Re: Linux on the desktop viewed as from Joe Winuser

On Thu, 18 Dec 2003, Dexter Filmore wrote:

> 
> All untrue. What keeps folks from Linux on Desktop is bash. Simple is that. 
> You can't write an app that runs on all known desktop environments with start
> menu items, desktop icons or quick launchs for you would have to take into
> account:
> KDE2, KDE3, Gnome1, Gnome2, XFCE, Fluxbox, Enlightenment, Windowmaker, blah
> blah blah. 

Firstly, AFAIK, XFCE, Fluxbox, Enlightenment and Windowmaker are all just
window managers, rather than desktop environments. As such, they don't
provide a "start menu" as such. Secondly, none of these are standard options
for the user-friendly distros that migrants (refugees?) from Windows will
use.

So that leaves KDE and GNOME to consider for this group. Now IIRC, both are
moving towards using standard .desktop files to describe how to start
applications and add menu entries. It is up to the packagers of applications
to make use of this facility. Lots of well-packaged RPMs already do this
(e.g. most of those from RH and freshrpms).

> You can open a term with bash in all of these, but this is the point where Joe
> Winuser get scared: command line.
> This makes people think DOS. Which makes them think "obsolete"

I don't know about "obsolete" (MacOS X and Windows NT/2K/XP all have command
line interfaces), but "scary black window" is one term I have heard from
non-technical users.

> Next thing. Windows user wants to surf to some website with flash content or
> embedded video. Windows user was clever enough not to use IE but Opera and
> found Opera is available for Linux, too. Wants to keep it since there aint no
> IE at all.
> So it comes to downloading and installing Opera. 
> Installing. Umm. double click? Nah, won't work. So what to do with this rpm
> thing?

Under RH, you should be able to use Nautilus to browse to the RPM and
double-click to install it. I'm pretty sure it doesn't do recursive
dependency resolution yet, but it's getting there.

> Command line. Yuck. Too complex. Reading manuals? For installing a program?
> What a waste of time.

For home desktops, probably - sadly! But enterprise desktops are another
matter; a professional (i.e. helpful) sysadmin will make sure all his or her
users have all the applications they require to do their Real Work, and will
be responsive to requests for new applications.

> Even if Joe Winuser reads the manual, he will come up with questions like "why
> can't I chose the destination dir?" and the linux geek will tell him that's
> possible if he COMPILES the SOURCE CODE and PREFIXES the destination dir in
> the CONFIGURE SCRIPT from the COMMAND LINE. Joe Winuser is scared.

a) most non-technical users don't modify any of the default install options.
b) for the intermediate- and power-users, the correct answer is "you don't
   need to; it'll work perfectly as it is, and you can use your standard
   distro package management tools to uninstall, or find out where
   everything is". Again, sysadmins should be managing apps for enterprise
   users anyway.

> Let's say Joe got a distro with a graphical package maintenance and really
> only had to select the package and say "install" and doesn't give a rats ass
> about dest dir.
> Now Opera is there, fine. But how to start it? Dunno what it's like with other
> dists but here on Slackware it won't generate Gnome Menu entries.

Looks like Opera's packaging and/or Slackware aren't designed for
non-technical users. Try another distro that is.

> Choices: "Run Application" and bash. I said enough about bash didn't I?
> So there's Run Application, big deal: a dialog box with a text field. What to
> enter there? "Opera"<return>. Result: "The target file://Opera could not be
> opened". Hmm, so something must have gone wrong with the installation, right?
> No, it's only caps, but does Joe know (*wanna* know)? Guess.

Irrelevant, if the application is packaged properly and installs a .desktop
file. Windows users have by-and-large rejected
"unzip-and-scatter-files-over-your-disc" installation, and so should we
(other than as a lowest-common-denominator for technical users). If an
application is packaged poorly, an enterprise sysadmin should create
user-friendly packages for his or her users and make a RFE to the vendor or
reject the application.

> So let's say Joe figures Linux is case sensitive and manages to run Opera. 
> Next thing is Flash. 
> So we need Flash. Go to download site. Read instructions. Terminal, bash,
> untar, become root, copy some stuff to some obnoxious place nobody ever heard
> about before.

There are RPMs for Flash that Do The Right Thing too.

> And so on.
> 
> All this takes me a handful of mouseclicks in Windowsdone in under 5 minutes
> while I wasted 2 hours so far reading "fucking manuals" and getting larted in
> irc chats, and you really ask what keeps Linux/desktop going to the masses?

General-purpose computers (as opposed to fixed-purpose "Information
Toasters" or centrally-administered workstations) for non-technical users
are a dumb idea. I hope they die soon, in favour of the two alternatives I
just mentioned.

General-purpose computers, whether they're running Linux, Windows, or even
MacOS, are only really suitable for hobbyists and technical users. Forcing
non-technical users to use them is cruel and unusual punishment. Look upon
them as the early motor cars. Look at today's cars and public transport and
see how little technical knowledge they require of their users. The closest
equivalents to those are "information toasters" and centrally-administered
workstations respectively. The good news is, that Linux (or BSD) makes a
good basis for technical users to develop such devices for their users (for
proof, see the TiVo PVR and Sharp Zaurus PDA - running Linux and sold on the
high street, but the non-technical user wouldn't even guess at that fact!)

> Dex

Best Regards,
Alex.
-- 
Alex Butcher      Brainbench MVP for Internet Security: www.brainbench.com
Bristol, UK                      Need reliable and secure network systems?
PGP/GnuPG ID:0x271fd950                         <http://www.assursys.com/>