Re: A washingtonpost.com article from: [email protected]

Hi Srihari,
          I definitely concur with u in this point of
Casteism by various political parties in TN and all over.
esp by Ramadoss. It is not a good sign at all. But ADMK is
not far beyond in this matter. I am not sure if you choose
to ignore it or not aware of it. ADMK is a active supporter
of part. community. Many indicators of this are constant
good showing by ADMK ( even in this election, ADMK vote
share has increased by a few %) in south Tamilnadu and one
more fact is around 70+ candidates out of 140 odd Assembly
seats are from that community. Is that a coincidence?? It
can't be. What is ur say on this??? 

Jai Hind.
Jaimv




--- Yamanoor Srihari <yamanoor-/[email protected]> wrote:
> Mayil and Sethu, I am quite happy that we are having this
> discussion. I am quite as shocked as everyone else is. I
> am copying this group [email protected] which I
> wish to dedicate exclusively for such discussions, and
> request both of you to join the group.
>  
> With Jayalalitha, I agree about poor candidate selection
> and also her arrogance combined with the problems of
> Rajni and Thirunavukarasu
>  
> However, one other point has been ignored, and atleast
> this time Jaya didnt slip into the mire. The point is
> casteism. Increasingly we see the Vanniyars forming a
> belt and similarly, other castes are increasingly playing
> an ugly role in TN politics. So in spite of good things
> like teaching the government officers a good lesson, Jaya
> lost (not withstanding the problems she herself created)
> because of caste....this will be very very ugly a trend
> in the future. 
>  
> In AP, you have to understand the people were naturally
> tired of CBN. He never even showed interest in the rest
> of the state, and this was expected. For sometime I
> worked with an IAS officer who is a fellow here who told
> me how Naidu is interested only in IT and numbers and how
> the unscruplous among the beauracracy learnt to fool him
> by making up numbers. This angered the people a lot and
> they put him down.
>  
> Also, we have been discussing (me and some of my friends,
> also in the group) that India did undergo a form of false
> growth, where certain populations and groups, especially
> the erstwhile middle class is gaining grounds through
> strong education which puts them higher up in the work
> force and leaves the poor of India behind, with a much
> larger gap to share with  a much larger group of people.
> This effect, a big exaggerated has exacerbated the
> situation and was cause to the loss of the election.
>  
> Finally, no one thought they were doing big harm by
> playing the poker game of anti - incumbency. Sonia Gandhi
> did not win because Indians think being ruled by
> foreigners is fine, or because people thought she is
> great. It is because people made the stupid mistake of
> not looking at the big picture of things. Now it will
> appear as if foreign origin is not an issue, which is a
> very bad perception. 
>  
> We are in the largest mess that we ever could be, and I
> always wonder how one man could be so clairvoyant -
> Mahatma Gandhi...
>  
> I know I have not addressed all the issues and we have
> many more coming as to whether this situation can be
> fixed at all or not...and we should beat them out one
> after the other.
>  
> Thanks
>  
> Srihari
> 
> Sethu Raghavan <meetsethu-/[email protected]> wrote:
> Quite true Mayil, I discussed this with Hari yesterday
> and we agreed that its more the foolishness of the
> people who voted.
> 
> As you said alliance played a crucial role in all the
> states..People normally voted for the local candidate
> unmindful of who will become PM. There are some
> interesting points to note
> 
> 1.Almost all of the left parties including DMK,MDMK
> opposed Sonia because of her foreign origin. Even
> Mulayam didnt not support for the same reason in 1998.
> Sharad Pawar created NCP because of that reason. Now
> see whats happening..no body has any problem with
> that..
> 
> 2.Already left parties started to oppose the
> disinvestment of PSU's which are badly managed.If you
> have entered one of the PSU's like BHEL you know how
> much it stinks...no wonder that BSE lost Rs.52 Billion
> in 2 days ...
> 
> 3.I really think that the alliance will not lost for 5
> years. Its a mis-guided attempt to put a foreigner
> into the hot seat with nuclear controls....
> 
> I am also really confused and angry with the
> masses...certainly as a person who lived in hyderabad
> for one year,I would not vote TDP out of
> power...Cyberbad will become cypherbad again.
> 
> Sethu
> 
> 
> --- Jai Sivanantham wrote:
> > Hi Sethu,
> > I was waiting to discuss with some one but cud
> > nt
> > find a person. I wud like to include srihari in the
> > loop
> > and learn what his views are too. 
> > 
> > You wont believe i was shocked after seeing the
> > results.
> > the first shock was that the DMK had swept polls in
> > TN,
> > without a single seat for ADMK+. How cud that be
> > possible?
> > next huge blow was from Central, that vajpayee had
> > lost. I
> > cant come to terms with the fact Vajpayee is going
> > to be
> > the Oppn. leader and the worst is some italian maid
> > is
> > going to be India's PM. To say the least people
> > didnt know
> > what they wud were doing. I am not a fan of Jaya but
> > i
> > wanted ADMK+ to win this time due to strong support
> > for
> > vajpayee.
> > 
> > Atleast some of the reasons for failure in TN were
> > 1. Ofcourse the strong alliance of the oppn.
> > 2. Poor candidate selection of Jaya. (this is
> > evident from
> > the fact that dinakaran lost periyakulam by 22,000
> > votes
> > compared to other constituencies were the margins
> > were
> > huge)
> > 3. Failure to welcome rajini and thirunavukkarasu in
> > the
> > active fold of the party. This is not a major factor
> > but it
> > might have made a diff, u never know
> > 
> > Reasons for failure in South and east for BJP were
> > three
> > factors
> > Alliance, alliance and alliance.
> > It was not a vote for sonia gandhi, not a vote for
> > vajpayee
> > but to the regional parties or anti-incumbency
> > factor. DMK
> > party as a family party is further emphasized by
> > Dhayanithi
> > maran's candidature. Karunanidhi continues to expand
> > his
> > family control over the party and nt a good sign. 
> > 
> > I am not at all happy with the way things are going,
> > but
> > what more can i do? 
> > 
> > Jai hind
> > 
> > Jaimv
> > 
> > --- meetsethu-/[email protected] wrote:
> > > You have been sent this message from
> > meetsethu-/[email protected]
> > > as a courtesy of washingtonpost.com 
> > > 
> > > Personal Message:
> > > Mayil,
> > > What do you think?.I miss discussing politics
> > with you.
> > > Sethu
> > > 
> > > The Upset in India
> > > 
> > > IN 1998, WHEN Atal Bihari Vajpayee took the
> > helm of
> > > the world's largest democracy, nobody predicted
> > the
> > > extent of his success or his alignment with U.S.
> > > interests. His Hindu nationalist party seemed
> > likely to
> > > exacerbate tensions with India's non-Hindu
> > minorities,
> > > inflame relations with Muslim Pakistan and
> > generally
> > > make India an awkward international partner -- a
> > prospect
> > > that appeared to come true a few months into Mr.
> > > Vajpayee's tenure, when his government defied the
> > world
> > > by detonating five nuclear bombs. Six years
> > later,
> > > however, Mr. Vajpayee has improved relations with
> > > Pakistan, gone out of his way to forge an alliance
> > with
> > > the United States and advanced the remarkable
> > program of
> > > liberalization that has turned India into a star
> > economy.
> > > But if all that was unexpected, so was 
> > yesterday's news.
> > > Having called an early election to capitalize on
> > his
> > > apparently robust popularity, Mr. Vajpayee lost. 
> > > 
> > > Although the reasons for this upset will grow
> > clearer as
> > > voting data are analyzed, the dominant theory is
> > not
> > > encouraging. Mr. Vajpayee is said to have been
> > punished
> > > for the pro-market reforms that fostered India's
> > > high-tech boom; voters in the villages felt left
> > out and
> > > took their revenge at the ballot box. This
> > suggests that
> > > even the world's most successful economic
> > reformers run
> > > big political risks. India conducted poverty
> > surveys in
> > > 1993 and '94 and again in 1999 and 2000; over that
> > > period, the rural poverty rate fell from 37
> > percent to 30
> > > percent, so the idea that the villagers have not
> > > benefited from India's growth is spurious. Given
> > India's
> > > continued boom since 2000, poverty in the villages
> > has
> > > almost certainly fallen further. Mr. Vajpayee
> > apparently
> > > got no thanks for this.
> > > 
> > > India will now be governed by a coalition
> > dominated by
> > > the Congress Party, the political vehicle of the 
> > Gandhi
> > > family. The current Gandhi is Sonia, the
> > Italian-born
> > > widow of the assassinated former prime minister
> > Rajiv,
> > > who was himself the son of the assassinated former
> > prime
> > > minister Indira, who was the daughter of the
> > former prime
> > > minister Jawaharlal Nehru, who led the country for
> > 17
> > > years until his peaceful death in office. Mrs.
> > Gandhi 
> > > and her colleagues can be expected to pursue her
> > > predecessor's rapprochement with Pakistan; on the
> > > economy, the new rulers are likely to offer less
> > > continuity, though the difference may be partly
> > > rhetorical. Mr. Vajpayee's reforms are too
> > entrenched to
> > > be rolled back, but progress in areas such as the
> > > privatization of lumbering state-run industries
> > may
> > > decelerate.
> > > 
> > > The sharpest discontinuity is likely to come in
> > > relations with the United States and possibly with
> > U.S.
> > > allies such as Israel. India has become a leading
> > > customer for Israeli weapons technology. With Mr.
> > > Vajpayee in office, the Bush administration hoped
> > that
> > > India might be persuaded to send peacekeepers to
> > Iraq --
> > > a remarkable shift from the Cold War, when India
> > proudly
> > > led the Non-Aligned Movement and seized every
> > opportunity
> > > to tweak American leadership. The Congress
> > Party-led
> > > coalition is expected to swing back to traditional
> > > anti-Americanism, sounding off against the United
> > States
> > > at the United Nations and perhaps challenging U.S.
> > > influence in the Middle East by launching its own
> > peace
> > > initiative. All of which would test the Bush
> > > administration's reserves of forbearance and tact.
> > But
> > > then again, who knows? India's democracy excels at
> > > defying expert predictions.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Would you like to send this article to a friend?
> > Go to 
> > >
> >
>
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/admin/emailfriend?contentId=A25738-2004May13&sent=no&referrer=emailarticle
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Visit washingtonpost.com today for the latest in:
> > > 
> > > News -
> > 
> === message truncated ===
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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