Re: 2D Side Terrain generation
Jon Watte <[email protected]> Sun, 14 Aug 2011 13:12:17 -0700
| Newsgroups | gmane.games.devel.algorithms |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <CAJgyHGPsUXRKGi4Vwg=Z72pWvtU86Y+ybS=Z2BeG5hnxEYEPjw@mail.gmail.com> |
--===============1366858152410637204== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e657b1ce66772204aa7cc3a7 --0016e657b1ce66772204aa7cc3a7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >From his description, it sounds as if he uses Fourier synthesis to generate control values for some fractal algorithm. For example, subdivision algorithms often have "roughness" parameters, which determine how much to subdivide a segment once it's selected for subdivision; I would imagine you'd get an interesting-looking terrain by varying roughness in some locally-smooth but globally-varying way. Also, do you want heightfield-style terrain (each X has exactly 1 Y) or overhangs/crags? That may change how you implement the subdivision. Sincerely, jw -- Americans might object: there is no way we would sacrifice our living standards for the benefit of people in the rest of the world. Nevertheless, whether we get there willingly or not, we shall soon have lower consumption rates, because our present rates are unsustainable. On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 1:20 PM, Joel B <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Andy, do you have any examples of the algorithm? Is it just a standard > Fourier transform and use the waveform output as landscape? > > - Joel > > > On Aug 9, 2011, at 7:51 AM, Andy Farnell wrote: > > > > > > > > > An alternative take to random/quasi-stochastic methods I'll mention > > an exercise we did with my London undergraduates for a Lunar Lander > > terrain. The problem was to make the terrain controllable, in order to > > insert plausible landing sites, (or IIRC "defender" well, you might > > want to create volatile terrain to nicely hide ground based missle silos) > > > > Rather than starting with a Perlin source and filtering as Megan > suggests, > > we found a great way was to Fourier construct with about 5 or 6 sine > components. > > By setting the frequency and amplitude coefficients the terrain could > have > > a useful "roughness" parameter, with local consistency, without > unexpected > > dicontinuities (effectively band limiting the terrain within the frame > > resolution) and remain well bounded in height. Compared to a pink or > > Perlin source and IIR filter it's swings and roundabouts in terms of > cost. > > > > - Andy > > > > > > On Tue, 9 Aug 2011 07:49:44 -0600 > > Megan Fox <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> I'd also recommend Perlin - once you start mixing high or low passed > >> low-frequency Perlin noise with high/low-passed high-frequency noise, > you > >> get some very, very interesting results. > >> > >> The key, and what will define your continents and the feel of the > resultant > >> shape, is the number of layers of noise, and how you scale or cut > (high/low > >> pass) each layer. > >> > >> Hugo Elias's page is an oldy, but it has some really great info on this > >> topic: http://freespace.virgin.net/hugo.elias/models/m_clouds.htm - > that > >> page is the one that turned me on to how cool noise could be in the > first > >> place (my version of his cloud algorithm: > >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHvJqPxXUXM). I realize he's working in > a > >> slightly different space, but those basic techniques can be applied from > a > >> side view just as they can from a top-down view. > >> > >> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 11:34 PM, Marc Hernandez <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> > >>> The big revelation for me was that I realized I could use fractals > >>> as input functions to other fractals, as well as composing them from > >>> adding or multiplying. > >>> > >>> I tend to start with the standard perlin noise to define the major > >>> continents, then use things like rigid multifractal to build mountains > >>> into it. > >>> From there I use another perlin noise to add smaller hills and > >>> valleys, and use yet another to define where to place all those. > >>> > >>> Here's a 2d example of the output. > >>> > http://redmine.alephnought.com/projects/cubit/wiki/World#Pretty-pictures > >>> I didnt have a terrain renderer yet, so I dont know what the > >>> landscape looked like, but I liked the start of it. > >>> > >>> For something like you're mentioning, I think I might treat it as a > >>> strip of a standard 2d heightmap. That way you might get some neat > >>> parallax as the ship flys through it. > >>> > >>> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 8:39 PM, Brennan Rusnell > >>> <[email protected]> wrote: > >>>> I'd recommend using Ridged Multifractals: > >>>> > >>> > https://www.internal.pandromeda.com/engineering/musgrave/unsecure/S01_Course_Notes.html > >>>> http://www.ypoart.com/downloads/Musgrave.htm > >>>> http://vterrain.org/Elevation/Artificial/ > >>>> This is a great book on the topic: > >>>> > >>> > http://books.google.com/books/about/Texturing_modeling.html?id=bDlSJd8GfMcC > >>>> Hope this helps. > >>>> -- > >>>> Brennan Rusnell > >>>> > >>>> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 7:22 PM, Joel B <[email protected]> > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Hello, I'm looking for algorithms for generating 2d terrain from a > side > >>>>> view, like the old Defender game from the 80's, except with mountains > >>> grass, > >>>>> rocks, lakes etc instead of just lines. > >>>>> > >>>>> Here is an example of what I have done in Photoshop: > >>>>> > >>>>> http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/8125/examplelp.png > >>>>> > >>>>> Anyone on this list have some suggestions? It doesn't have to be real > >>>>> time, although that would be interesting too. > >>>>> > >>>>> - Joel > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>>>> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and model > >>>>> configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing > Subversion > >>> and > >>>>> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a > >>> free > >>>>> download at: http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list > >>>>> [email protected] > >>>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list > >>>>> Archives: > >>>>> > >>> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=gdalgorithms-list > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>>> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and model > >>>> configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Subversion > >>> and > >>>> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a > free > >>>> download at: http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list > >>>> [email protected] > >>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list > >>>> Archives: > >>>> > >>> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=gdalgorithms-list > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> /// // > >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and model > >>> configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Subversion > and > >>> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a > free > >>> download at: http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list > >>> [email protected] > >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list > >>> Archives: > >>> > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=gdalgorithms-list > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Megan Fox > >> http://www.glassbottomgames.com/ > > > > > > -- > > Andy Farnell <[email protected]> > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and model > > configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Subversion > and > > the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a free > > download at: http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev > > _______________________________________________ > > GDAlgorithms-list mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list > > Archives: > > > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=gdalgorithms-list > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and model > configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Subversion and > the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a free > download at: http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev > _______________________________________________ > GDAlgorithms-list mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list > Archives: > http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=gdalgorithms-list > --0016e657b1ce66772204aa7cc3a7 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div>From his description, it sounds as if he uses Fourier synthesis to gen= erate control values for some fractal algorithm. For example, subdivision a= lgorithms often have "roughness" parameters, which determine how = much to subdivide a segment once it's selected for subdivision; I would= imagine you'd get an interesting-looking terrain by varying roughness = in some locally-smooth but globally-varying way.</div> <div>=C2=A0</div><div>Also, do you want heightfield-style terrain (each X h= as exactly 1 Y) or overhangs/crags? That may change how you implement the s= ubdivision.</div><div>=C2=A0</div><div>Sincerely,</div><div>=C2=A0</div><di= v>jw</div><div> <br clear=3D"all"><br>--<br>Americans might object: there is no way we woul= d sacrifice our living standards for the benefit of people in the rest of t= he world. Nevertheless, whether we get there willingly or not, we shall soo= n have lower consumption rates, because our present rates are unsustainable= . <br> <br> <br><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 1:20 PM, Jo= el B <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">onep= [email protected]</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote style=3D"margin: = 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204)= ; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid;" class=3D"gmail_quote"> Hi Andy, do you have any examples of the algorithm? Is it just a standard F= ourier transform and use the waveform output as landscape?<br> <font color=3D"#888888"><br> =C2=A0- Joel<br> </font><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br> <br> On Aug 9, 2011, at 7:51 AM, Andy Farnell wrote:<br> <br> ><br> ><br> ><br> > An alternative take to random/quasi-stochastic methods I'll mentio= n<br> > an exercise we did with my London undergraduates for a Lunar Lander<br= > > terrain. =C2=A0The problem was to make the terrain controllable, in or= der to<br> > insert plausible landing sites, (or IIRC "defender" well, yo= u might<br> > want to create volatile terrain to nicely hide ground based missle sil= os)<br> ><br> > Rather than starting with a Perlin source and filtering as Megan sugge= sts,<br> > we found a great way was to Fourier construct with about 5 or 6 sine c= omponents.<br> > By setting the frequency and amplitude coefficients the terrain could = have<br> > a useful "roughness" parameter, with local consistency, with= out unexpected<br> > dicontinuities (effectively band limiting the terrain within the frame= <br> > resolution) and remain well bounded in height. Compared to a pink or<b= r> > Perlin source and IIR filter it's swings and roundabouts in terms = of cost.<br> ><br> > - Andy<br> ><br> ><br> > On Tue, 9 Aug 2011 07:49:44 -0600<br> > Megan Fox <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]= </a>> wrote:<br> ><br> >> I'd also recommend Perlin - once you start mixing high or low = passed<br> >> low-frequency Perlin noise with high/low-passed high-frequency noi= se, you<br> >> get some very, very interesting results.<br> >><br> >> The key, and what will define your continents and the feel of the = resultant<br> >> shape, is the number of layers of noise, and how you scale or cut = (high/low<br> >> pass) each layer.<br> >><br> >> Hugo Elias's page is an oldy, but it has some really great inf= o on this<br> >> topic: <a href=3D"http://freespace.virgin.net/hugo.elias/models/m_= clouds.htm" target=3D"_blank">http://freespace.virgin.net/hugo.elias/models= /m_clouds.htm</a> - that<br> >> page is the one that turned me on to how cool noise could be in th= e first<br> >> place (my version of his cloud algorithm:<br> >> <a href=3D"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DkHvJqPxXUXM" target=3D= "_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DkHvJqPxXUXM</a>). =C2=A0I realize= he's working in a<br> >> slightly different space, but those basic techniques can be applie= d from a<br> >> side view just as they can from a top-down view.<br> >><br> >> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 11:34 PM, Marc Hernandez <<a href=3D"mai= lto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br> >><br> >>> The big revelation for me was that I realized I could use frac= tals<br> >>> as input functions to other fractals, as well as composing the= m from<br> >>> adding or multiplying.<br> >>><br> >>> I tend to start with the standard perlin noise to define the m= ajor<br> >>> continents, then use things like rigid multifractal to build m= ountains<br> >>> into it.<br> >>> From there I use another perlin noise to add smaller hills and= <br> >>> valleys, and use yet another to define where to place all thos= e.<br> >>><br> >>> Here's a 2d example of the output.<br> >>> <a href=3D"http://redmine.alephnought.com/projects/cubit/wiki/= World#Pretty-pictures" target=3D"_blank">http://redmine.alephnought.com/pro= jects/cubit/wiki/World#Pretty-pictures</a><br> >>> I didnt have a terrain renderer yet, so I dont know what the<b= r> >>> landscape looked like, but I liked the start of it.<br> >>><br> >>> For something like you're mentioning, I think I might trea= t it as a<br> >>> strip of a standard 2d heightmap. =C2=A0That way you might get= some neat<br> >>> parallax as the ship flys through it.<br> >>><br> >>> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 8:39 PM, Brennan Rusnell<br> >>> <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">brennan.rusne= [email protected]</a>> wrote:<br> >>>> I'd recommend using Ridged Multifractals:<br> >>>><br> >>> <a href=3D"https://www.internal.pandromeda.com/engineering/mus= grave/unsecure/S01_Course_Notes.html" target=3D"_blank">https://www.interna= l.pandromeda.com/engineering/musgrave/unsecure/S01_Course_Notes.html</a><br= > >>>> <a href=3D"http://www.ypoart.com/downloads/Musgrave.htm" t= arget=3D"_blank">http://www.ypoart.com/downloads/Musgrave.htm</a><br> >>>> <a href=3D"http://vterrain.org/Elevation/Artificial/" targ= et=3D"_blank">http://vterrain.org/Elevation/Artificial/</a><br> >>>> This is a great book on the topic:<br> >>>><br> >>> <a href=3D"http://books.google.com/books/about/Texturing_model= ing.html?id=3DbDlSJd8GfMcC" target=3D"_blank">http://books.google.com/books= /about/Texturing_modeling.html?id=3DbDlSJd8GfMcC</a><br> >>>> Hope this helps.<br> >>>> --<br> >>>> Brennan Rusnell<br> >>>><br> >>>> On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 7:22 PM, Joel B <<a href=3D"mail= to:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br> >>>>><br> >>>>> Hello, I'm looking for algorithms for generating 2= d terrain from a side<br> >>>>> view, like the old Defender game from the 80's, ex= cept with mountains<br> >>> grass,<br> >>>>> rocks, lakes etc instead of just lines.<br> >>>>><br> >>>>> Here is an example of what I have done in Photoshop:<b= r> >>>>><br> >>>>> <a href=3D"http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/8125/exa= mplelp.png" target=3D"_blank">http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/8125/examp= lelp.png</a><br> >>>>><br> >>>>> Anyone on this list have some suggestions? It doesn= 9;t have to be real<br> >>>>> time, although that would be interesting too.<br> >>>>><br> >>>>> - Joel<br> >>>>><br> >>>>><br> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------<br> >>>>> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capa= bilities and model<br> >>>>> configuration take the hassle out of deploying and man= aging Subversion<br> >>> and<br> >>>>> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about ube= rSVN and get a<br> >>> free<br> >>>>> download at: =C2=A0<a href=3D"http://p.sf.net/sfu/wand= isco-dev2dev" target=3D"_blank">http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev</a><br= > >>>>> _______________________________________________<br> >>>>> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list<br> >>>>> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected].= net">[email protected]</a><br> >>>>> <a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinf= o/gdalgorithms-list" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/= listinfo/gdalgorithms-list</a><br> >>>>> Archives:<br> >>>>><br> >>> <a href=3D"http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_= name=3Dgdalgorithms-list" target=3D"_blank">http://sourceforge.net/mailarch= ive/forum.php?forum_name=3Dgdalgorithms-list</a><br> >>>><br> >>>><br> >>>><br> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------<br> >>>> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabili= ties and model<br> >>>> configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managin= g Subversion<br> >>> and<br> >>>> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN= and get a free<br> >>>> download at: =C2=A0<a href=3D"http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco= -dev2dev" target=3D"_blank">http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev</a><br> >>>><br> >>>> _______________________________________________<br> >>>> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list<br> >>>> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"= >[email protected]</a><br> >>>> <a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gd= algorithms-list" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/list= info/gdalgorithms-list</a><br> >>>> Archives:<br> >>>><br> >>> <a href=3D"http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_= name=3Dgdalgorithms-list" target=3D"_blank">http://sourceforge.net/mailarch= ive/forum.php?forum_name=3Dgdalgorithms-list</a><br> >>>><br> >>><br> >>><br> >>><br> >>> --<br> >>> /// //<br> >>><br> >>><br> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------<br> >>> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities= and model<br> >>> configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Su= bversion and<br> >>> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and= get a free<br> >>> download at: =C2=A0<a href=3D"http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev= 2dev" target=3D"_blank">http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev</a><br> >>> _______________________________________________<br> >>> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list<br> >>> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">GDA= [email protected]</a><br> >>> <a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgo= rithms-list" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo= /gdalgorithms-list</a><br> >>> Archives:<br> >>> <a href=3D"http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_= name=3Dgdalgorithms-list" target=3D"_blank">http://sourceforge.net/mailarch= ive/forum.php?forum_name=3Dgdalgorithms-list</a><br> >>><br> >><br> >><br> >><br> >> --<br> >> Megan Fox<br> >> <a href=3D"http://www.glassbottomgames.com/" target=3D"_blank">htt= p://www.glassbottomgames.com/</a><br> ><br> ><br> > --<br> > Andy Farnell <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">padawan= [email protected]</a>><br> ><br> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------= --------<br> > uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and mod= el<br> > configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Subversion= and<br> > the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a f= ree<br> > download at: =C2=A0<a href=3D"http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev" ta= rget=3D"_blank">http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev</a><br> > _______________________________________________<br> > GDAlgorithms-list mailing list<br> > <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">GDAlgorithm= [email protected]</a><br> > <a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-l= ist" target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgor= ithms-list</a><br> > Archives:<br> > <a href=3D"http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=3Dg= dalgorithms-list" target=3D"_blank">http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/foru= m.php?forum_name=3Dgdalgorithms-list</a><br> <br> <br> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---<br> uberSVN's rich system and user administration capabilities and model<br= > configuration take the hassle out of deploying and managing Subversion and<= br> the tools developers use with it. Learn more about uberSVN and get a free<b= r> download at: =C2=A0<a href=3D"http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev" target= =3D"_blank">http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev</a><br> _______________________________________________<br> GDAlgorithms-list mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">GDAlgorithms-lis= [email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list" = target=3D"_blank">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms= -list</a><br> Archives:<br> <a href=3D"http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=3Dgdalgo= rithms-list" target=3D"_blank">http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php= ?forum_name=3Dgdalgorithms-list</a><br> </div></div></blockquote></div><br> --0016e657b1ce66772204aa7cc3a7-- --===============1366858152410637204== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ FREE DOWNLOAD - uberSVN with Social Coding for Subversion. Subversion made easy with a complete admin console. Easy to use, easy to manage, easy to install, easy to extend. Get a Free download of the new open ALM Subversion platform now. http://p.sf.net/sfu/wandisco-dev2dev --===============1366858152410637204== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ GDAlgorithms-list mailing list [email protected] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gdalgorithms-list Archives: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=gdalgorithms-list --===============1366858152410637204==--