Re: Re[2]: [Security Firewall] Florins Firewall

On 3-Aug-05, at 2:44 AM, Mitchell, Neill wrote:

> Whilst I totally agree that Mandiva has a right to exploit the MNF 2
> product, I do feel this email is a bit harsh. A lot of people,  
> including
> myself, have given an awful lot of free testing time to Mandriva.  
> Without us
> the product would not be anywhere near where it is today.
> Also, as a paid up member of the Mandriva Club, which saved you  
> from going
> bust, I would have hoped that a Club edition of MNF 2 could have  
> been made
> available. You are making revenue from the club and it would be  
> nice to pay
> back the members. Let's face it you are not going to lose many  
> corprate
> sales. Not many companies are going to buy MNF 2 on the cheap as a  
> firewall
> is totally mission critical.
> Please support your club members as they have supported you.

I can understand your sentiments... really, I do.  But I wasn't aware  
that a free copy of MNF was one of the perks of Club.  Did I miss  
that somewhere?  Did Mandriva promise a copy of MNF for free to Club  
members and I missed the PR?  If such a thing wasn't promised, I  
suppose you can justify what you're doing any way you like, but if  
the bottom line is that Club is there to provide "goodies" to the  
desktop stuff, and always has been, then expecting a copy of MNF  
because you're a Club member seems like quite an expectation.

I suppose next you'll expect that because you were around during the  
10.0 cycle and maybe tried a beta or two, you're entitled to a free  
copy of Corporate Server and it's support for 5 years?

Anyways, isn't one of the arguments for starting a new firewall based  
on MNF precisely due to the corporate nature of the product, and how  
it's so good in enterprise situations?  If that's the case, and if  
it's going to be used in an environment for which it's intended,  
maybe Mandriva isn't entirely wrong to expect some compensation from  
their target audience?

You make it sound like Mandriva doesn't support their Club members  
and all we're doing is running off with your money and not giving any  
value for it.  Further, you seem to expect something that was never  
indicated nor implied.

I honestly don't know why you're so upset.  Unless you're a member of  
the Corporate Club?  Are you?

And I tried to be as polite as possible in my email.

>> okay... So, where shall we start from ?
>>
>
> Start with a mailing list.  Seriously guys, I have no problem with you
> wanting to take Mandriva's hard work and invested man hours, wages,  
> and
> research to run off and start your own copy-cat distro and rob  
> Mandriva of
> their well-earned work... that is the spirit of open source and GPL'd
> software these days, so its entirely your right.
>
> But, out of respect for the people that you're taking advantage of,  
> could
> you discuss the competing product somewhere other than the support and
> discussion list for the product you plan to use without paying  
> for?  I mean,
> really, it seems odd that this is a list to discuss MNF but all you  
> want to
> talk about out is a) how unfair it is that they're not giving it  
> away, b)
> how you all want free copies of the MNF ISOs because you lurk on a  
> mailing
> list, and c) how you now want to check it out of CVS, strip out all
> reference to Mandriva, and use it gratis.  I don't think it's  
> appropriate to
> discuss that kind of thing on *this* mailing list.
>
> I've heard people offer to setup websites and subversion  
> repositories and
> stuff, but you can start with just a plain old mailing list while  
> you hatch
> your plot?  I'm sure it's insulting enough to Mandriva to hear  
> about how you
> all love MNF but just don't feel like paying for the hard work  
> invested, but
> to add injury to the insult, you're using Mandriva's infrastructure to
> discuss a fork.
>
> Maybe this list could be used for what it was intended, and  
> everyone who
> feels that they've earned the fruit of the labour without paying  
> for the
> harvest can do so elsewhere.
>
> My $0.02CAD.  I don't really care that you're doing what you're  
> doing, or at
> least planning to, but I think a little bit of respect is deserved  
> and this
> is pretty disrespectful.

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