you to try, have a few > hundred cases and publish the results. > > Joe. > > Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD. > > "The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind" > > www.naturamedica.co.nz <http://www.naturamedica.co.nz> > > On 14/07/2014 1:27 p.m.,[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> wrote: > > Is there any logical reason LMs can not gain the amplification benefit when > taken in F series? > > > > They're already immediately available for order at least upto LM34 at Helios > for many remedies, upto LM100 for others > > > > 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233 > > > > 3 = 3 > > 5 is 3×5 = 15 equivalent > > 8 is 15×8 = 120 equivalent > > 13 is 120×13 = 1560 equivalent > > 21 is 1560×21 = 32760 equivalent > > 34 is 32760x 34 = 1113840 equivalent > > 55 is 1113840x 55 = 61216200 equivalent > > > > The Fibonacci sequence is independent whether it's X, C or LM. > > > > The few cases I've read haven't needed to go past 55C > > > > I've finished a new 200C in 25 water doses over a month. > > > > Generally I'd move from 200C to LM4 and progress as usual but feel like > experimenting and start from LM3 or LM5 and go F > > > > Right now I'll bide time with a 201C > > > > Surely would save a-lot of $$$! > > > > Susan > > _______________________________________________ > > Homeopathy Mailing List > >[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >http://lists.homeolist.com/mailman/listinfo/homeopathy > > --------------070805000900090103020201 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd"> <html> <head> </head> <body style="background-color: #fff;"> <span style="display:none"> </span> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStartT|**|-~--> <div id="ygrp-mlmsg" style="position:relative;"> <div id="ygrp-msg" style="z-index: 1;"> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEndT|**|-~--> <div id="ygrp-text" > <p> <div class="moz-cite-prefix">An F series consists of 3, 5, 8 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, nothing else.<br> <br> Now, you are asking interesting and complicated questions for which I have no answer.<br> <br> I used LMs for around 10 years, used to skip potencies and used often only the odd ones but in dilution glasses.<br> <br> I do not know how Will Taylor got this equivalence system, and I do not think it is wise to look at equivalences as the systems are based on different dilutional methodologies, with different actions in depth, speed and safety.<br> <br> The F series is nothing else but C potencies (or X) prescribed according to a law of nature. How it would work with LMs, well, as I said, try experiment with other people and let us know.<br> <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD. "The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind" <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.naturamedica.co.nz">www.naturamedica.co.nz</a></pre> On 15/07/2014 1:49 p.m., <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a> [beyondhomeopathy] wrote:<br> </div> <blockquote cite="mid:[email protected]" type="cite"> <span> </span> <div id="ygrp-text"> <p><font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> </font></p> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"><font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_1_538f6c69-f30c-4f51-ad03-2ec725b2b4d0"> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_1_8662d422-ee3e-429f-a70d-bb34b7a8d3da"> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_1_4ed5c7a6-0c3d-4095-93dc-5d5738e8b793"> <font face="arial" size="2" color="black"> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_1_2a6bdaf9-de31-43de-b02a-1a22062d7c0b"> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_1_929e4334-3bab-48ea-89eb-82d854707257"> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_1_6350083b-d85b-45f6-b717-63b7eae422d0"> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2" color="black"> <div><font style="background-color: transparent;">Dr. Joe,</font></div> <div> </div> <div><font style="background-color: transparent;">When your order an F series from Homeodel or other supplier, what potencies do they provide? (not shown on websites)</font></div> <div> </div> <div>Do you get the same set of potencies from any supplier?</div> <div> </div> <div>Meaning, have you instructed pharmacies that an F series must consist of these potencies? Or what is in a FULL set?</div> <div>3C, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, ... ??</div> <div> </div> <div>LM is considered "weak" when compared on a mathematical scale to C since they only span 5C to 73C but their action is much stronger/deeper than their math equivalent C's because the dilution is 1:50,000 vs 1:100 which acts differently, supposedly gentler and deeper than if taking as their C equivalents.</div> <div> </div> <div>Using this table, from Will Taylor's WHN dosing and potency course, differs from yours, as recently posted by Kari Kindem on SN:</div> <div> </div> <div>LM1 – 5C<br> LM2 – 8C<br> LM3 – 10C<br> LM4 – 12C<br> LM5 – 15C<br> LM6 – 18C<br> …<br> LM12 – 31C<br> …<br> LM30 – 73C</div> <div> </div> <div>Varun had commented on this:</div> <div><br> <em> <strong>Dilutional equivalent doesn't tell the potency,</strong> as the "absorption coefficient of alcohol" is not taken into account in this... Alcohol is expected to absorb more power on more dilution (including succession), and that's what happens in LM scale... So, each LM absorbs far more power than what happens in each C scale dilution, coz of more dilution ratio... The difference is quite a lot, 1 : 100, and 1 : 50,000... That's why LM potencies are scared too, even otherwise in general, and considered more strong... Now you can say LM potencies rather act more gently... Then that's also true, and I won't like to go into the details of why both the aspects hold, (provided used rightly)...<br> <br> And you are assuming that, "Each LM potency goes up by around 2C - per each LM level increasing." Let me know your mathematics behind this. Quite difficult to even expect or assume this, as the difference in dilution is 1 : 100 to 1 : 50,000.</em></div> <div><em></em> </div> <div>Irene De Villiers wrote in 2011:</div> <div> </div> <div><em>"That said one could in theory use LMs in F series - or any chosen <br> potency in F series....it is the F series that matters, not the X, C, <br> LM, etc aspect.<br> But the C potencies in series are the ones most studied and proved."</em></div> <div> </div> <div><a moz="true" href="http://www.otherhealth.com/homeopathy-list-discussion/11481-lms.html">http://www.otherhealth.com/homeopathy-list-discussion/11481-lms.html</a></div> <div> </div> <div> </div> <div>Dr.Joe wrote: </div> <div> </div> <div><em>"So how do you plan to do that? LM1, LM3, LM5, LM8, etc,...? it is of <br> course possible but then you miss out on the intermediate LM potencies <br> that are prepared differently than the C or X potencies and on the slow, <br> constant progression and exponential multiplication of the C potencies <br> given in an F series."</em></div> <div> </div> <div>I would start LM3 then go LM5 which based on Fibonacci, should then act like an LM15 (?)</div> <div>Here at first I'm only skipping LM4, which should be tolerable, and I would know fairly quickly if that works.</div> <div> </div> <div>Not clear on why you feel missing out on intermediate LM potencies and their different preparation would matter in Fibonacci theory?</div> <div>Possibly, I'll miss out on the gentler action by skipping a gradual progression of LMs</div> <div> </div> <div>You're comparing mathematical equivalency between LM and C, by showing what an LM equates to as a C and then what the resulting extrapolation in C potency theoretical action is when taken as Fibonacci. </div> <div> </div> <div>But LM action is different because the dilutions are different (1:100 C, 1: 50000 LM)</div> <div> </div> <div>Without Fibonacci, LMs taken in sequential order from LM1 to LM30 have much stronger/deeper/gentler action than if taken as their C equivalents from 5C to 73C. </div> <div>So why compare LM to C if taken in F series?? </div> <div>They already don't compare in action when not taken as Fibonacci.</div> <div> </div> <div>For example, taken as F series: LM3, LM5 (should act as LM15), LM8 (should act like LM120)</div> <div> When equating to C, LM3=10C, LM5=15C which are not Fibonacci and the action shouldn't extrapolate as Fibonacci C's do.</div> <div>So taking LM as F series shouldn't work if it your theory depends on it's C equivalency for it to work</div> <div> </div> <div>Then again, doesn't seem likely you would only need LM3, 5 and 8 to reach LM120 by Fibonacci, which would be considered quite high in action.</div> <div> </div> <div>I don't know if by taking an LM in F series I'm defeating the inherent nature of LMs, mainly best for daily administration necessary for long term management of chronic diseases which besides being miasmatic are genetic in themselves. </div> <div> </div> <div>Most of the cases discussed using F series have seemed to resolve themselves after series use and you once mentioned mostly having non-miasmatic cases of your ~ 1000 cases.</div> <div> </div> <div>I don't expect final resolution or "cure" just hoping to speed up whatever help I'm receiving from the new antipsoric remedy.</div> <div> </div> <div>Having moved upto LM25 on my constitutional/core antipsoric remedy and LM13 on an antimiasmatic nosode, maybe I can bypass having to do a monthly LM progression with a new remedy I've only taken as 200C, 2 pills, 25 water doses.</div> <div> </div> <div>Since it takes over a week to receive from Helios or Homeodel, .</div> <div>I'll order LM3, 5 and to play it safe LM6, 7, 8.</div> <div>If I run into problems skipping LM4 after starting LM5, I'll continue on LM 6 in non F series mode</div> <div>I don't think it will be too detrimental to skip LM4 for a test. ;)</div> <div> </div> <div>Susan </div> <div> </div> <div> </div> <div> -----Original Message-----<br> From: Dr. J Rozencwajg, NMD <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email protected]"><[email protected]></a><br> To: healthyinfo6 <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email protected]"><[email protected]></a><br> Sent: Sun, Jul 13, 2014 10:31 pm<br> Subject: Re: [H] LM taken in F Series<br> <br> </div> <div style="color: black;font-family: arial,helvetica;font-size: 10pt;"> <div id="AOLMsgPart_0_221cdbae-c983-46e1-bbe3-131401e63ccb" style="margin: 0px;color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family: Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, Sans-Serif;font-size: 12px;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"> <pre style="font-size: 9pt;"><tt>LM/Q are linear potencies. LM1 is the equivalent of a 5C with a constant multiplicator of 2 (the maths are in "The Potency", page 152 and 153) LM2 = 2*6C . . . LM10 = 2*14C LM20 = 2*24C, etc..... So how do you plan to do that? LM1, LM3, LM5, LM8, etc,...? it is of course possible but then you miss out on the intermediate LM potencies that are prepared differently than the C or X potencies and on the slow, constant progression and exponential multiplication of the C potencies given in an F series. I am not saying it would not work, I have no idea and would welcome any trial of combining both systems. It might give yet another avenue of prescribing.....practitioners need to try... Who has published cases that do not need to go past 55C????? the whole point of doing the FULL series is to NOT miss any potential action of extremely (admittedly calculated) potencies. My own experience has been that if I stop somewhere in the middle, I have eventually to complete the series to get rid of residual complaints still covered by the same remedy, as described in the book. But if it appeals to anybody, who prevents you to try, have a few hundred cases and publish the results. Joe. Dr. J. Rozencwajg, NMD. "The greatest enemy of any science is a closed mind" <a moz="true" href="http://www.naturamedica.co.nz" target="_blank">www.naturamedica.co.nz</a> On 14/07/2014 1:27 p.m., <a moz="true" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a> wrote: > Is there any logical reason LMs can not gain the amplification benefit when taken in F series? > > They're already immediately available for order at least upto LM34 at Helios for many remedies, upto LM100 for others > > 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233 > > 3 = 3 > 5 is 3×5 = 15 equivalent > 8 is 15×8 = 120 equivalent > 13 is 120×13 = 1560 equivalent > 21 is 1560×21 = 32760 equivalent > 34 is 32760x 34 = 1113840 equivalent > 55 is 1113840x 55 = 61216200 equivalent > > The Fibonacci sequence is independent whether it's X, C or LM. > > The few cases I've read haven't needed to go past 55C > > I've finished a new 200C in 25 water doses over a month. > > Generally I'd move from 200C to LM4 and progress as usual but feel like experimenting and start from LM3 or LM5 and go F > > Right now I'll bide time with a 201C > > Surely would save a-lot of $$$! > > Susan > _______________________________________________ > Homeopathy Mailing List > <a moz="true" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a> > <a moz="true" href="http://lists.homeolist.com/mailman/listinfo/homeopathy" target="_blank">http://lists.homeolist.com/mailman/listinfo/homeopathy</a> </tt></pre> </div> <!-- end of AOLMsgPart_0_221cdbae-c983-46e1-bbe3-131401e63ccb --> </div> </font> </div> </div> </font> </div> </div> </font> </div> </div> </font> </div> </div> </font> </div> </div> </font> </div> </font></div> </div> <!-- end group email --> </blockquote> <br> </p> </div> <!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~--> <div style="color: #fff; height: 0;">__._,_.___</div> <div style="clear:both"> </div> <div id="fromDMARC" style="margin-top: 10px;"> <hr style="height:2px ; border-width:0; color:#E3E3E3; background-color:#E3E3E3;"> Posted by: "Dr. J Rozencwajg, NMD" <[email protected]> <hr style="height:2px ; border-width:0; color:#E3E3E3; background-color:#E3E3E3;"> </div> <div style="clear:both"> </div> <table cellspacing=4px style="margin-top: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px; color: #2D50FD;"> <tbody> <tr> <td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; font-weight: bold; padding: 7px 5px 5px;" > <a style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD" href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/beyondhomeopathy/conversations/messages/19199;_ylc=X3oDMTJvOHJuam5mBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjA0BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTE4OTg3MwRtc2dJZAMxOTE5OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzE0MDUzOTAyNDU-?act=reply&messageNum=19199">Reply via web post</a> </td> <td>•</td> <td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;" > <a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Re%3A%20beyondhom%20LM%20taken%20in%20F%20Series" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;"> Reply to sender </a> </td> <td>•</td> <td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;"> <a href="mailto:[email protected]?subject=Re%3A%20beyondhom%20LM%20taken%20in%20F%20Series" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD"> Reply to group </a> </td> <td>•</td> <td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;" > <a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/beyondhomeopathy/conversations/newtopic;_ylc=X3oDMTJjMWg0bGN1BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjA0BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTE4OTg3MwRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0MDUzOTAyNDU-" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD">Start a New Topic</a> </td> <td>•</td> <td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;color: #2D50FD;" > <a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/beyondhomeopathy/conversations/topics/19196;_ylc=X3oDMTM0OW92cmpwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjA0BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTE4OTg3MwRtc2dJZAMxOTE5OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0MDUzOTAyNDUEdHBjSWQDMTkxOTY-" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;">Messages in this topic</a> (4) </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> <!------- Start Nav Bar ------> <div id="ygrp-grfd" style="font-family: Verdana; font-size: 12px; padding: 15px 0;"> <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> The Healing of Humanity is our ultimate goal.<BR> The opinions expressed by posters on this list are the responsibility of the poster and do not reflect the opinion of the owner.Suggestions given on the list are not to be taken as prescriptions. <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| --> </div> <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> <div id="ygrp-vital" style="background-color: #f2f2f2; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 10px;"> <span id="vithd" style="font-weight: bold; color: #333; text-transform: uppercase; "><a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/beyondhomeopathy/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJjOTBjbGtwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjA0BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTE4OTg3MwRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzE0MDUzOTAyNDU-" style="text-decoration: none;">Visit Your Group</a></span> <ul style="list-style-type: none; margin: 0; padding: 0; display: inline;"> </ul> </div> <div id="ft" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 11px; margin-top: 5px; padding: 0 2px 0 0; clear: both;"> <a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo;_ylc=X3oDMTJiZTFtYmk3BF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzM5MjA0BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTE4OTg3MwRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTQwNTM5MDI0Ng--" style="float: left;"><img src="http://l.yimg.com/ru/static/images/yg/img/email/new_logo/logo-groups-137x15.png" height="15" width="137" alt="Yahoo! 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