Re: Re: Amazon remotely deletes 1984

On Tue, Jul 21, 2009 at 9:09 AM, Marion Gropen<[email protected]> wrote:
>
> The publisher didn't upload the copies, that's why they were yanked.
> (I'm not sure about this, but I THINK it was a pirate.)

This is my understanding of what happened:

Orwell's books are in the public domain in parts of Europe, where
copyright is Life + 50 years; they are not in the public domain in the
US. The books had been made available in Mobipocket format in a
European bookstore, and since Amazon owns Mobi, they grab all Mobi
books as Kindle books as well. Amazon didn't realize the book wasn't
legal to sell in the US.

This is different from the case a few weeks ago, where someone
uploaded several of Ayn Rand's books, and Amazon deleted/refunded for
those. In the Orwell case, the books were legitimately uploaded by the
publisher--Amazon just didn't check if it had the right to
redistribute them in another region.

Both of these incidents say a lot about Amazon's confirmation
processes before they sell ebooks.

>> If someone uses a photo he/she doesn't have rights to use in a publication,
>> the author (or in the case of magazines and like ventures, the publisher) is
>> liable. Readers who purchased the magazine in question do not have
>> to turn their copies in or be sued.
>
> Only for practical reasons.

No, for very solid legal reasons.

A court could've ordered the deletion of the illegally-sold copies.
(Note: The purchasers broke no laws. It's not illegal to own material
that infringes on copyright; it's just illegal to sell or distribute
it. Only Amazon & the illegal uploaders, if any, are liable for
lawsuits/criminal charges here.)

But the potential of a court ordering the return/removal of copies, is
not the same as a store (Amazon) having the right to remove those same
copies, without permission from the customers.

If a clothing store accidentally sells me a Calvin Klein jacket two
weeks before it's supposed to hit the market, at half the price it's
supposed to cost, that store doesn't have the right to enter my house
and remove it. A court might rule that the stock clerk who put the
items out for sale is liable for the damages to CK's fall line sales,
and that the items need to be returned... but until that *court order*
exists, the store loses control of the item as soon as they accept
payment, no matter how wrong it was to allow it for sale.

The issue isn't the removal of the ebooks--it's who has the right to
remove them. Amazon's TOS says that once you buy the book, you have
the right to a permanent copy of it. They don't get to say "oh, unless
we sold it to you by mistake" at random intervals.

This is a case of Amazon trying to appease copyright holders, hoping
they won't sue, by screwing over its customers. Amazon made the
mistake here, and they're expecting that customers have less ability
to punish them for it than the copyright owners do.

-- 
"I follow Eris blindly in all things. That She is the Goddess of Chaos
simplifies this immensely."  -- Christian the Pagan


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