Re: [OM Cooker] Are we still doing this moderation? Really?

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2013/7/31 Robert Xu <[email protected]>

>
> On Jul 30, 2013 7:22 PM, "Johnny A. Solbu" <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > This mail is something I've been wanting to do a few times, but never
> did because I didn't se much point. But now I feel a need to say somethin=
g.
> > This will be my only input in the so called =ABAssosiation/OMA/OMDV vs
> POK=BB noise. It is Not my intention or meaning to restart any heated deb=
ate
> or stiring up any old wounds. But recent events on this list regarding wh=
en
> certain posts are comming in leads me to a need to say something.
> >
> >
> > Isn't it time that Per =D8yvind be removed from moderation? If he start=
s
> to =ABmisbehave=BB or whatnot he can always be added to the moderation li=
st
> again.
> >
> > It's hard to follow some of the threads when all his posts are comming
> long after replies to his moderated posts comes in. Leading me to ignore
> the threads all together, because I can't follow it.
> >
> > This years turn of events that resulted in one of the major contributor=
s
> beeing censored/moderated, is a major reason that I still haven't restart=
ed
> packaging for either OpenMandriva or Moondrake. Somethimes I'm tempted to
> leave both OMV and Moondrake and concentrate my packaging on Mageia, and =
I
> don't think I'm alone in thinking of leaving because of this conflict. Th=
e
> continuing of the moderation is part of the conflict.
> >
> > I also need to say that, looking into this from an outsiders
> perspective: I don't know who's right and who's wrong. I don't know if Pe=
r
> =D8yvind, The assosiation or another party is the troublemaker. I really =
do
> not care who's fault it is that things became as they are.
> >
>
> +1
>
> But not only removing him from moderation, but also removing the
> Association part from it. I don't understand why the association came int=
o
> a Cooker dispute to begin with, but Association !=3D Cooker and so really
> shouldn't have much power here.
>
> I said it before, I'll say it again - let Cooker sort out things itself
> without any association interference.
>
Hear, hear!

This was exactly the position that was reaffirmed at the cooker "emergency
meeting" back in March (that came from dissatisfaction with association
meddling), which it only took a week before the association and it's
council decided to completely ignore this and cease control of the project.
Some of the reasoning used was that since the project now was hosted on the
servers that had been donated to the association, the project belongs to
the association (according to this logic, github, sourceforge etc. must own
quite a few projects out there).

Also despite that we had explicitly made it clear that the council didn't
get to have a say in project leadership nor that we would have any member
exclusive technical committee, but rather continue with having cooker
governed through the meritocracy of active contributors, the council
decided to not only make a decission about new project leader, but they
also decided that I would no longer be allowed to be part of the technical
committee (...), thus not allowed to contribute to the project.

As a result, I've been forced to maintain a pseudo fork with a wide
selection of packages with various fixed and improvements maintained in my
own separate repo rather than being able to push all of my changes directly
to the cooker project.

For those interested, my package repository is available at
http://abf-ownloads.rosalinux.ru/mdk_personal/repository/cooker/


For the behaviour of the association and it's council and their meddling
with the project in conflict with the position shared by it's developers, I
really think we should organize a new meetingg to make sure to discuss the
situation and really reaffirm our position for real this time.

--
Regards,
Per =D8yvind

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<div dir=3D"ltr">2013/7/31 Robert Xu <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailt=
o:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>&gt;</span><br><d=
iv class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gm=
ail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-l=
eft-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class=3D""><div class=3D"h5"><p dir=3D"ltr"><br>
On Jul 30, 2013 7:22 PM, &quot;Johnny A. Solbu&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; This mail is something I&#39;ve been wanting to do a few times, but ne=
ver did because I didn&#39;t se much point. But now I feel a need to say so=
mething.<br>
&gt; This will be my only input in the so called =ABAssosiation/OMA/OMDV vs=
 POK=BB noise. It is Not my intention or meaning to restart any heated deba=
te or stiring up any old wounds. But recent events on this list regarding w=
hen certain posts are comming in leads me to a need to say something.<br>


&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Isn&#39;t it time that Per =D8yvind be removed from moderation? If he =
starts to =ABmisbehave=BB or whatnot he can always be added to the moderati=
on list again.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; It&#39;s hard to follow some of the threads when all his posts are com=
ming long after replies to his moderated posts comes in. Leading me to igno=
re the threads all together, because I can&#39;t follow it.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; This years turn of events that resulted in one of the major contributo=
rs beeing censored/moderated, is a major reason that I still haven&#39;t re=
started packaging for either OpenMandriva or Moondrake. Somethimes I&#39;m =
tempted to leave both OMV and Moondrake and concentrate my packaging on Mag=
eia, and I don&#39;t think I&#39;m alone in thinking of leaving because of =
this conflict. The continuing of the moderation is part of the conflict.<br=
>


&gt;<br>
&gt; I also need to say that, looking into this from an outsiders perspecti=
ve: I don&#39;t know who&#39;s right and who&#39;s wrong. I don&#39;t know =
if Per =D8yvind, The assosiation or another party is the troublemaker. I re=
ally do not care who&#39;s fault it is that things became as they are.<br>


&gt;</p>
</div></div><p dir=3D"ltr">+1</p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">But not only removing him from moderation, but also removing=
 the Association part from it. I don&#39;t understand why the association c=
ame into a Cooker dispute to begin with, but Association !=3D Cooker and so=
 really shouldn&#39;t have much power here.</p>


<p dir=3D"ltr">I said it before, I&#39;ll say it again - let Cooker sort ou=
t things itself without any association interference.</p></blockquote><div =
style>Hear, hear!</div><div style><br></div><div style>This was exactly the=
 position that was reaffirmed at the cooker &quot;emergency meeting&quot; b=
ack in March (that came from dissatisfaction with association meddling), wh=
ich it only took a week before the association and it&#39;s council decided=
 to completely ignore this and cease control of the project. Some of the re=
asoning used was that since the project now was hosted on the servers that =
had been donated to the association, the project belongs to the association=
 (according to this logic, github, sourceforge etc. must own quite a few pr=
ojects out there).</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>Also despite that we had explicitly made it=
 clear that the council didn&#39;t get to have a say in project leadership =
nor that we would have any member exclusive technical committee, but rather=
 continue with having cooker governed through the meritocracy of active con=
tributors, the council decided to not only make a decission about new proje=
ct leader, but they also decided that I would no longer be allowed to be pa=
rt of the technical committee (...), thus not allowed to contribute to the =
project.</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>As a result, I&#39;ve been forced to mainta=
in a pseudo fork with a wide selection of packages with various fixed and i=
mprovements maintained in my own separate repo rather than being able to pu=
sh all of my changes directly to the cooker project.</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>For those interested, my package repository=
 is available at <a href=3D"http://abf-ownloads.rosalinux.ru/mdk_personal/r=
epository/cooker/">http://abf-ownloads.rosalinux.ru/mdk_personal/repository=
/cooker/</a></div>
<div style><br></div><div style><br></div><div style>For the behaviour of t=
he association and it&#39;s council and their meddling with the project in =
conflict with the position shared by it&#39;s developers, I really think we=
 should organize a new meetingg to make sure to discuss the situation and r=
eally reaffirm our position for real this time.</div>
<div style><br></div><div style>--</div><div style>Regards,</div><div style=
>Per =D8yvind</div></div></div></div>

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