Re: amazon and filtering

At 10:48 AM -0500 3/31/08, Elizabeth Burton wrote:
>
>Fifteen percent of whatever discount the publisher gives at LSI goes
>to Ingram/LSI for overhead, just as with any other distributor/
>wholesaler. The balance of the discount set by the publisher is what
>gets passed on to the third-party vendor. I discussed this in depth on
>Pub-Forum, as I also did why Amazon wants 55%--they're already getting
>that from "regular" publishers and so are well within their rights to
>demand it of any other publisher wishing to do business with them.
>Those who don't want to give that much can use Advantage or Marketplace.


First, last time I checked with my friends and former coworkers at major New York publishers, Amazon is NOT getting 55% from them. I can't believe that is true without some evidence to show that it is.

How do you know they are getting 55% from say Random House or Penguin or Harper Collins?

Regardless, this begs the question of whether or not Amazon actually NEEDS a high discount, and even whether publishers can give them such a discount legally!!

Given the high discounts that Amazon gives its online customers, I'd say they don't actually need a 55% discount. Their costs are clearly lower than those of brick-and-mortar retailers, and the resulting discounts that they give to consumers are so much higher than what brick-and-mortar stores give that its hard to believe they need the discount to keep up with B&N or someone.

Legally, in the US at least, publishers, like all manufacturers are generally required to give all similar customers similar pricing. So if I give one Internet retailer a 40% discount, I must give all other Internet retailers that same discount.

In fact, the American Booksellers Association sued the largest book publishers over this very issue in the 1980s (because of discounts given to Barnes & Noble).

So the idea that Amazon can get a discount from the largest book publishers that another Internet retailer (such as B&N) or even a small Internet retailer or a bookstore, seems doubtful to me.



>
>And you keep saying Amazon is saying people can only print at their
>facility. First, their "facility" is a printing plant in their main
>warehouse, and they aren't saying that at all. They're saying if you
>want a POD book to be available for direct sale at Amazon you must
>allow them to print it on-site. That part of the business, however, is
>under the aegis of Booksurge, so the actual arrangement is made
>through them. Most of it is just legalities that have to be observed.

Are you sure about this?

BookSurge is located in North Carolina -- and I don't think Amazon's facility is located there (or at least it wasn't before it purchased BookSurge). If I remember correctly, Amazon's main facility was in Washington State.

Amazon then got better delivery times and availability by having INGRAM BOOKS and BAKER & TAYLOR drop ship orders from their facilities.

When did Amazon expand to having its own major wharehouses around the country, and, more importantly, why would it?



>
>There's nothing monopolistic about it.


I agree. Its not "monopolistic." But it is anti-competitive.

They are connecting one part of the business (selling books to consumers) with another part of the business (printing books for publishers).

I've heard your arguments, but I can't agree that there is any good need for this.

As far as I can tell I don't get any added benefit by using BookSurge. Give me an added benefit, and I'll happily take it.

Instead, Amazon is trying to win this business by taking away a benefit (listing on Amazon) from targeted customers and making it plain to them that they loose the benefit simply because they haven't seen any other benefit in BookSurge. Of course customers feel manipulated.

I'll say it again. Give me a benefit that makes it worth the switch. As it is, I've been shifting titles to Ingram from BookSurge -- because I get a benefit -- increased sales -- that I don't get from BookSurge/Amazon.

I'll probably end up with most titles listed in both systems -- which is probably what BookSurge wants. But I still feel like BookSurge is trying to force customers to do what they wouldn't otherwise because BookSurge doesn't and hasn't been able to figure out how to match the benefits of Ingram.


>They aren't trying to prevent
>people from using other printers--and couldn't if they wanted to.

No, they are just trying to prevent publishers from using other POD services for books that are sold on Amazon.


<snip>

>
>Kent: They can tell because Booksurge/Amazon DOESN'T use a barcode.
>Most other printers don't either, but the majority of the publishers
>and book developers Amazon is focused on use LSI.


I'm not saying that they can't tell. I'm saying that they don't check and aren't likely to bother.

Tell me who at Amazon is opening the books to look and see if the barcode is there! Doing so interrupts the workflow and costs money.

Kent



>Liz
>Elizabeth Burton, Executive Editor
>Zumaya Publications LLC



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