Re: Water tight opt-in (yet another FUSSP)
"Neil Schwartzman" <[email protected]> 11 Jan 2014 17:08:28 -0500
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.asrg |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
--Apple-Mail=_29E76ED1-A5F4-4626-AAFD-802DCF7768FC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 On Jan 11, 2014, at 1:03 PM, Alessandro Vesely <[email protected]> wrote: > Whatever is the solution we have, it must leave something to be > desired, given that many people use tagged addresses by hand. That almost sounds like the Pauline Kael protestation about Nixon = (no-one I know voted for him). Honestly, there may be a lot of people = who use them in your circles, which probably are constituted by a lot of = email professionals but tagged addresses are pretty much a fringe = activity. Apple iCloud offers five aliases to go along with each account, I=92m = sure at least some people use those to hand out to people they deem = dodgy, then ditch them if they turn out to be correct, but for the most = part people use freemail accounts like that. I=92m sure Richard could = comment in vague terms about the great Yahoo! clawback of 2013, which = probably had some amount of account abandoment due to spam, not sure if = that is the same thing as setting up an address to receive mail of a = circumspect nature, but a subset must have been that too. > Permission data collected by a sender on its own can be easily forged. > I'm always surprised to I hear it bears some legal value. A > confirmation signed by a recipient-side curator would allow a sender > to accomplish that need in a well-defined way. These people have a partial solution; they aren=92t the trusted third = party one might hope for (some Costa Rican guy who does web design) but = it is a start at something I=92ve been formulating for a while in light = of a need for a trusted permission repository. http://www.optguard.com/?vsmaid=3D12 forged subscription information doesn=92t scale and wouldn=92t deflect = an investigation by sa, the CRTC who will be relying upon ISP complaint = data as well as a purpose-built spamtrap network, and data from a = variety of major sources. IOW - a sender under investigation could fake one, or even a hundred = subscriptions, but for them to do spamming that is worth anything they = need to do it at scale and that makes catching them easy. Also, an innocent sender will be able to pull out IP-based information = on opens and clicks that should for the most part concur with the signup = data. --Apple-Mail=_29E76ED1-A5F4-4626-AAFD-802DCF7768FC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 <html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html = charset=3Dwindows-1252"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">On Jan = 11, 2014, at 1:03 PM, Alessandro Vesely <<a = href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br><div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type=3D"cite">Whatever = is the solution we have, it must leave something to be<br><span = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">desired, given that many people use tagged addresses by = hand.</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; = font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; = letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: = 0px;"></blockquote><div><br></div>That almost sounds like the Pauline = Kael protestation about Nixon (no-one I know voted for him). Honestly, = there may be a lot of people who use them in your circles, which = probably are constituted by a lot of email professionals but tagged = addresses are pretty much a fringe = activity.</div><div><br></div><div>Apple iCloud offers five aliases to = go along with each account, I=92m sure at least some people use those to = hand out to people they deem dodgy, then ditch them if they turn out to = be correct, but for the most part people use freemail accounts like = that. I=92m sure Richard could comment in vague terms about the great = Yahoo! clawback of 2013, which probably had some amount of account = abandoment due to spam, not sure if that is the same thing as setting up = an address to receive mail of a circumspect nature, but a subset must = have been that too.<br><div><br></div><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">Permission data collected by a sender on its own can be = easily forged.</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; = letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">I'm always surprised to I hear it bears some legal value. = A</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; = font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; = letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">confirmation signed by a recipient-side curator would allow = a sender</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; = font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; = letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; = line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: = 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline = !important;">to accomplish that need in a well-defined = way.</span></blockquote><br></div><div><br></div><div>These people have = a partial solution; they aren=92t the trusted third party one might hope = for (some Costa Rican guy who does web design) but it is a start at = something I=92ve been formulating for a while in light of a need for a = trusted permission repository.</div><div><br></div><div><a = href=3D"http://www.optguard.com/?vsmaid=3D12">http://www.optguard.com/?vsm= aid=3D12</a></div><div><br></div><div>forged subscription information = doesn=92t scale and wouldn=92t deflect an investigation by sa, the CRTC = who will be relying upon ISP complaint data as well as a purpose-built = spamtrap network, and data from a variety of major = sources.</div><div><br></div><div>IOW - a sender under investigation = could fake one, or even a hundred subscriptions, but for them to do = spamming that is worth anything they need to do it at scale and that = makes catching them easy.</div><div><br></div><div>Also, an innocent = sender will be able to pull out IP-based information on opens and clicks = that should for the most part concur with the signup = data.</div><br></body></html>= --Apple-Mail=_29E76ED1-A5F4-4626-AAFD-802DCF7768FC--