[ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation polic y
<Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]> Thu, 14 May 2026 07:32:13 +0000
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.ippm,gmane.ietf.bmwg |
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--===============6344730277541303959== Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="----=_Part_261154_732572128.1778743938170" Content-Language: en-US ------=_Part_261154_732572128.1778743938170 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_ZR1P278MB11708FCB55D815950D2222D889072ZR1P278MB1170CHEP_" Content-Language: en-US --_000_ZR1P278MB11708FCB55D815950D2222D889072ZR1P278MB1170CHEP_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Ruediger, That was exactly the intention of these proposals. We are on the same page. Best wishes Thomas From: [email protected] <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2026 9:20 AM To: Graf Thomas, SCS-INI-NET-VNC-E2E <Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>; ippm@ietf.= org; [email protected] Cc: [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected]= m Subject: ***Signed_Message*** AW: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - i= mplementation policy Be aware: This is an external email. Dear Thomas, the requirement "SHOULD" expresses, what IETF expects to be there (its not = a MAY). Giving priority to std track drafts accompanied by an implementatio= n expresses that to me. So I look at proposal 1 to bear the quality of a "S= HOULD" (but, as said, don't suggest requirement language in the charter). Proposal 2 reads like a "MUST (be accompanied by an implementation) with ex= ceptions" to me (sticking to requirement definitions). My interpretation of= "MUST with exceptions" is a SHOULD. Proposal 2 may require a charter definition or a WG discussion of the excep= tions. To me proposal 1 and 2 express similar expectations (I'd perceive th= e differences to be nuances). Consenting and operating proposal 1 looks eas= ier. Regards, Ruediger Von: Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]> <Thomas.Graf= @swisscom.com<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 13. Mai 2026 07:43 An: Geib, R=FCdiger <[email protected]<mailto:Ruediger.Geib@telekom.= de>>; [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto= :[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Cc: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]= <mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:mohamed.= [email protected]> Betreff: RE: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation policy Dear Ruediger, Thats an interesting option. However as a chair my worries with "should" or= "is desirable" is how we exercise the policy. Lets assume the document req= uests WGLC and has no implementation and no good reasoning why it doesn't h= ave an implementation. What would be the consequence? Wait for some time? H= ow long? And then, if there is still no implementation still go ahead with = WGLC? Prioritizes documents with implementations. For proposed work presentations= it simply means if there isn't enough space in the agenda and the document= doesn't have an implementation and others already have (there are cases we= re authors already arrive at the working group with an implementation, beli= eve me), it won't be on the agenda but there is always the mailing list. If= we have multiple document in the queue for adoption or last call, the ones= having implementations are picked first. Or last but not least, interim se= ssions are sometimes chosen to speed up things for a particular document or= set of documents, to resolve a problem. We would not do such interims if t= here are no implementations. For requiring implementations. This means that a document can't get past WG= LC without. We chairs would monitor the progress of the document and help a= nd support the authors through the working group process by advertising the= document to potential implementors for hackathon activities and give those= hackathon activities time on the agenda. That's in a nutshell on top of my head what these options would mean. I personally interpret "should" or "is desirable" as being delayed WGLC if = there is no implementation. Thoughts? Best wishes Thomas From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> <Ruediger.G= [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Sent: Monday, May 11, 2026 2:30 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; Graf Thomas, SCS-INI-N= ET-VNC-E2E <Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>>; ipp= [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Cc: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]= <mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:mohamed.= [email protected]> Subject: AW: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation policy Be aware: This is an external email. Hi Adrian, thanks for pointing out. I failed to say that my "SHOULD" only expresses a = charter requirement level from the given options. I do not suggest to apply= BCP14 requirement language in the charter. Regards, Ruediger Von: Adrian Farrel <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Gesendet: Montag, 11. Mai 2026 13:15 An: Geib, R=FCdiger <[email protected]<mailto:Ruediger.Geib@telekom.= de>>; Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>; ippm@ietf.= org<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Cc: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]= <mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:mohamed.= [email protected]> Betreff: RE: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation policy May be "is desirable" rather than put BCP14 language in a charter? A From: Ruediger.Geib=3D40telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]<mailto:Ruediger.Geib=3D40= telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]> <Ruediger.Geib=3D40telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]<mai= lto:Ruediger.Geib=3D40telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]>> Sent: 11 May 2026 12:00 To: Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>; [email protected]= g<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Cc: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]= <mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:mohamed.= [email protected]> Subject: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation policy Dear Marcus, Giuseppe, Sarah and Thomas, I'd prefer option 1. A "SHOULD" requirement for an implementation to me wou= ld be a clear expression of the WG intent and implicitly include/allow an e= xception. Regards, Ruediger Von: Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]> <Thomas.Graf= @swisscom.com<mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 7. Mai 2026 10:13 An: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]= > Cc: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]= <mailto:[email protected]>; [email protected]<mailto:mohamed.= [email protected]> Betreff: [ippm] Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation policy Dear BMWG and IPPM, We have with https://github.com/ietf-ippm/wg-charter/issues/4 a suggestion = from Med to consider adding an implementation policy in the join charter pr= oposal. We chairs have been thinking how this could be addressed best in the charte= r and came up with the 3 proposals: 1. The WG prioritizes documents with implementations. 2. The WG requires an implementation for standard track documents. In so= me cases exceptions can be applied. Whenever such an exception applies, the= exception justification must be included in the specification document or = its write-up. 3. The WG requires two implementations for standard track documents. In = some cases exceptions can be applied. Whenever such an exception applies, t= he exception justification must be included in the specification document o= r its write-up. The main differences between the choices are underlined. We would like to have feedback from both working groups on * wherever an implementation policy should be added or not * wherever those choices make sense or not * which would be the preferred choice and why https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc7942 is a good quick read in regar= ds to implementations and implementation status section. Rough consensus an= d running code is part of the IETF DNA. Personally we think it is helpful f= or the authors if the working group states what is expected in terms of imp= lementations. There are good reasons for having implementations such as rai= sing quality of the document and ensure interoperability. But there are als= o reasons to progress quickly. For instance in case where there is only a s= mall document update or a security fix. Best wishes Marcus, Giuseppe, Sarah and Thomas --_000_ZR1P278MB11708FCB55D815950D2222D889072ZR1P278MB1170CHEP_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html> <head> <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-= 1"> <meta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"> <style><!-- /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:Wingdings; panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;} @font-face {font-family:"Cambria Math"; panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} @font-face {font-family:Calibri; panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;} @font-face {font-family:Aptos;} @font-face {font-family:"Trebuchet MS"; panose-1:2 11 6 3 2 2 2 2 2 4;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {margin:0in; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Aptos",sans-serif; mso-ligatures:standardcontextual; mso-fareast-language:EN-US;} a:link, span.MsoHyperlink {mso-style-priority:99; color:#467886; text-decoration:underline;} p.MsoListParagraph, li.MsoListParagraph, div.MsoListParagraph {mso-style-priority:34; 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mso-level-text:o; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:"Courier New";} @list l2:level3 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0A7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:Wingdings;} @list l2:level4 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0B7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:Symbol;} @list l2:level5 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:o; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:"Courier New";} @list l2:level6 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0A7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:Wingdings;} @list l2:level7 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0B7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:Symbol;} @list l2:level8 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:o; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:"Courier New";} @list l2:level9 {mso-level-number-format:bullet; mso-level-text:\F0A7; mso-level-tab-stop:none; mso-level-number-position:left; text-indent:-.25in; font-family:Wingdings;} @list l3 {mso-list-id:2107462395; mso-list-template-ids:1921529524;} ol {margin-bottom:0in;} ul {margin-bottom:0in;} --></style> </head> <body lang=3D"DE-CH" link=3D"#467886" vlink=3D"#96607D" style=3D"word-wrap:= break-word"> <div class=3D"WordSection1"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">Dear Ruediger,<o:p></o:p></span>= </p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">That was exactly = the intention of these proposals. We are on the same page.<o:p></o:p></span= ></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841"><o:p> </o:p>= </span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">Best wishes<o:p><= /o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">Thomas</span><spa= n style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif= ;color:gray;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-language:DE-CH"><o:p></o:p></spa= n></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in = 0in 0in"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;fo= nt-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-lan= guage:DE-CH">From:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt= ;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-= language:DE-CH"> [email protected] <[email protected]> <br> <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, May 13, 2026 9:20 AM<br> <b>To:</b> Graf Thomas, SCS-INI-NET-VNC-E2E <Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]>= ;; [email protected]; [email protected]<br> <b>Cc:</b> [email protected]; [email protected]; mohamed.boucadair@or= ange.com<br> <b>Subject:</b> ***Signed_Message*** AW: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM charter= ing - implementation policy<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding= =3D"0" align=3D"left" width=3D"100%" style=3D"width:100.0%"> <tbody> <tr> <td style=3D"background:#CF4A0C;padding:5.0pt 2.0pt 5.0pt 2.0pt"></td> <td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width:100.0%;background:#FFF8E5;padding:5.0pt 4= .0pt 5.0pt 12.0pt"> <div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-element:frame;mso-element-frame-hspace:= 2.25pt;mso-element-wrap:around;mso-element-anchor-vertical:paragraph;mso-el= ement-anchor-horizontal:column;mso-height-rule:exactly"> <b><span style=3D"color:#222222;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-language:DE-= CH">Be aware:</span></b><span style=3D"color:#222222;mso-ligatures:none;mso= -fareast-language:DE-CH"> This is an external email.<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"mso-ligatures:none;mso-fa= reast-language:DE-CH"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE">Dear Thomas,<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">the requirement „SHOULD&#= 8220; expresses, what IETF expects to be there (its not a MAY). Giving prio= rity to std track drafts accompanied by an implementation expresses that to= me. So I look at proposal 1 to bear the quality of a “SHOULD” (but, as said, don’t suggest requirement l= anguage in the charter).</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Proposal 2 reads like a “= MUST (be accompanied by an implementation) with exceptions” to me (st= icking to requirement definitions). My interpretation of “MUST with e= xceptions” is a SHOULD.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p= > <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Proposal 2 may require a charte= r definition or a WG discussion of the exceptions. To me proposal 1 and 2 e= xpress similar expectations (I’d perceive the differences to be nuanc= es). Consenting and operating proposal 1 looks easier.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Regards,</span><span lang=3D"DE= "><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Ruediger</span><span lang=3D"DE= "><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in = 0in 0in"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-langua= ge:DE">Von:</span></b><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami= ly:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-language:D= E"> <a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]">Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]</a> &l= t;<a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]">Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]</a>&= gt; <br> <b>Gesendet:</b> Mittwoch, 13. Mai 2026 07:43<br> <b>An:</b> Geib, R=FCdiger <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">= [email protected]</a>>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"= mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>= ; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">m= [email protected]</a><br> <b>Betreff:</b> RE: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation = policy</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">Dear Ruediger,</span><span lang= =3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><= o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">Thats an interest= ing option. However as a chair my worries with "should" or "= </span><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cal= ibri",sans-serif">is desirable" is how we exercise the policy. Lets assume the document re= quests WGLC and has no implementation and no good reasoning why it doesn't = have an implementation. What would be the consequence? Wait for some time? = How long? And then, if there is still no implementation still go ahead with WGLC?</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p><= /o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Prioritizes documents with implement= ations. For proposed work presentations it simply means if there isn't enou= gh space in the agenda and the document doesn't have an implementation and others already have (there are cases were autho= rs already arrive at the working group with an implementation, believe me),= it won't be on the agenda but there is always the mailing list. If we have= multiple document in the queue for adoption or last call, the ones having implementations are picked firs= t. Or last but not least, interim sessions are sometimes chosen to speed up= things for a particular document or set of documents, to resolve a problem= . We would not do such interims if there are no implementations. </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></spa= n></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">For requiring implementations. This = means that a document can't get past WGLC without. We chairs would monitor = the progress of the document and help and support the authors through the working group process by advertising the document = to potential implementors for hackathon activities and give those hackathon= activities time on the agenda.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span><= /p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">That’s in a nutshell on top of= my head what these options would mean.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p>= </span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I personally interpret </span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tre= buchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841">"should" or "</spa= n><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri&= quot;,sans-serif">is desirable" as being delayed WGLC if there is no i= mplementation. Thoughts?</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Best wishes</span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thomas</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:#0E2841"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><= o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in = 0in 0in"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;fo= nt-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-lan= guage:DE-CH">From:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt= ;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-= language:DE-CH"> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a> &l= t;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>&= gt; <br> <b>Sent:</b> Monday, May 11, 2026 2:30 PM<br> <b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>; = Graf Thomas, SCS-INI-NET-VNC-E2E <<a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf@swisscom= .com">Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]</a>>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:bmwg@= ietf.org"> [email protected]</a><br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>= ; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">m= [email protected]</a><br> <b>Subject:</b> AW: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation = policy</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"> <span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding= =3D"0" align=3D"left" width=3D"100%" style=3D"width:100.0%"> <tbody> <tr> <td style=3D"background:#CF4A0C;padding:5.0pt 2.0pt 5.0pt 2.0pt"></td> <td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width:100.0%;background:#FFF8E5;padding:5.0pt 4= .0pt 5.0pt 12.0pt"> <div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-element:frame;mso-element-frame-hspace:= 2.25pt;mso-element-wrap:around;mso-element-anchor-vertical:paragraph;mso-el= ement-anchor-horizontal:column;mso-height-rule:exactly"> <b><span style=3D"color:#222222;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-language:DE-= CH">Be aware:</span></b><span style=3D"color:#222222;mso-ligatures:none;mso= -fareast-language:DE-CH"> This is an external email.</span><o:p></o:p></p> </div> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"mso-ligatures:none;mso-fa= reast-language:DE-CH"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE">Hi Adrian,<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">thanks for pointing out. I fail= ed to say that my “SHOULD” only expresses a charter requirement= level from the given options. I do not suggest to apply BCP14 requirement = language in the charter.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Regards, Ruediger</span><span l= ang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in = 0in 0in"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-langua= ge:DE">Von:</span></b><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami= ly:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-language:D= E"> Adrian Farrel <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]= uk</a>> <br> <b>Gesendet:</b> Montag, 11. Mai 2026 13:15<br> <b>An:</b> Geib, R=FCdiger <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">= [email protected]</a>>; <a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]">Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]</a>; <= a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>= ; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">m= [email protected]</a><br> <b>Betreff:</b> RE: [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation = policy</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">May be “is desirable” ra= ther than put BCP14 language in a charter?</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o= :p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif">A</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p= ></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p>= </o:p></span></p> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in = 0in 0in"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;fo= nt-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-lan= guage:EN-GB">From:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt= ;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-= language:EN-GB"> <a href=3D"mailto:Ruediger.Geib=3D40telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]">Ruediger.Gei= b=3D40telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]</a> <<a href=3D"mailto:Ruediger.Geib=3D4= 0telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]">Ruediger.Geib=3D40telekom.de-Tr9gZwTxerDR74oF6e/[email protected]</a>= > <br> <b>Sent:</b> 11 May 2026 12:00<br> <b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]">Thomas.Graf@swisscom= .com</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:bmwg@= ietf.org"> [email protected]</a><br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>= ; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">m= [email protected]</a><br> <b>Subject:</b> [ippm] Re: Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation poli= cy</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Dear Marcus, Giuseppe, Sarah an= d Thomas,</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">I’d prefer option 1. A &#= 8220;SHOULD” requirement for an implementation to me would be a clear= expression of the WG intent and implicitly include/allow an exception. </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Regards,</span><span lang=3D"DE= "><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Ruediger</span><span lang=3D"DE= "><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <div> <div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in = 0in 0in"> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-= family:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-langua= ge:DE">Von:</span></b><span lang=3D"DE" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami= ly:"Calibri",sans-serif;mso-ligatures:none;mso-fareast-language:D= E"> <a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]">Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]</a> &l= t;<a href=3D"mailto:Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]">Thomas.Graf-Zc0CTiu5wcBWk0Htik3J/[email protected]</a>&= gt; <br> <b>Gesendet:</b> Donnerstag, 7. Mai 2026 10:13<br> <b>An:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"m= ailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a><br> <b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a>= ; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]"> [email protected]</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">m= [email protected]</a><br> <b>Betreff:</b> [ippm] Joint BMWG/IPPM chartering - implementation policy</= span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"DE"> <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif">Dear BMWG and IPPM,</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o= :p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tr= ebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></sp= an></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">We have with </span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"= ,sans-serif"><a href=3D"https://github.com/ietf-ippm/wg-charter/issues/4"><= span lang=3D"EN-US">https://github.com/ietf-ippm/wg-charter/issues/4</span>= </a> </span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tre= buchet MS",sans-serif">a suggestion from Med to consider adding an imp= lementation policy in the join charter proposal.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o= :p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">We chairs have been thinking ho= w this could be addressed best in the charter and came up with the 3 propos= als:</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"1"> <li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0in;mso-list:l1 level1 = lfo3"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Treb= uchet MS",sans-serif">The WG <u>prioritizes</u> documents with implementations.</span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:= 0in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt= ;font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">The WG <u>requires an</u> implementation for standard track documents. In some cas= es exceptions can be applied. Whenever such an exception applies, the excep= tion justification must be included in the specification document or its wr= ite-up.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoList= Paragraph" style=3D"margin-left:0in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3"><span lang=3D"= EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-= serif">The WG <u>requires two</u> implementations for standard track documents. In some c= ases exceptions can be applied. Whenever such an exception applies, the exc= eption justification must be included in the specification document or its = write-up.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></li></ol> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">The main differences between th= e choices are underlined.</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">We would like to have feedback = from both working groups on</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc"> <li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0in;mso-list:l2 level1 = lfo6"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Treb= uchet MS",sans-serif">wherever an implementation policy should be adde= d or not</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoLis= tParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0in;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span lang=3D= "EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans= -serif">wherever those choices make sense or not</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o= :p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0i= n;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo6"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;f= ont-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">which would be the preferre= d choice and why</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></li></ul> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"><a href=3D"https://datatracker.= ietf.org/doc/html/rfc7942">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc7942</a= > is a good quick read in regards to implementations and implementation status section. Rough consensus and running code is par= t of the IETF DNA. Personally we think it is helpful for the authors if the= working group states what is expected in terms of implementations. There a= re good reasons for having implementations such as raising quality of the document and ensure interoperability. But t= here are also reasons to progress quickly. For instance in case where there= is only a small document update or a security fix.</span><span lang=3D"DE"= ><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">Best wishes</span><span lang=3D= "DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif">Marcus, Giuseppe, Sarah and Tho= mas</span><span lang=3D"DE"><o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-= family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"DE">= <o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> </div> </body> </html> --_000_ZR1P278MB11708FCB55D815950D2222D889072ZR1P278MB1170CHEP_-- ------=_Part_261154_732572128.1778743938170 Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s; smime-type=signed-data Content-Transfer-Encoding: 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