Re: [Bier] WGLC : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-07.txt
Greg Shepherd <[email protected]> Thu, 15 Feb 2018 08:38:52 -0800
| Newsgroups | gmane.ietf.isis |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <CABFReBop9CtLexmzjNByad4PBj2r6XhiuUw+Nvto9xg8575xaA__26192.3498045237$1518712656$gmane$org@mail.gmail.com> |
--===============5604757811760984784== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11449e22f96d7d056542dce8" --001a11449e22f96d7d056542dce8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For the record, there is no SR Registry. There is only an IGP Algo Type Registry as defined in draft-ietf-ospr-segment-routing-extensions-24 section 8.5 More inline: On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 8:25 AM, Tony Przygienda <[email protected]> wrote: > Under 8-bit artistic license granted by Acee herewith ;-) > > First, I want to emphasize that this is IETF LC (called by Greg as > shepherding WG chair) which means chairs have no further function so we a= ll > can only speak as individuals only . > > 2nd, I oppose any suggestion to align any kind of SR registry with BAR > registry using 8 bits on couple of very simple grounds that my > co-participants may have missed > > a) No IGP or SR working group has any charter to mandate any of the > BIER technology so as well-meant the suggestion seems to be, it has no > standing in IETF working procedures as far as I can see unless according > charters are extended by ADs. Unless I'm missing something here. > If a WG points to a registry of any kind, a draft is all that is needed to justify an new entry in the registry. > b) More as a question: Can we even publish an RFC now (experimental= ) > pointing to an SR draft as normative? And if, how do we move it to intend= ed > standards track unless SR draft is a standards RFC? > Nobody is asking to reference it now. The current issue on the table to to leave it undefined with only default value, so let's stick with the current issue. > c) Probably most importantly, technically, In case any of the SR > computations starts to rely on elements advertised in SR to perform the > computations, deployment of BIER will precondition deployment of SR in th= e > network. Worse, if we need computation that needs BIER specific elements = in > its course, that would mean we have SR becoming aware of a multicast > technology underneath. Unicast computations are simply not multicast > computations longer-term (and I had discussions about couple such cases > already). Having multicast specific elements being considered in unicast > computations and multicast computations being "standardized" in unicast > computations couples everything with everything again known as the > big-ball-of-yarn (unless THAT is the intention). In long experience thing= s > like this are simply a very bad architecture (TM ;-). > Again, it's an IGP Algo registry. It's documentation. There are no dependencies other than our references, which right now we don't have any. > 3rd, I thought about the issues involved in BAR probably longer than > anyone on the list here (remember Tree ID ;-) and I have a meta issue to > make and then a finer one > > a) Independent of whether we end up with 8 or 16 bits I think we nee= d > a firm BIER BAR registry in place here (expert review?) and some document > to gather the BAR ideas. Sooner the better. Ideas as in this thread are > coming in it would be good to channelize them to prevent codepoint > squatting or replicated effort. In fact we have a draft we circulated and > we decided to push out today to give a strawman framework to the discusse= d > use-cases. Granted, only the new charter (if given to us) would allow thi= s > work to be adopted but it=E2=80=99s good to have a vessel to contain the = ideas > already IMO. So check the new-publication queue ;-) > > > b) Then, if we consider BAR as purely =E2=80=9Cspecial BIER nexthop > computation=E2=80=9D 8 bits sounds plenty but never underestimate new tec= hnology to > stretch artistic boundaries and ideas you see here ;-) So if we think e.g= . > about things like the above mentioned draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-ext= ensions-15 > proposal playing a role one could imagine that the =E2=80=9CSR algorithm = registry=E2=80=9D > specifies an algorithm that BAR registry likes to use as well 1:1. Simple= , > we just allocate a BIER BAR codepoint that is mapped (or even same) to th= e > SR UCAST codepoint in this case (well, let discussion whether we would ha= ve > the charter to do that or go ask for permission in SPRING outstanding for > now). And that could be done of course via a TLV as well by using a singl= e > =E2=80=9CBAR # meaning it=E2=80=99s an SR algorithm=E2=80=9D and then a B= IER sub-tlv saying which > one of those. But things get finer. Let=E2=80=99s say we use a BAR=3D1 as= BIER > computation saying =E2=80=9Cavoid all non-BIER routers=E2=80=9D. Now, tha= t=E2=80=99s cool but maybe > SR defined an algorithm we want to use on top as in =E2=80=9Ccompute SPF = with > enough bandwidth=E2=80=9D. For that could have a funky TLV saying =E2=80= =9Cany BAR > computation should stack this SR computation on top=E2=80=9D but it would= be then > way more elegant to have a 16 bit with 8bit BAR from registry and then 8 > bits of some context (in this example SR computation# to be stacked on to= p > of the necessary BAR computation). Yes, that would precondition in such > case simultaneous BIER and SR deployment but since then no technology > forces mandatory use of another it=E2=80=99s flexible, open and nicely sm= elling. I > hope at least some people could follow that and old IGP hands will see th= at > this is actually as efficient in terms of actual implementation as a sing= le > set of constraints despite seeming complex. > > I won=E2=80=99t stretch my artistic license further than 16 bits albeit t= here are > even more interesting ideas I saw that would blow through this ;-) I > probably owe Acee a beer in London already as it is. > > So, in shorter form for the non-IGP cracks, I think 8 bits looks good but > I see how 16 could have an elegance to channelize some of the suggestions > (and get a "goldilocks solution"), if we e.g. decide to =E2=80=9Cstack al= gorithmic > constraints from multiple technologies optionally on top of each other, > each with its own registry that can refer to another=E2=80=9D. This would > accommodate also the proposal extended by Ice in a simple, clean, loosely > coupled way by having 16 bits, *first 8 bits as BIER type being a BIER > BAR registry and 8 bits after that being =E2=80=9Copen=E2=80=9D so e.g. b= eing SR unicast > registry number*. > > I do also think that if we get to such a consensus, adding text > introducing test adding a BAR type/BAR subtype 16-bits field with a BAR > type BIER registry into the documents is just a bit of text ... > > As I said, our draft will follow later today since some co-authors are i= n > funky timezones ;-) =E2=80=A6 > thanks, Greg > --- tony > > On Thu, Feb 15, 2018 at 6:46 AM, Eric C Rosen <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Ice's reasoning makes sense to me. >> >> >> On 2/15/2018 3:11 AM, IJsbrand Wijnands (iwijnand) wrote: >> >> Hi Folks, >> >> I support 16 bits because of the following reasons. >> >> For me it would make sense to align the Algorithm value to the "IGP >> Algorithm" registry. This registry is defined in: >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-rout >> ing-extensions-24#section-8.5 >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.ietf.org_h= tml_draft-2Dietf-2Dospf-2Dsegment-2Drouting-2Dextensions-2D24-23section-2D8= .5&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9= m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_fai= c5jyDyo&s=3DwFHQGdbIofGfam7tl7rnRjckYdcPp1WR-BqnaNE1mV8&e=3D> >> >> >> In my opinion, this is going to cover 90% of the use-cases because BIER >> is defined to run over a unicast underlay, so what ever is done for >> Unicast, it will work for BIER automatically (like Flex Algo), and avoid= s >> to duplicate registries. However, this registry is also 8 bits. That mea= ns >> there is no room for anything else and I already know there are differen= t >> options about this. >> >> To avoid an other long debate/fight over these 8 bits, lets get more bit= s >> now so we don't corner our selfs. Its a minor change to the draft. >> >> Lets not start a debate now on how BAR is used, as I'm sure we will not >> reach agreement in time and we're gonna delay the IGP drafts. We can st= art >> a discussion after the IGP draft are through and what all the use-cases = are >> we need to cover. I already look forward to those discussions :-) >> >> Thx, >> >> Ice. >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On 15 Feb 2018, at 07:24, Jeff Tantsura <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> +1 >> >> I=E2=80=99d really like to see justification for anything larger than 8 = bits. >> >> Regards, >> Jeff >> >> On Feb 14, 2018, at 18:30, Acee Lindem (acee) <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> I agree. As a point of reference, we've only have defined two IGP >> algorithms so far and the segment routing draft dates back about 4 years= . >> >> >> https://www.iana.org/assignments/igp-parameters/igp- >> parameters.xhtml#igp-algorithm-types >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.iana.org_ass= ignments_igp-2Dparameters_igp-2Dparameters.xhtml-23igp-2Dalgorithm-2Dtypes&= d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4c= Ilq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5j= yDyo&s=3D5yaJPFqWpr5V5oBQ4O7o779WCOla79NlPw5FEfmRAUY&e=3D> >> >> >> Even with more artistic freedom afforded to multicast, I still believe >> 256 standard algorithms are enough. >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Acee >> >> >> =EF=BB=BFOn 2/14/18, 9:15 PM, "BIER on behalf of Dolganow, Andrew (Nokia= - >> SG/Singapore)" <[email protected] on behalf of >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> Guys, >> >> >> I would think 8 bits are sufficient. Others (like SegRtg mentioned >> below also use 8). 8 bits gives us tons of room to grow - especially sin= ce >> we have only a single value defined currently (SFP 0). If we have clear = use >> cases that show us running out of 8 bits or getting close to that we >> can/should discuss and evaluate extensions in light of that but increasi= ng >> the space "just in case" is not a prudent way to go. >> >> >> Andrew >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: BIER <[email protected]> on behalf of Xiejingrong < >> [email protected]> >> >> Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2018 at 5:06 PM >> >> To: Arkadiy Gulko <[email protected]>, "[email protected]" = < >> [email protected]>, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >> >> Subject: Re: [Bier] WGLC : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-07.txt >> >> >> Hi Arkadiy, >> >> >> I checked the latest <draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-extensions-2= 4> >> and <draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15> for reference and >> comparing, and they both use a 8 bits Algorithm. >> >> One of the description: "Algorithm: Single octet identifying the >> algorithm." >> >> >> Interesting to use more than 8 bits for BIER's future flexibility >> :-) >> >> >> Regards, >> >> XieJingrong >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: BIER [mailto:[email protected] <[email protected]>] >> On Behalf Of [email protected] >> >> Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2018 8:42 AM >> >> To: [email protected]; [email protected] >> >> Subject: [Bier] WGLC : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-07.txt >> >> >> Hello Working Group, >> >> After initial discussions between multiple participants of the >> working group, we consolidated that BIER's future flexibility would be w= ell >> served if we extend the IGP signaling BAR field to 16 bits. We are >> currently reviewing various use-cases that can greatly benefit from this >> enhancement. >> >> I would appreciate if the proposed change could be considered as >> part of IETF Last Call review. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Arkadiy >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: BIER [mailto:[email protected] <[email protected]>] >> On Behalf Of [email protected] >> >> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2018 5:11 PM >> >> To: [email protected] >> >> Cc: [email protected] >> >> Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-07.txt >> >> >> >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >> directories. >> >> This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication >> WG of the IETF. >> >> >> Title : BIER support via ISIS >> >> Authors : Les Ginsberg >> >> Tony Przygienda >> >> Sam Aldrin >> >> Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang >> >> Filename : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extensions-07.txt >> >> Pages : 10 >> >> Date : 2018-02-09 >> >> >> Abstract: >> >> Specification of an ISIS extension to support BIER domains and >> sub- >> >> domains. >> >> >> >> >> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__ >> datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextens >> ions_&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY >> &r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8R >> eKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs&s=3D3qPmQav_QUBjHi7KygPVk9bIh >> VZ7TL2Z3xfHOo_Cjwc&e=3D >> >> >> There are also htmlized versions available at: >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__ >> tools.ietf.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextensions- >> 2D07&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY& >> r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8Re >> KzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs&s=3D_nTFvlAW24snrkMm3aQ2uWLFsL >> CajYeW4HO3DdEiwvs&e=3D >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__ >> datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis- >> 2Dextensions-2D07&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8- >> 1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4 >> cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs& >> s=3DzHWCGuyM-GSX-slbFtCv4fs9ml5gPQBeXohosuyhpx4&e=3D >> >> >> A diff from the previous version is available at: >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__ >> www.ietf.org_rfcdiff-3Furl2-3Ddraft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis- >> 2Dextensions-2D07&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8- >> 1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4 >> cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs& >> s=3DpDVWzZrYzGia4WKiA_cSF0P5isUmMeojSvHJIGgdOTk&e=3D >> >> >> >> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >> submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at >> tools.ietf.org >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__tools.ietf.org&d= =3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cI= lq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jy= Dyo&s=3DqZ3p2sAIpzRPXfiRBbzrB1rPAkaJXEKiz43EmIKO03Y&e=3D> >> . >> >> >> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dftp-3A__ >> ftp.ietf.org_internet-2Ddrafts_&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk- >> GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcx >> u4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvY >> s&s=3DwqMqmybm38ZiX4CuzJaNJPMea1Mf-pSgD-vdgAHk850&e=3D >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> BIER mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__ >> www.ietf.org_mailman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk >> -GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcx >> u4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvY >> s&s=3DkxUz28mTxGjbNsEQMGi8SMZ93LSiMt_bMFzqkWJJZnU&e=3D >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> BIER mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mai= lman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzo= CI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyV= NsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e= =3D> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> BIER mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mai= lman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzo= CI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyV= NsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e= =3D> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> BIER mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mai= lman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzo= CI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyV= NsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e= =3D> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> BIER mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mai= lman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzo= CI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyV= NsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e= =3D> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> BIER mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mai= lman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzo= CI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyV= NsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e= =3D> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> BIER mailing [email protected] >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mail= man_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwICAg&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoC= I&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVN= sVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e=3D >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Isis-wg mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > BIER mailing list > [email protected] > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier > > --001a11449e22f96d7d056542dce8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr">For the record, there is no SR Registry. There is only an = IGP Algo Type Registry as defined in draft-ietf-ospr-segment-routing-extens= ions-24 section 8.5<div><br></div><div><div class=3D"gmail_extra">More inli= ne:</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, = Feb 15, 2018 at 8:25 AM, Tony Przygienda <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"m= ailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>></s= pan> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex= ;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Under 8= -bit artistic license granted by Acee herewith ;-)<br>=C2=A0<br>First, I wa= nt to emphasize that this is IETF LC (called by Greg as shepherding WG chai= r) which means chairs have no further function so we all can only speak as = individuals only .<br>=C2=A0<br>2nd, I oppose any suggestion to align any k= ind of SR registry with BAR registry using 8 bits on couple of very simple = grounds that my co-participants may have missed<br>=C2=A0<br>a)=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 No IGP or SR working group has any charter to mand= ate any of the BIER technology so as well-meant the suggestion seems to be,= it has no standing in IETF working procedures as far as I can see unless a= ccording charters are extended by ADs. Unless I'm missing something her= e.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>If a WG points to a registry= of any kind, a draft is all that is needed to justify an new entry in the = registry.=C2=A0</div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty= le=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div d= ir=3D"ltr"><div>b)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 More as a question: = Can we even publish an RFC now (experimental) pointing to an SR draft as no= rmative? And if, how do we move it to intended standards track unless SR dr= aft is a standards RFC? <br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>No= body is asking to reference it now. The current issue on the table to to le= ave it undefined with only default value, so let's stick with the curre= nt issue.</div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"= margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"= ltr"><div>c)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Probably most importantly,= technically, In case any of the SR computations starts to rely on elements= advertised in SR to perform the computations, deployment of BIER will prec= ondition deployment of SR in the network. Worse, if we need computation tha= t needs BIER specific elements in its course, that would mean we have SR be= coming aware of a multicast technology underneath. Unicast computations are= simply not multicast computations longer-term=C2=A0 (and I had discussions= about couple such cases already). Having multicast specific elements being= considered in unicast computations and multicast computations being "= standardized" in unicast computations couples everything with everythi= ng again known as the big-ball-of-yarn (unless THAT is the intention). In l= ong experience things like this are simply a very bad architecture (TM ;-).= <br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Again, it's an IGP Alg= o registry. It's documentation. There are no dependencies other than ou= r references, which right now we don't have any.</div><div>=C2=A0</div>= <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p= x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>3rd, I thought about t= he issues involved in BAR probably longer than anyone on the list here (rem= ember Tree ID ;-) and I have a meta issue to make and then a finer one<br>= =C2=A0<br>a)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Independent of whether we end up= with 8 or 16 bits I think we need a firm BIER BAR registry in place here (= expert review?) and some document to gather the BAR ideas. Sooner the bette= r. Ideas as in this thread are coming in it would be good to channelize the= m to prevent codepoint squatting or replicated effort. In fact we have a dr= aft we circulated and we decided to push out today to give a strawman frame= work to the discussed use-cases. Granted, only the new charter (if given to= us) would allow this work to be adopted but it=E2=80=99s good to have a ve= ssel to contain the ideas already IMO. So check the new-publication queue ;= -)</div></div></blockquote><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quot= e" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">= <div dir=3D"ltr"><div>=C2=A0 <br>b)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Then, if = we consider BAR as purely =E2=80=9Cspecial BIER nexthop computation=E2=80= =9D 8 bits sounds plenty but never underestimate new technology to stretch = artistic boundaries and ideas you see here ;-) So if we think e.g. about th= ings like the above mentioned draft-ietf-isis-segment-<wbr>routing-extensio= ns-15 proposal playing a role one could imagine that the =E2=80=9CSR algori= thm registry=E2=80=9D specifies an algorithm that BAR registry likes to use= as well 1:1. Simple, we just allocate a BIER BAR codepoint that is mapped = (or even same) to the SR UCAST codepoint in this case (well, let discussion= whether we would have the charter to do that or go ask for permission in S= PRING outstanding for now). And that could be done of course via a TLV as w= ell by using a single =E2=80=9CBAR # meaning it=E2=80=99s an SR algorithm= =E2=80=9D and then a BIER sub-tlv saying which one of those. But things get= finer. Let=E2=80=99s say we use a BAR=3D1 as BIER computation saying =E2= =80=9Cavoid all non-BIER routers=E2=80=9D. Now, that=E2=80=99s cool but may= be SR defined an algorithm we want to use on top as in =E2=80=9Ccompute SPF= with enough bandwidth=E2=80=9D. For that could have a funky TLV saying =E2= =80=9Cany BAR computation should stack this SR computation on top=E2=80=9D = but it would be then way more elegant to have a 16 bit with 8bit BAR from r= egistry and then 8 bits of some context (in this example SR computation# to= be stacked on top of the necessary BAR computation). Yes, that would preco= ndition in such case simultaneous BIER and SR deployment but since then no = technology forces mandatory use of another it=E2=80=99s flexible, open and = nicely smelling. I hope at least some people could follow that and old IGP = hands will see that this is actually as efficient in terms of actual implem= entation as a single set of constraints despite seeming complex.=C2=A0 <br>= =C2=A0<br>I won=E2=80=99t stretch my artistic license further than 16 bits = albeit there are even more interesting ideas I saw that would blow through = this ;-) I probably owe Acee a beer in London already as it is.=C2=A0 <br>= =C2=A0<br>So, in shorter form for the non-IGP cracks, I think 8 bits looks = good but I see how 16 could have an elegance to channelize some of the sugg= estions (and get a "goldilocks solution"), if we e.g. decide to = =E2=80=9Cstack algorithmic constraints from multiple technologies optionall= y on top of each other, each with its own registry that can refer to anothe= r=E2=80=9D. This would accommodate also the proposal extended by Ice in a s= imple, clean, loosely coupled way by having 16 bits, <b>first 8 bits as BIE= R type being a BIER BAR registry and 8 bits after that being =E2=80=9Copen= =E2=80=9D so e.g. being SR unicast registry number</b>.<br><br></div>I do a= lso think that if we get to such a consensus, adding text introducing test = adding a BAR type/BAR subtype 16-bits field with a BAR type BIER registry i= nto the documents is just a bit of text ... <br><div>=C2=A0<br>As=C2=A0 I s= aid, our draft will follow later today since some co-authors are in funky t= imezones ;-) =E2=80=A6=C2=A0 <br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><d= iv>thanks,</div><div>Greg</div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_= quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1= ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>--- tony<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra= "><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div class=3D"h5">On Thu, Feb 15, 201= 8 at 6:46 AM, Eric C Rosen <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:erosen@j= uniper.net" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>></span> wrote:<br><= /div></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bor= der-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div class=3D"h5"> =20 =20 =20 <div text=3D"#000000" bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"> Ice's reasoning makes sense to me.<div><div class=3D"m_-85079692576= 46552980h5"><br> <br> <div class=3D"m_-8507969257646552980m_3750865531999494430moz-cite-prefi= x">On 2/15/2018 3:11 AM, IJsbrand Wijnands (iwijnand) wrote:<br> </div> </div></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div class=3D"m_-85079692576= 46552980h5"> =20 <div>Hi Folks,</div> <div><br> </div> <div>I support 16 bits because of the following reasons.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>For me it would make sense to align the Algorithm value to the "IGP Algorithm" registry. This registry is defined in= :=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__to= ols.ietf.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dospf-2Dsegment-2Drouting-2Dextensions-2D24= -23section-2D8.5&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voD= TXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsL= KtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3DwFHQGdbIofGfam7tl7rnRjckYdcPp= 1WR-BqnaNE1mV8&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/htm<wbr>l= /draft-ietf-ospf-segment-rout<wbr>ing-extensions-24#section-8.5</a>=C2=A0</= div> <div><br> </div> <div>In my opinion, this is going to cover 90% of the use-cases because BIER is defined to run over a unicast underlay, so what ever is done for Unicast, it will work for BIER automatically (like Flex Algo), and avoids to duplicate registries. However, this registry is also 8 bits. That means there is no room for anything else and I already know there are different options about this.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>To avoid an other long debate/fight over these 8 bits, lets get more bits now so we don't corner our selfs. Its a minor change to the draft.</div> <div><br> Lets not start a debate now on how BAR is used, as I'm sure we will not reach agreement =C2=A0in time and we're gonna delay th= e IGP drafts. We can start a discussion after the IGP draft are through and what all the use-cases are we need to cover. I already look forward to those discussions :-)<br> <br> Thx,</div> <div><br> </div> <div>Ice.<br> <br> <div>Sent from my iPad</div> </div> <div><br> On 15 Feb 2018, at 07:24, Jeff Tantsura <<a href=3D"mailto:jefft= [email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br> <br> </div> <blockquote type=3D"cite"> <div><span>+1</span><br> <span></span><br> <span>I=E2=80=99d really like to see justification for anything l= arger than 8 bits.</span><br> <span></span><br> <span>Regards,</span><br> <span>Jeff</span><br> <span></span><br> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>On Feb 14, 2018, at 18:30, Acee Lindem (acee) <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D= "_blank">[email protected]</a>> wrote:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>I agree. As a point of reference, we've only have defined two IGP algorithms so far and the segment routing draft dates back about 4 years. </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span><a href=3D"https://urldefense.pro= ofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.iana.org_assignments_igp-2Dparameters_= igp-2Dparameters.xhtml-23igp-2Dalgorithm-2Dtypes&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAk= Yuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAw= JXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s= =3D5yaJPFqWpr5V5oBQ4O7o779WCOla79NlPw5FEfmRAUY&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">= https://www.iana.org/assignmen<wbr>ts/igp-parameters/igp-<wbr>parameters.xh= tml#igp-algorithm<wbr>-types</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Even with more artistic freedom afforded to multicast, =C2=A0I still believe 256 standard algorithms are enough. </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Thanks,</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Acee </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=EF=BB=BFOn 2/14/18, 9:15 PM, &qu= ot;BIER on behalf of Dolganow, Andrew (Nokia - SG/Singapore)" <<= a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">bier-bounces@ietf= .org</a> on behalf of <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank= ">[email protected]</a>> wrote:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0Guys,</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0I would think 8 bits = are sufficient. Others (like SegRtg mentioned below also use 8). 8 bits gives us tons of room to grow - especially since we have only a single value defined currently (SFP 0). If we have clear use cases that show us running out of 8 bits or getting close to that we can/should discuss and evaluate extensions in light of that but increasing the space "just in case" is not a prudent way to go.</s= pan><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0Andrew</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0-----Original Message= -----</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0From: BIER <<a hre= f=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]<= /a>> on behalf of Xiejingrong <<a href=3D"mailto:xiejingrong@huawe= i.com" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0Date: Wednesday, Febr= uary 14, 2018 at 5:06 PM</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0To: Arkadiy Gulko <= ;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">arka= diy.gulko@thomsonreuters.<wbr>com</a>>, "<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">bier= @ietf.org</a>" <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">bier@i= etf.org</a>>, "<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">i= [email protected]</a>" <<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">isi= [email protected]</a>></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0Subject: Re: [Bier] W= GLC : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extension<wbr>s-07.txt</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Hi Arkadiy,</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0I checked the latest <draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routi<wbr>ng-extensions-24> an= d <draft-ietf-isis-segment-routi<wbr>ng-extensions-15> fo= r reference and comparing, and they both use a 8 bits Algorithm.</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0One of the description: "Algorithm: Single octet identifying the algorithm."= ;</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Interesting to use more than 8 bits for BIER's future flexibility :-)</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Regards,</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0XieJingrong</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0-----Original Message-----</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0From: BIER [<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">m= ailto:[email protected]</a>] On Behalf Of <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D= "_blank">[email protected]<wbr>om</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2018 8:42 AM</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0To: <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>= ; <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">isis-wg= @ietf.org</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Subject: [Bier] WGLC : draft-ietf-bier-isis-extension<wbr>s-07.txt</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Hello Working Group,</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0After initial discussions between multiple participants of the working group, we consolidated that BIER's future flexibility would be well served if we extend the IGP signaling BAR field to 16 bits. We are currently reviewing various use-cases that can greatly benefit from this enhancement.</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0I would appreciate if the proposed change could be considered as part of IETF Last Call review.</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Thanks,</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Arkadiy</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0-----Original Message-----</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0From: BIER [<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">m= ailto:[email protected]</a>] On Behalf Of <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank"= >[email protected]</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Sent: Friday, February 09, 2018 5:11 PM</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0To: <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">i-d-annou= [email protected]</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Cc: <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>= </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Subject: [Bier] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bier-isis-extension<wbr>s-07.txt</span><br= > </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.</span= ><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0This draft is a work item of the Bit Indexed Explicit Replication WG of the IETF.</span= ><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Title =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: BIER support via ISIS</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Authors =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: Les Ginsberg</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wb= r>=C2=A0=C2=A0Tony Przygienda</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wb= r>=C2=A0=C2=A0Sam Aldrin</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wb= r>=C2=A0=C2=A0Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Filename =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0: draft-ietf-bier-isis-extension<wbr>s-07.txt</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Pages =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: 10</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Date =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: 2018-02-09</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Abstract:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Specification of an ISIS extension to support BIER domains and sub-</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0domains.</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatr= acker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextensions_&d=3DDwICAg&= amp;c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZq= HQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5H= yTvYs&s=3D3qPmQav_QUBjHi7KygPVk9bIhVZ7TL2Z3xfHOo_Cjwc&e=3D" target= =3D"_blank">https://urldefense.proof<wbr>point.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__<wb= r>datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft<wbr>-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextens<wbr>ion= s_&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoW<wbr>k-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY<= wbr>&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOc<wbr>xu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3r= r3No8R<wbr>eKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTv<wbr>Ys&s=3D3qPmQav_QUBjHi7Kyg= PVk9bIh<wbr>VZ7TL2Z3xfHOo_Cjwc&e=3D</a> </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0There are also htmlized versions available at:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.= ietf.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextensions-2D07&d=3DDwICAg&a= mp;c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqH= QByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5Hy= TvYs&s=3D_nTFvlAW24snrkMm3aQ2uWLFsLCajYeW4HO3DdEiwvs&e=3D" target= =3D"_blank">https://urldefense.proof<wbr>point.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__<wb= r>tools.ietf.org_html_draft-2Die<wbr>tf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextensions-<wbr>2D0= 7&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk<wbr>-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&a= mp;<wbr>r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcx<wbr>u4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr= 3No8Re<wbr>KzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvY<wbr>s&s=3D_nTFvlAW24snrkMm3aQ= 2uWLFsL<wbr>CajYeW4HO3DdEiwvs&e=3D</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatr= acker.ietf.org_doc_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextensions-2D07&d= =3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2= ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6f= a9xveuyL5HyTvYs&s=3DzHWCGuyM-GSX-slbFtCv4fs9ml5gPQBeXohosuyhpx4&e= =3D" target=3D"_blank">https://urldefense.proof<wbr>point.com/v2/url?u=3Dht= tps-3A__<wbr>datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_<wbr>draft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-= <wbr>2Dextensions-2D07&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D<wbr>4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-= <wbr>1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3D<wbr>JA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4<wbr>cQ= skARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKz<wbr>E_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs&<w= br>s=3DzHWCGuyM-GSX-slbFtCv4fs9ml5g<wbr>PQBeXohosuyhpx4&e=3D</a> </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0A diff from the previous version is available at:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ie= tf.org_rfcdiff-3Furl2-3Ddraft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-2Dextensions-2D07&d= =3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2= ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6f= a9xveuyL5HyTvYs&s=3DpDVWzZrYzGia4WKiA_cSF0P5isUmMeojSvHJIGgdOTk&e= =3D" target=3D"_blank">https://urldefense.proof<wbr>point.com/v2/url?u=3Dht= tps-3A__<wbr>www.ietf.org_rfcdiff-3Furl2-<wbr>3Ddraft-2Dietf-2Dbier-2Disis-= <wbr>2Dextensions-2D07&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D<wbr>4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-= <wbr>1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3D<wbr>JA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4<wbr>cQ= skARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKz<wbr>E_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs&<w= br>s=3DpDVWzZrYzGia4WKiA_cSF0P5isUm<wbr>MeojSvHJIGgdOTk&e=3D</a> </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at <a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-= 3A__tools.ietf.org&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3v= oDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRP= sLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3DqZ3p2sAIpzRPXfiRBbzrB1rPAka= JXEKiz43EmIKO03Y&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">tools.ietf.org</a>.</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dftp-3A__ftp.ietf= .org_internet-2Ddrafts_&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1= I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&m= =3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs&s=3DwqMqmybm38ZiX4CuzJaN= JPMea1Mf-pSgD-vdgAHk850&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://urldefense.proo= f<wbr>point.com/v2/url?u=3Dftp-3A__<wbr>ftp.ietf.org_internet-2Ddrafts<wbr>= _&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-<wbr>GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&a= mp;<wbr>r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcx<wbr>u4cQskARppQFqZc&m=3DTOz3rr= 3No8Re<wbr>KzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvY<wbr>s&s=3DwqMqmybm38ZiX4CuzJa= NJPMea1<wbr>Mf-pSgD-vdgAHk850&e=3D</a> </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0________________________<wbr>_______________________</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0BIER mailing list</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a></sp= an><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ie= tf.org_mailman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk-GVjSLmy8= -1Cr1I4FWIvbLFebwKgY&r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcxu4cQskARppQFqZc&am= p;m=3DTOz3rr3No8ReKzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvYs&s=3DkxUz28mTxGjbNsEQM= Gi8SMZ93LSiMt_bMFzqkWJJZnU&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://urldefense.p= roof<wbr>point.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__<wbr>www.ietf.org_mailman_listinfo_= <wbr>bier&d=3DDwICAg&c=3D4ZIZThykDLcoWk<wbr>-GVjSLmy8-1Cr1I4FWIvbLF= ebwKgY&<wbr>r=3DJA6g2ZDvIPLQHZqHQByKQq-jvOcx<wbr>u4cQskARppQFqZc&m= =3DTOz3rr3No8Re<wbr>KzE_27M4FMDvmv6fa9xveuyL5HyTvY<wbr>s&s=3DkxUz28mTxG= jbNsEQMGi8SMZ93L<wbr>SiMt_bMFzqkWJJZnU&e=3D</a> </span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0________________________<wbr>_______________________</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0BIER mailing list</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a></sp= an><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ie= tf.org_mailman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjB= XeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&am= p;m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77P= qu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org= /mai<wbr>lman/listinfo/bier</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0________________________<wbr>_______________________</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0BIER mailing list</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a></sp= an><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ie= tf.org_mailman_listinfo_bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjB= XeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&am= p;m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77P= qu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org= /mai<wbr>lman/listinfo/bier</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0_____________________= _______<wbr>___________________</span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0BIER mailing list</sp= an><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0<a href=3D"mailto:BIE= [email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=C2=A0=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://ur= ldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mailman_listinfo_= bier&d=3DDwMGaQ&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&= ;r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyh= yVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUB= EU&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman<wbr>/listinfo/b= ier</a></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br> </blockquote> <blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>______________________________<wb= 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Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB84eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3F0= kG0VNo&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhyVNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv4y5W1= l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJnnZSv6lUBEU&e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://url= defense.proofpoint.<wbr>com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.iet<wbr>f.org_mailman_= listinfo_bier&d=3D<wbr>DwICAg&c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Scbfh0U<wbr>jBXeMK-= ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3D-DXB8<wbr>4eU9m4cIlq2OOcCJCQQAwJXQQswyu3<wbr>F0kG0V= No&m=3DIpRPsLKtgfyfQk0dyhy<wbr>VNsVupKQyUKWP_faic5jyDyo&s=3D0xv<wbr= >4y5W1l17zAz77Pqu_Jjah0kcuvYCJn<wbr>nZSv6lUBEU&e=3D</a> </pre> </blockquote> <br> </div> <br></div></div>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br> Isis-wg mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a><= br> <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg" rel=3D"noreferrer= " target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l<wbr>istinfo/isis-wg</a><= br> <br></blockquote></div><br></div> <br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br> BIER mailing list<br> <a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br> <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bier" rel=3D"noreferrer" t= arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/bier</a><br> <br></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div> --001a11449e22f96d7d056542dce8-- --===============5604757811760984784== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list [email protected] https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg --===============5604757811760984784==--