Re: Water tight opt-in (yet another FUSSP)
"Neil Schwartzman" <[email protected]> 31 Dec 2013 13:34:35 -0500
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.asrg |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
--Apple-Mail=_B2FFCBA0-6440-45C4-9856-75974EF2D678 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Alessandro, I=92d like to ask you a fundamental question - what problem are you = trying to solve? Neil Schwartzman Executive Director Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial Email http://cauce.org Tel : (303) 800-6345 Twitter : @cauce On Dec 31, 2013, at 7:55 AM, Alessandro Vesely <[email protected]> wrote: > On Sun 29/Dec/2013 18:56:25 +0100 Gordon Peterson wrote: >> This whole thing seems to me like a solution in search of a problem. = I >> don't believe that most ISPs want to serve as intermediaries between >> their users and (legitimate, at least) list services. >>=20 >> I've been involved with (say) Yahoogroups for more than ten years. = You >> subscribe, you get an e-mailed confirmation request, you reply to = that >> by e-mail, and you're in. You unsubscribe either at the website, or >> with an e-mail message (again, confirmed). Just not a problem. >=20 > 98% agree, as Yahoogroups and classical mailing lists (like this one) > are respectful of users' privacy. There are still two points (to = 100%): > One is that list owners have no evidence of subscription, should it be > needed. The other point is that IMAP and webmail users can get the > ability to direct specific mail streams to specific folders in their > mailbox, at the same time as they confirm subscriptions. >=20 >> Those of us that use Thunderbird mail client software, in the case of >> prolific repeating list services and companies that don't respect >> unsubscribe requests, it's easy enough to set up a mail filter rule = that >> just t-cans all incoming mail from that address or domain. >=20 > Some senders use several domains and IP addresses. And some users = read > mail from multiple clients. For disrespectful senders, eliminating = the > corresponding disposable address is way more effective. That's where > this solution pays off, also due to the fortunate coincidence that = such > senders often promise to never disclose addresses. Since, unlike > mailing lists, personal replies are not possible, users can exploit > obscurely tagged addresses without worries. >=20 > Ale > - > This is the asrg mailing list. To change your subscription settings, = see > http://lists.services.net/cgi-bin/mj_wwwusr/domain=3Dlists.gurus.org >=20 --Apple-Mail=_B2FFCBA0-6440-45C4-9856-75974EF2D678 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 <html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html = charset=3Dwindows-1252"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: = after-white-space;">Alessandro,<div><br></div><div>I=92d like to ask you = a fundamental question - what problem are you trying to = solve?</div><div><br></div><div><div apple-content-edited=3D"true"><div = style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: = after-white-space;"><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; = font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><div = style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: = after-white-space;"><div><br></div><div>Neil = Schwartzman</div><div>Executive Director</div><div>Coalition Against = Unsolicited Commercial Email</div><div><a = href=3D"http://cauce.org">http://cauce.org</a></div><div>Tel : (303) = 800-6345</div></div><div>Twitter : @cauce</div><div><br></div></div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"></div> </div> <br><div><div>On Dec 31, 2013, at 7:55 AM, Alessandro Vesely <<a = href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>> wrote:</div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Sun = 29/Dec/2013 18:56:25 +0100 Gordon Peterson wrote:<br><blockquote = type=3D"cite">This whole thing seems to me like a solution in search of = a problem. I<br>don't believe that most ISPs want to serve = as intermediaries between<br>their users and (legitimate, at least) list = services.<br><br>I've been involved with (say) Yahoogroups for more than = ten years. You<br>subscribe, you get an e-mailed confirmation request, = you reply to that<br>by e-mail, and you're in. You unsubscribe = either at the website, or<br>with an e-mail message (again, confirmed). = Just not a problem.<br></blockquote><br>98% agree, as Yahoogroups = and classical mailing lists (like this one)<br>are respectful of users' = privacy. There are still two points (to 100%):<br> One is that = list owners have no evidence of subscription, should it be<br>needed. = The other point is that IMAP and webmail users can get = the<br>ability to direct specific mail streams to specific folders in = their<br>mailbox, at the same time as they confirm = subscriptions.<br><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">Those of us that use = Thunderbird mail client software, in the case of<br>prolific repeating = list services and companies that don't respect<br>unsubscribe requests, = it's easy enough to set up a mail filter rule that<br>just t-cans all = incoming mail from that address or domain.<br></blockquote><br>Some = senders use several domains and IP addresses. And some users = read<br>mail from multiple clients. For disrespectful senders, = eliminating the<br>corresponding disposable address is way more = effective. That's where<br>this solution pays off, also due to the = fortunate coincidence that such<br>senders often promise to never = disclose addresses. Since, unlike<br>mailing lists, personal = replies are not possible, users can exploit<br>obscurely tagged = addresses without worries.<br><br>Ale<br>-<br>This is the asrg mailing = list. To change your subscription settings, see<br><a = href=3D"http://lists.services.net/cgi-bin/mj_wwwusr/domain=3Dlists.gurus.o= rg">http://lists.services.net/cgi-bin/mj_wwwusr/domain=3Dlists.gurus.org</= a><br><br></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>= --Apple-Mail=_B2FFCBA0-6440-45C4-9856-75974EF2D678--