Re: update ibus to 1.5.1

On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 2:51 AM, Takashi Iwai <[email protected]> wrote:
> At Wed, 30 Jan 2013 17:15:27 +0900,
> Takao Fujiwara wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 30, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Hillwood Yang <[email protected]> wrote:
>> > 在 2013-01-29二的 08:30 +0100，Takashi Iwai写道：
>> >> At Tue, 29 Jan 2013 14:54:20 +0800,
>> >> Hillwood Yang wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > hello everyone:
>> >> >
>> >> > 1.5.x stable version of ibus , ibus-pinyin , ibus-anthy and ibus-table
>> >> > have been released for a long time, and other ibus input engine also can
>> >> > work with ibus 1.5.1 ，I think we could update them in factory.
>> >>
>> >> Well, now is a bad timing just before 12.3 release.  We shouldn't
>> >> change the devel project too much until 12.3 is released and FACTORY
>> >> is opened again.
>> >>
>> >> > Ibus 1.4.2 has been unfit to work in gnome 3.6. Gnome 3.6 can block
>> >> > ibus's tray icon , we can't view which engine we use current from tray
>> >> > icon in ibus 1.4.2 . But in ibus 1.5.x , we can view it form the fly box
>> >> > while switching engine if disable ibus build for gnome-settings-daemon ,
>> >> > or view it form gnome's language tray icon if enable ibus build for
>> >> > gnome-settings-daemon.
>> >> >
>> >> > What do you think?
>> >> >
>> >> > Request#150248:
>> >> > https://build.opensuse.org/request/show/150248
>> >>
>> >> The biggest problems would be the migration and the stability.
>> >> When I tested ibus 1.5 shortly ago, both failed too badly.
>> >> Upgrading to M17N:Devel from a system running with ibus-1.4.x
>> >> (mozc, anthy and m17n) triggered frequent segfaults, even blocked the
>> >> toggle of IM (likely due to key assignment / policy changes) -- in
>> >> short, it was just useless on that system.
>> >
>> > I found the problem about blocked the toggle of IM only in openSUSE 12.3
>> > (M2 and beta) after force enabled ibus-gjs 3.4.1. I don't know whether
>> > you enabled ibus-gjs too. If This is the reason about this problem , we
>> > can ignore it, end users should not install ibus-gjs 3.4.1 from
>> > M17N:Devel, and it seems that openSUSE don't supply technical support
>> > for third party repertories , especially test repertories. ibus-gjs also
>> > will not included in openSUSE 12.3 ， it only word in GNOME 3.4.x.
>>
>> I'm not sure what is the toggle problem.
>> ibus-gjs works with gnome-shell 3.4 and ibus-gjs is no longer needed
>> in gnome-shell 3.6 since ibus was integrated.
>>
>> And right, we have changed the behavior of trigger keys in ibus 1.5.
>
> I tested right now with the latest 12.3 (FACTORY) and M17N:Devel.
> My desktop is XFCE.
>
> The biggest problem is that now ibus itself manages the keyboard
> layout.  This really sucks, especially when you have own modified
> keyboard layout.
>
> Since now IM activation/deactivation is handled like the change of
> different IMs (e.g. "English US keyboard" and "Mozc"), if you haven't
> registered the proper IMs beforehand, you'll be lost.  This
> incompatibility is confusing and it took long time to figure out for
> me.
>
> I know that you can activate/deactivate IM even in each method
> (e.g. via Henkan key), too.  But, for example, Mozc doesn't define
> such key bindings for non-Japanese keyboards properly.  Thus if you
> have only US keyboard, you can't manage it at all.

I suppose JP keyboard and Japanese IMEs (configured as JP keyboard)
instead of US keyboard in case you use Henkan key.
ibus-setup 1.5 can configure the trigger keys but it's not for each
IME but the global setting and I think it would be almost same with
1.4.

>
> Maybe because of that reason (policy change about keyboard layout
> management), the IM activation state isn't shown in the tray icon.
> So if you activate/deactivate IM in Mozc, you can't see whether it's
> in preedit mode or not.

Probably I don't understand the problem. ibus panel icon shows the
current engine.

>
> Also maybe because of the same reason, the IM is always activated at
> the login time.  When I choose Mozc as default, it starts in the
> preedit mode for typing Japanese after login.  I have to switch back
> to English USA layout or turn off IM manually.

Yes, it's good the default is an ibus keymap engine but not input method engine.

>
> There is a global "go to next IM" key binding, yes.  But if you have
> more than two IMs, switching Latin and Japanese doesn't work like
> before.
>
> Again, the keyboard layout override is confusing when you already have
> a modified layout.  This can be a big reason I'll stop using the new
> ibus from now on.  The keyboard layout isn't a job of IM.

Currently ibus suppose the XKB layout and variant per engine and the
global XKB options.
Now ibus-anthy provides the customization of the keymap too.

>
> One good news is that I haven't see segfaults I had hit ago :)
>
> So... my impression is that it's still in rough edge.
> And the new keyboard handling is really confusing for the old user
> like me.  Maybe it'd be good for people who only use two IMs (one
> Latin and one native IM).
>
>
> thanks,
>
> Takashi
>
>
>> >
>> > Ibus-anthy and ibus-m17n always work fine with ibus 1.5 in my three PCs
>> > (openSUSE 12.2) and a VirtualBox system (opensuse 12.3). I can't
>> > reappear the problem about ibus-anthy and ibus-m17n which you mentioned.
>> >
>> > Can you tell me steps you how to reappear these problems which you
>> > mentioned ? I think you should test at other system , at least 12.3.
>> >
>> > To Huang Peng , Takao Fujiwara and Ma Xiaojun: Can you give us some
>> > help ?
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Maybe we should test the upgrade paths, at least 12.3, before actually
>> >> upgrading the stuff in M17N project: install 12.3-beta1 or latest one
>> >> on a VM (GNOME, KDE, other DE), upgrade to M17N:Devel, and see whether
>> >> any regression happens.
>> >
>> > At the more that half a year, I have tested the upgrade paths (oss to
>> > M17N:Devel and M17N to M17N:Devel) at 12.2&12.3(M1,M2 and Beta) On
>> > GNOME, KDE and Mate, I didn't find any serious problem, only some minor
>> > bugs. Some of them have been fixed. If you really think there are some
>> > serious problems, can you please report them to upstream: Huang Peng ,
>> > Takao Fujiwara and Ma Xiaojun ?
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> thanks,
>> >>
>> >> Takashi
>> >
>> >
>>
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