Re: A few questions - Music before Revolution; Cage and Maderna; the concept of 'experimental music' in the 1960s
Stefano Pocci <[email protected]> Mon, 30 Jul 2018 19:56:19 +0300
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Hi Ian,
I cannot give you exact clues for the information you are asking, but I
take your email to spread the news about a beautiful production by
Italian label Die Schachtel about the work of Marino Zuccheri in the
Studio di Fonologia in Milan.
Bruno Maderna and Luigi Nono, are the most frequently cited composers in
the publication, along with Luciano Berio of course and other more or
less famous ones. Among the first ones, I would at least mention Cage
and Stockhausen.
For all Cage fans, there is a nice testimony of Zuccheri about the
creation of Fontana Mix and how he helped Cage with the tape assemblage.
The Cage-Zuccheri section features a short letter of John to Marino,
together with 2 hand-drawn schemes by Cage himself of the equipment of
the Studio di Fonologia.
Other technical diagrams are featured in the section about Nono's
collaboration with Zuccheri and there is a section speaking of the work
that Zuccheri did with Stockhausen.
The publication comes in 2 editions, both in English
1. a smaller book + cd:
https://www.soundohm.com/product/milan-rai-studio-di-fonologia-musicale-1955-83-book-cd/pid/31950/
2. a lavish, bigger book + vinyl + cd:
https://www.soundohm.com/product/milan-rai-studio-di-fonologia-musicale-1955-83-art-edition/pid/31934/
Both editions contain a rich bibliographical index to essays and books
(mostly in Italian though), part of which probably are of your current
interest.
As a side note, the book revealed a recently opened section of Teche Rai
(the archives of Rai, the National Italian tv-radio) which contains
interesting archival material about the Orchestra Sinfonica of Rai
http://www.osn.teche.rai.it/Default.aspx
including the scan of a letter of Bach
<http://www.osn.teche.rai.it/Download.aspx?data=k3AiMZPV3bmhFlsIyM08fUQ0II0ej68PQbbUrf8WruM/Nv3xoR2zpfgUmR/0sx6m>,
for instance :)
Cheers,
Stefano
On 29.07.2018 15:03, Pace, Ian wrote:
>
> Dear All,
>
> I have a few distinct questions about which I wondered if subscribers
> to this list might have some answers.
>
> 1. The 1972 four-LP set /Music Before Revolution/ (available at
> Ubuweb - http://ubu.com/sound/music-before-revolution.html
> <http://ubu.com/sound/music-before-revolution.html> ) (Odeon 1C
> 165-28954/7 -
> https://www.discogs.com/Ensemble-Musica-Negativa-Music-Before-Revolution/release/872739
> ) features works of Cage, Feldman, Brown, Wolff and Ichiyanagi,
> and conversations with these, and Hans G Helms and Heinz-Klaus
> Metzger. According to Alex J. Lubet, Indeterminate Origins: A
> Cultural Theory of American Experimental Music, in James R.
> Heintze. (ed.), /Perspectives on American Music since 1950/ (New
> York and London: Garland Publishing, 1999), p. 99, this album was
> a tribute to Maos Cultural Revolution. What is known of the
> extent to which the composers involved were aware of or
> sympathetic to the motivations behind such a project? Wolffs
> Maoist sympathies for a period are well-known, as are Cages over
> a shorter time from the early 1970s; but I have not encountered
> anything from Feldman or Brown on this subject, and am unsure of
> the extent to which Ichiyanagi shared sympathies with other
> Japanese composers of his generation who gravitated towards Maoist
> ideas.
>
> 2. Both Antonio Trudu (in /La Scuola di Darmstadt: I Ferienkurse
> dal 1946 a oggi /(Milan: Ricordi, 1992), p. 125 n. 6)
> and//Christopher Shultis (in Cage and Europe, in David Nicholls
> (ed.) /The Cambridge Companion to John Cage/ (Cambridge and New
> York: Cambridge University Press, 2002), p. 33) argue that Bruno
> Maderna was apparently responsible for suggesting that Wolfgang
> Steinecke invite Cage to Darmstadt in 1958 in place of Boulez,
> though these claims (which apparently come from former IMD
> archivist Wilhelm Schlüter) have been contested by Martin Iddon
> (in /New Music at Darmstadt: Nono, Stockhausen, Cage, and Boulez
> /(Cambridge and New York: Cambridge University Press, 2013), pp.
> 198-200) on the basis of examination of the published
> Maderna-Steinecke correspondence. What I have not yet found, after
> consulting various sources on both Cage and Maderna, is much about
> the relationship between the two, and Madernas thoughts on Cages
> music and aesthetic. One of the areas I am considering at the
> moment is the aleatoric work of Boulez, Stockhausen, Maderna and
> others and its provenance. Much historical writing and that on new
> music in French treats this body of work as a separate category
> from Cageian indeterminacy, while Cage and (especially) Feldman,
> and many others after them, portrayed the former as essentially a
> second-hand rendition of what members of the New York School were
> doing earlier. So does anyone know of any sources on Maderna and
> Cage, including anything Maderna said about Cage in the 1950s and
> after? (Italian sources are fine). Madernas /Musica su due
> dimensioni /(1952) was one of the first works to draw upon the
> ideas of the aleatoric of Werner Meyer-Eppler set down in the
> range of lectures he gave between 1949 and 1953, which also of
> course inspired Meyer-Epplers student Stockhausen. I am
> interested to establish to what extent Maderna perceived a degree
> of commonality between this school of thought and that coming to
> Europe soon afterwards from Cage.
>
> 3. As William Brooks, Christopher von Blumröder, Heinz-Klaus Metzger
> and others have shown, the term experimental music or
> near-equivalents have been around since the early
> twentieth-century at least. However, it was given a more focused
> meaning in Cages 1955 essay Experimental Music: Doctrine more
> specific than when he used it in the 1930s, reflecting his
> increasing estrangement from what he portrayed as European
> avant-garde traditions. This concept was clarified in
> Experimental Music (1957), then History of Experimental Music
> in the United States (first published in German, 1959). Also in
> 1955, in the first edition of his /America's Music: From the
> Pilgrims to the Present/ (New York: McGraw Hill, 1955), Gilbert
> Chase has a chapter on The Experimentalists, pp. 571-96, ranging
> from Cowell, Ornstein, Antheil (both of these two dismissed rather
> quickly on the grounds that their later music became more
> conventional), Ruggles, John J. Becker, Charles Seeger, Ruth
> Crawford Seeger, the Canadians Colin McPhee, Gerald Strang and
> Henry Brant, and then the French-born Carlos Salzedo, Dane Rudhyar
> and Varèse, also Lou Harrison and Partch, through to Cage and
> Feldman, noting the important precursor of Russolo and The Art of
> Noise. But, despite noting Partch, Cowell and Cages Californian
> origins, Chase makes less of the European/American divide than
> does Cage, and there is little reason why a good deal of other
> European composers with no strong American connection could not
> have fitted his category were this a history of art music in
> general rather than specifically American music. As such, his
> definition is mostly compatible with that current in the 1930s.
>
> Following Cages mid-late-1950s essays, something akin to the
> older definition, simply entailing experiments with new
> instruments, technology, sounds, notation, etc., as had been
> presented in Pierre Schaeffers Vers une musique experimentale
> (1953) , in /La revue musicale /236 (1957), pp. 18-23, was
> continued by Lejaren Hiller, then Abraham Antoine Moles, Fritz
> Winckel and others, and can be found loosely in a lot of European
> writings on new music through the 1960s and 1970s. But in terms of
> the Cageian definition, I have found very little between Peter
> Yatess The American Experimental Tradition (1960) (which as far
> as I can tell was not published until 1990, in /Soundings/ 16, pp.
> 135-43), which informs his /Twentieth-Century Music / (London:
> George Allen & Unwin, 1967), until the formation of the
> Experimental Music Catalogue in London around 1970, and then the
> growth of this sub-culture leading to the publication of Michael
> Nymans /Experimental Music: Cage and Beyond /(London: Studio
> Vista, 1974), one in a whole series of books on experimental
> varieties of painting, theatre, cinema, architecture and dance
> from the same publisher. Leonard B. Meyers The Arguments for
> Experimental Music, in /Music, the Arts and Ideas /(Chicago and
> London: University of Chicago Press, 1967), pp. 245-65 is really
> closer to the Schaeffer/Hiller/Moles definition. Various histories
> of American music published in the 1960s, such as those of Wilfred
> Mellers and H. Wiley Hitchcock, argue for a major difference
> between European and American developments in general, as
> presented by Cage, and anticipated in Henry Cowells 1933 essay
> Trends in American Music, which when printed in /American
> Composers on American Music: A Symposium/, second edition (New
> York: Frederick Ungar, 1962) included the term experimental music.
>
> I am just curious to know if anyone knows of any more obscure or
> other writings from the 1960s which pick up upon and/or expand,
> develop or theorise Cages definitions further? By around 1960,
> the divide between Boulez, Stockhausen, Nono, Pousseur and others
> (though perhaps not necessarily Maderna) on one hand, and Cage,
> Feldman and Wolff (though not necessarily Brown) on the other was
> established, and events such as the Contre-Fest in Cologne in
> 1960, or Josef Anton Riedls /Neue Musik München/ the same year
> consolidated a divide between what might crudely be called a
> modernist mainstream and a series of more iconoclastic European
> figures with links to Cage and Fluxus (with Stockhausen
> characteristically trying to keep a foot in both camps, involved
> with both the ISCM and the Contre-Fest in Cologne, 1960). These
> battles did not disappear in that decade, and were carried on in
> polemics by Metzger and others, while Amy Beal (in /New Music, New
> Allies: American Experimental Music in West Germany from the Zero
> Hour to Reunification/ (Berkeley, Los Angeles and London:
> University of California Press, 2006))//has traced in great detail
> the work of Helms, Hans Otte, Ernstalbrecht Stiebler, Reinhard
> Oehlschlägel and others in promoting the music of Cage and others
> in Germany, while she and Martin Iddon (in Trying to Speak:
> Between Politics and Aesthetics, Darmstadt 197-1972,
> /twentieth-century music/ 3/2 (2007), pp. 255-75) have also
> examined the tensions between the aesthetic agendas of these types
> of figures and that pursued by Ernst Thomas when running the
> courses at Darmstadt. But as far as I can tell, these debates
> were, during this decade, rarely centred specifically around the
> concept of experimental music. But I am very interested in any
> literature which might suggest otherwise.
>
> Best,
>
> Ian
>
> Dr Ian Pace
>
> Senior Lecturer, Head of Performance
>
> Department of Music
>
> City University London
>
> Northampton Square
>
> London EC1V 0HB
>
> UK
>
> Tel +44 (0)20 7040 8016
>
> what distinguishes an educated person is not an elevated sense of
> ones knowledge and intelligence. It is, instead, humility arising
> from an ever better comprehension of what we dont know. And that can
> only be instilled by being confronted at university with genuine
> intellectual challenge and learning to rise to it.
>
> Raj Persaud and Adrian Furnham
>
--
Stefano
"Like a pizza in the rain, no one wants to take you home, but I love you just the same."
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Hi Ian,<br>
I cannot give you exact clues for the information you are asking,
but I take your email to spread the news about a beautiful
production by Italian label Die Schachtel about the work of Marino
Zuccheri in the Studio di Fonologia in Milan.<br>
Bruno Maderna and Luigi Nono, are the most frequently cited
composers in the publication, along with Luciano Berio of course
and other more or less famous ones. Among the first ones, I would
at least mention Cage and Stockhausen.<br>
<br>
For all Cage fans, there is a nice testimony of Zuccheri about the
creation of Fontana Mix and how he helped Cage with the tape
assemblage. The Cage-Zuccheri section features a short letter of
John to Marino, together with 2 hand-drawn schemes by Cage himself
of the equipment of the Studio di Fonologia.<br>
Other technical diagrams are featured in the section about Nono's
collaboration with Zuccheri and there is a section speaking of the
work that Zuccheri did with Stockhausen.<br>
<br>
The publication comes in 2 editions, both in English<br>
<br>
1. a smaller book + cd:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.soundohm.com/product/milan-rai-studio-di-fonologia-musicale-1955-83-book-cd/pid/31950/">https://www.soundohm.com/product/milan-rai-studio-di-fonologia-musicale-1955-83-book-cd/pid/31950/</a><br>
2. a lavish, bigger book + vinyl + cd:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.soundohm.com/product/milan-rai-studio-di-fonologia-musicale-1955-83-art-edition/pid/31934/">https://www.soundohm.com/product/milan-rai-studio-di-fonologia-musicale-1955-83-art-edition/pid/31934/</a><br>
<br>
Both editions contain a rich bibliographical index to essays and
books (mostly in Italian though), part of which probably are of
your current interest.<br>
As a side note, the book revealed a recently opened section of
Teche Rai (the archives of Rai, the National Italian tv-radio)
which contains interesting archival material about the Orchestra
Sinfonica of Rai<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.osn.teche.rai.it/Default.aspx">http://www.osn.teche.rai.it/Default.aspx</a><br>
<br>
including <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.osn.teche.rai.it/Download.aspx?data=k3AiMZPV3bmhFlsIyM08fUQ0II0ej68PQbbUrf8WruM/Nv3xoR2zpfgUmR/0sx6m">the
scan of a letter of Bach</a>, for instance :)<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
Stefano<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 29.07.2018 15:03, Pace, Ian wrote:<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dear All,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have a few distinct questions about which
I wondered if subscribers to this list might have some
answers.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoListParagraph"
style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">The 1972
four-LP set <i>Music Before Revolution</i> (available at
Ubuweb - <a
href="http://ubu.com/sound/music-before-revolution.html"
moz-do-not-send="true">
http://ubu.com/sound/music-before-revolution.html</a> )
(Odeon 1C 165-28954/7 - <a
href="https://www.discogs.com/Ensemble-Musica-Negativa-Music-Before-Revolution/release/872739"
moz-do-not-send="true">
https://www.discogs.com/Ensemble-Musica-Negativa-Music-Before-Revolution/release/872739</a>
) features works of Cage, Feldman, Brown, Wolff and
Ichiyanagi, and conversations with these, and Hans G Helms
and Heinz-Klaus Metzger. According to Alex J. Lubet,
Indeterminate Origins: A Cultural Theory of American
Experimental Music, in James R. Heintze. (ed.), <i>Perspectives
on American Music since 1950</i> (New York and London:
Garland Publishing, 1999), p. 99, this album was a tribute
to Maos Cultural Revolution. What is known of the extent
to which the composers involved were aware of or sympathetic
to the motivations behind such a project? Wolffs Maoist
sympathies for a period are well-known, as are Cages over a
shorter time from the early 1970s; but I have not
encountered anything from Feldman or Brown on this subject,
and am unsure of the extent to which Ichiyanagi shared
sympathies with other Japanese composers of his generation
who gravitated towards Maoist ideas.<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></li>
<li class="MsoListParagraph"
style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">Both Antonio
Trudu (in <i>La Scuola di Darmstadt: I Ferienkurse dal
1946 a oggi </i>(Milan: Ricordi, 1992), p. 125 n. 6) and<i>
</i>Christopher Shultis (in Cage and Europe, in David
Nicholls (ed.) <i>The Cambridge Companion to John Cage</i>
(Cambridge and New York: Cambridge University Press, 2002),
p. 33) argue that Bruno Maderna was apparently responsible
for suggesting that Wolfgang Steinecke invite Cage to
Darmstadt in 1958 in place of Boulez, though these claims
(which apparently come from former IMD archivist Wilhelm
Schlüter) have been contested by Martin Iddon (in <i>New
Music at Darmstadt: Nono, Stockhausen, Cage, and Boulez </i>(Cambridge
and New York: Cambridge University Press, 2013), pp.
198-200) on the basis of examination of the published
Maderna-Steinecke correspondence. What I have not yet found,
after consulting various sources on both Cage and Maderna,
is much about the relationship between the two, and
Madernas thoughts on Cages music and aesthetic. One of the
areas I am considering at the moment is the aleatoric work
of Boulez, Stockhausen, Maderna and others and its
provenance. Much historical writing and that on new music in
French treats this body of work as a separate category from
Cageian indeterminacy, while Cage and (especially) Feldman,
and many others after them, portrayed the former as
essentially a second-hand rendition of what members of the
New York School were doing earlier. So does anyone know of
any sources on Maderna and Cage, including anything Maderna
said about Cage in the 1950s and after? (Italian sources are
fine). Madernas <i>Musica su due dimensioni </i>(1952)
was one of the first works to draw upon the ideas of the
aleatoric of Werner Meyer-Eppler set down in the range of
lectures he gave between 1949 and 1953, which also of course
inspired Meyer-Epplers student Stockhausen. I am interested
to establish to what extent Maderna perceived a degree of
commonality between this school of thought and that coming
to Europe soon afterwards from Cage.<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></li>
<li class="MsoListParagraph"
style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1">As William
Brooks, Christopher von Blumröder, Heinz-Klaus Metzger and
others have shown, the term experimental music or
near-equivalents have been around since the early
twentieth-century at least. However, it was given a more
focused meaning in Cages 1955 essay Experimental Music:
Doctrine more specific than when he used it in the 1930s,
reflecting his increasing estrangement from what he
portrayed as European avant-garde traditions. This concept
was clarified in Experimental Music (1957), then History
of Experimental Music in the United States (first published
in German, 1959). Also in 1955, in the first edition of his
<i>America's Music: From the Pilgrims to the Present</i>
(New York: McGraw Hill, 1955), Gilbert Chase has a chapter
on The Experimentalists, pp. 571-96, ranging from Cowell,
Ornstein, Antheil (both of these two dismissed rather
quickly on the grounds that their later music became more
conventional), Ruggles, John J. Becker, Charles Seeger, Ruth
Crawford Seeger, the Canadians Colin McPhee, Gerald Strang
and Henry Brant, and then the French-born Carlos Salzedo,
Dane Rudhyar and Varèse, also Lou Harrison and Partch,
through to Cage and Feldman, noting the important precursor
of Russolo and The Art of Noise. But, despite noting
Partch, Cowell and Cages Californian origins, Chase makes
less of the European/American divide than does Cage, and
there is little reason why a good deal of other European
composers with no strong American connection could not have
fitted his category were this a history of art music in
general rather than specifically American music. As such,
his definition is mostly compatible with that current in the
1930s.<br>
<br>
Following Cages mid-late-1950s essays, something akin to
the older definition, simply entailing experiments with new
instruments, technology, sounds, notation, etc., as had been
presented in Pierre Schaeffers Vers une musique
experimentale (1953) , in <i>La revue musicale </i>236
(1957), pp. 18-23, was continued by Lejaren Hiller, then
Abraham Antoine Moles, Fritz Winckel and others, and can be
found loosely in a lot of European writings on new music
through the 1960s and 1970s. But in terms of the Cageian
definition, I have found very little between Peter Yatess
The American Experimental Tradition (1960) (which as far
as I can tell was not published until 1990, in <i>Soundings</i>
16, pp. 135-43), which informs his <i>Twentieth-Century
Music </i> (London: George Allen & Unwin, 1967),
until the formation of the Experimental Music Catalogue in
London around 1970, and then the growth of this sub-culture
leading to the publication of Michael Nymans <i>Experimental
Music: Cage and Beyond </i>(London: Studio Vista, 1974),
one in a whole series of books on experimental varieties
of painting, theatre, cinema, architecture and dance from
the same publisher. Leonard B. Meyers The Arguments for
Experimental Music, in <i>Music, the Arts and Ideas </i>(Chicago
and London: University of Chicago Press, 1967), pp. 245-65
is really closer to the Schaeffer/Hiller/Moles definition.
Various histories of American music published in the 1960s,
such as those of Wilfred Mellers and H. Wiley Hitchcock,
argue for a major difference between European and American
developments in general, as presented by Cage, and
anticipated in Henry Cowells 1933 essay Trends in American
Music, which when printed in <i>American Composers on
American Music: A Symposium</i>, second edition (New York:
Frederick Ungar, 1962) included the term experimental
music. <br>
<br>
I am just curious to know if anyone knows of any more
obscure or other writings from the 1960s which pick up upon
and/or expand, develop or theorise Cages definitions
further? By around 1960, the divide between Boulez,
Stockhausen, Nono, Pousseur and others (though perhaps not
necessarily Maderna) on one hand, and Cage, Feldman and
Wolff (though not necessarily Brown) on the other was
established, and events such as the Contre-Fest in Cologne
in 1960, or Josef Anton Riedls <i>Neue Musik München</i>
the same year consolidated a divide between what might
crudely be called a modernist mainstream and a series of
more iconoclastic European figures with links to Cage and
Fluxus (with Stockhausen characteristically trying to keep a
foot in both camps, involved with both the ISCM and the
Contre-Fest in Cologne, 1960). These battles did not
disappear in that decade, and were carried on in polemics by
Metzger and others, while Amy Beal (in <i>New Music, New
Allies: American Experimental Music in West Germany from
the Zero Hour to Reunification</i> (Berkeley, Los Angeles
and London: University of California Press, 2006))<i> </i>has
traced in great detail the work of Helms, Hans Otte,
Ernstalbrecht Stiebler, Reinhard Oehlschlägel and others in
promoting the music of Cage and others in Germany, while she
and Martin Iddon (in Trying to Speak: Between Politics and
Aesthetics, Darmstadt 197-1972, <i>twentieth-century music</i>
3/2 (2007), pp. 255-75) have also examined the tensions
between the aesthetic agendas of these types of figures and
that pursued by Ernst Thomas when running the courses at
Darmstadt. But as far as I can tell, these debates were,
during this decade, rarely centred specifically around the
concept of experimental music. But I am very interested in
any literature which might suggest otherwise.<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></li>
</ol>
<p class="MsoNormal">Best,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Ian<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Dr
Ian Pace<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Senior
Lecturer, Head of Performance<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Department
of Music</span><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New
Roman",serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">City
University London<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Northampton
Square<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">London
EC1V 0HB<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">UK<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Tel
+44 (0)20 7040 8016</span><span
style="mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"><span
style="color:#494343;background:white">what distinguishes
an educated person is not an elevated sense of ones
knowledge and intelligence. It is, instead, humility
arising from an ever better comprehension of what we dont
know. And that can only be instilled by being confronted
at university with genuine intellectual challenge and
learning to rise to it.</span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Raj
Persaud and Adrian Furnham<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Stefano
"Like a pizza in the rain, no one wants to take you home, but I love you just the same."</pre>
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