Re: IPv8 / BGP8 / CF - just build it

Hey everyone,

I think we can all agree that the IPv8 threads have run its course, and Jamie has received plenty of feedback regarding this proposal via the mailing list community. If anyone wishes to continue the conversation, I recommend reaching out to Jamie off list.

Kind regards,

Ryan Hamel

Co-Chair of the Moderation Committee
________________________________
From: Jamie Thain via NANOG <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, May 4, 2026 4:06 PM
To: Shrihari Pandit <[email protected]>
Cc: North American Network Operators Group <[email protected]>; Jamie Thain <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: IPv8 / BGP8 / CF - just build it

Caution: This is an external email and may be malicious. Please take care when clicking links or opening attachments.


Shrihari,

So the real system is IPv8 to mapping to IPv4 to forwarding.

ABSOLUTELY!!!

IPV8 is an are protocol

Imagine a long time ago in a galaxy far far away, how area codes came to
be.

Each area was a core exchange. 416, Toronto, 212 New York. Once you got to
the major exchange you don't need that number.

In the exchange there's two type of numbers, 0 and the ASN.

You have 0 the old numbers and ASN the new. On every router in the world
there is a way to separate numbering systems called VRFs and l2.5 tags.

Heres the complexity.

ip vrf Ipv8-asn-1234
     rd 1234:65535   // l2.5 label

ip vrf ipv4-asn-0
      rd 0:65535        // l2.5 label

ipip in ip is a silicon and labels put up tunnels all the time.

All silicon is optimized for this. Only pe routers will make a decision.
The overhead will be measured in hundreds of lines of code and then it will
be in LFIB.

One level of label when modern systems are capable of 10+ levels.

It's the exact same process as an mpls tags.

So the complexity is equal to 2 MPLS l3vpns.

Hopefully no one on your team thought that that would be very burdensome on
a new router.



Jamie




On Mon., May 4, 2026, 9:15 a.m. Shrihari Pandit, <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Jamie,
>
> "No new silicon required”, that’s only true because IPv8 is not being
> forwarded natively. Your actual process is:
> 1. Packets are encapsulated into IPv4
> 2. Lookup happens on IPv4
> 3. IPv8 is resolved via control-plane indirection
> 4. So the real system is IPv8 to mapping to IPv4 to forwarding.
>
> Which means:
>
>    - extra lookup (mapping)
>    - extra state (VRFs / LFIBs)
>    - extra encapsulation
>    - extra operational complexity
>
> IPv8 shifted into the control plane. It reminds me of the original ARPANET
> days, CPU based routing. If we go down this path, the control planes might
> all require something like AMD EPYC 9965 (192 cores fyi.) due to PPS rate.
>
> In reference to "loaded into 2 different LFIBs in the silicon". If I
> understand what you saying:
> A. Each “IPv8 area/ASN construct” = VRF
> B. Each mapping = BGP state
> C. Each path = label / adjacency
>
> These issues still exist, because IPv8 indirectly consumes it:
>
>    - TCAM is still consumed (VRF separation not free)
>    - LFIB size grows
>    - BGP table complexity increases
>    - convergence becomes harder
>
> Further, your statement of "if it's passing thru no v8 silicon...."
> implies that every transit node must do: [perform classification, apply
> mapping logic, encapsulate]. That's additional pipeline work.
>
> Shrihari Pandit
> Stealth Communications
> +1-212-232-2025
>
> On Mon, May 4, 2026 at 1:04 AM Jamie Thain <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Shrihari,
>>
>> See every 10 or 11 emails you get one that is at least an argument.
>>
>> Ipv8 is an area code based system, and the area codes.
>>
>> When an ipv8 packet arrives at your edge there are only 2 conditions.
>>
>> The route is destined for you or it's passing thru, and then there are
>> only 2 cases you have ipv8 silicon or you don't.
>>
>>  Ok if it's passing thru no v8 silicon
>>     xlate8 looks up it's asnV4 encapsulates it and sends via v4 to that
>> destination.
>>
>> Ok if it's not passing thru and this is the destination then you have two
>> route tables to be concerned with. Asn 0 and asn my asn say 1234
>>
>> There are 2 vrfs created on ipv8 configs
>>
>> ip vrf ipv8-asn-1234
>>    rd 1234:65535
>>
>> ip vrf ipv4-asn-0
>>     rd 0:65535
>>
>> So as routes the ipv8 is loaded into 2 different lfibs in the silicon and
>> managed by the ipv4 silicon.
>>
>> You create the ipv8 overlay by putting it in a vrf until ipv8 silicon is
>> naturally updated.
>>
>> Then for the main show ipv8 route it looks in bgp statement
>>
>>       include ip vrf ipv8-asn-1234 as asn 1234
>>       Include ip vrf ipv4-asn-0 as ipv4
>>
>> And shows these routes
>>
>> There is no new silicon required. From a silicon level "IPv8 is an L3VPN
>> with a globally reserved RD. If your router does L3VPN today — and every SP
>> router does — your router does IPv8 today"
>>
>> HTH
>>
>> Jamie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun., May 3, 2026, 10:56 a.m. Shrihari Pandit, <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Jamine,
>>>
>>> We had internal discussions with our team and are ones that are
>>> experienced in economics (wide range of fields, and engineering including
>>> CMOS, FPGA, ACIS.)
>>>
>>> 1. This is what I was told. IPv8 requires two additional lookups. It
>>> results in:
>>>
>>>    - wider parser support
>>>    - new match/action pipeline design
>>>    - more TCAM/SRAM slices
>>>    - larger die area
>>>    - higher power draw
>>>    - lower port density
>>>    - new board designs
>>>    - new optics/thermal validation
>>>    - new NOS/SDK support
>>>    - more heat as result of higher power draw
>>>
>>> 2. Cost areas:
>>>
>>>    - New ASIC / merchant silicon design
>>>    - Router/switch platform redesign
>>>    - Carrier backbone + edge replacement
>>>    - Hyperscaler/data-center network
>>>    - Enterprise/CPE/firewall/load-balancer "refresh"
>>>    - Software, OSS/BSS, routing stacks, monitoring systems
>>>    - Testing, certification, migration labour
>>>    - Operational risk, outages, dual-stack complexity
>>>
>>> The approximate numbers to implement are between $500B up to $2T (more
>>> realistic number @ $740B)
>>>
>>> Cisco describes routing silicon release cycles in the 18–36 month range,
>>> which means this is not software patches:
>>> src:
>>> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cisco.com%2Fc%2Fdam%2Fm%2Fdigital%2Felq-cmcglobal%2Fwitb%2FCKN%2F0721_CROSS.pdf&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511032095%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=JNUfJF1zx1JkPyVyNPWp43sZwvas4CpoC8NeHTFSbww%3D&reserved=0<https://www.cisco.com/c/dam/m/digital/elq-cmcglobal/witb/CKN/0721_CROSS.pdf>
>>>
>>> So IPv8 is control-plane cheap and data-plane expensive. The draft needs
>>> to account for that. Maybe Trump can allocate $2T to create more jobs, more
>>> work. You will need to likely reach out to the NSC. It will take 30 years.
>>> If there is forcing event, maybe 10-15 years and that would require the gov
>>> to pay all carriers and end-users.
>>>
>>> We should stop the discussion here; You should contact the merchant
>>> silicon companies to find out the costs and whether two additional lookups
>>> are required and are at what costs (actual costs, power draw, heat, etc.)
>>>
>>> --- Shrihari 212-232-2025
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, May 2, 2026 at 7:23 PM Jamie Thain via NANOG <
>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Kevin
>>>>
>>>> Code is expensive. I want a sense of anything is wrong first.
>>>>
>>>> Dns server needs 10 lines of code. Dhcp server 0, ntp server 100, netlog
>>>> 1000,
>>>>
>>>> So far mostly people have told me to go F myself.
>>>>
>>>> But it's the economics will win.
>>>>
>>>> Tco = 0
>>>>
>>>> If ipv is compatible
>>>>      If protocol = ipv8
>>>>           Tco = education + dev time of tools once on all 4 varaint
>>>> os's +
>>>> any premiium - (integration savings)
>>>>       - 100,000s per mid size enterprise per year.
>>>>
>>>>         Think -100 000 per 1000 employees or so
>>>>
>>>>      If protocol = ipv6
>>>>            Tco = interoperability testing + education + i get my ass
>>>> fired
>>>> for using it.
>>>>
>>>> Tco for ipv8 - billions
>>>>
>>>> Tco for ipv6 + billions
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat., May 2, 2026, 5:56 p.m. Kevin Tillery via NANOG, <
>>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Code is extremely malleable. You are not building a lunar lander. It
>>>> will
>>>> > not explode, kill three people and humiliate a nation if you get it
>>>> wrong.
>>>> > You will just observe that it is wrong and change it until it is
>>>> right.
>>>> >
>>>> > This gives you plentiful opportunities to discover things for yourself
>>>> > instead of spamming this mailing list with stupid arguments.
>>>> >
>>>> > For example, if you actually write an IPv8 implementation, you can try
>>>> > connecting it to an IPv4 implementation. You will discover whether it
>>>> > actually works or not. This is infinitely more valuable than an
>>>> argument.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On 2 May 2026 20:05:47 CEST, Jamie Thain via NANOG <
>>>> [email protected]>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> > >Justin,
>>>> > >
>>>> > >Because before you write a line of code you have to get it right, or
>>>> near
>>>> > >right.
>>>> > >
>>>> > >If you want to see good engineering watch from the "Earth to the
>>>> Moon"
>>>> > Spider,
>>>> > >how they built the lunar lander.
>>>> > >
>>>> > >So far I've had like 3 serious conversations about "this won't work"
>>>> and
>>>> > each
>>>> > >one has had me improve it. But "go make code" before we discuss what
>>>> and
>>>> > how it
>>>> > >should be, a DRAFT is actually when you want comments about the
>>>> operation
>>>> > of it
>>>> > >all.
>>>> > >
>>>> > >I'm not going to wait until I written 1m worth of code to figure
>>>> > something is
>>>> > >wrong.
>>>> > >
>>>> > >IETF folks suggested to me, that I join Nanog to see how they might
>>>> use
>>>> > it. IPv8
>>>> > >is not about address space.
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >Jamie
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >On Sat, May 2, 2026 at 11:12 AM Justin Streiner via NANOG
>>>> > ><[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >> I know of enterprises who are deploying v6.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Until you can show the world a working IPv8 implementation on a
>>>> large
>>>> > using
>>>> > >> off-the-shelf components where people can run through failure
>>>> scenarios
>>>> > and
>>>> > >> really beat it up, not many people are going to take it seriously.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Lower layers of the network relying on the functionality of higher
>>>> > layers
>>>> > >> is a really, really, really bad idea.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> While it's always important to think about how to so something
>>>> better,
>>>> > v8
>>>> > >> seems to create a whole bunch of new problems while not solving
>>>> many
>>>> > that
>>>> > >> have already been addressed in v6 and other protocols.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Thank you
>>>> > >> jms
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> On Fri, May 1, 2026, 23:22 Jamie Thain via NANOG <
>>>> [email protected]
>>>> > >> [[email protected]]>
>>>> > >> wrote:
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> > Andrew,
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > Cell phones. And Cloud. Not Corps. I started some of this, I
>>>> > mentioned IPv6
>>>> > >> > in a meeting and two corp engineers laughed.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > You can google it yourself.
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > Jamie
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > On Sat, May 2, 2026 at 12:19 AM Andrew Kirch via NANOG <
>>>> > >> > [email protected] [[email protected]]> wrote:
>>>> > >> >
>>>> > >> > > If no corporation is migrating then why is IPv6 traffic
>>>> continuing
>>>> > to
>>>> > >> > > increase?
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > > As I pointed out, IPv6 traffic increased 5% last year.  At that
>>>> > >> > admittedly
>>>> > >> > > slow rate, the entire internet will be IPv6 in 10 years.
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > > Further your assertion that business is the prime mover is
>>>> > incorrect.
>>>> > >> > > Business will move when they have to.  That time is coming.
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > > When businesses can’t get IPv4 from their providers or
>>>> superscaler,
>>>> > or a
>>>> > >> > > vendor or client can’t reach them, they will move.
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > > Andrew
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > > On Fri, May 1, 2026 at 11:14 PM Jamie Thain via NANOG <
>>>> > >> > > [email protected] [[email protected]]>
>>>> > >> > > wrote:
>>>> > >> > >
>>>> > >> > > > Andrew,
>>>> > >> > > >
>>>> > >> > > > The issue is for corporate and the cloud, IPv6 is just as
>>>> broken
>>>> > as
>>>> > >> > IPv4.
>>>> > >> > > >
>>>> > >> > > > And no corporate is migrating go look.  Its been the next big
>>>> > thing in
>>>> > >> > > > Corporate networks for 20 years.
>>>> > >> > > >
>>>> > >> > > > Jamie
>>>> > >> > > >
>>>> > >> > > > On Thu, Apr 30, 2026 at 5:26 PM Andrew Kirch via NANOG <
>>>> > >> > > > [email protected] [[email protected]]> wrote:
>>>> > >> > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > I oppose this.  With IPv6 traffic now representing around
>>>> half
>>>> > of
>>>> > >> > > > internet
>>>> > >> > > > > traffic, the time to rethink has long passed.
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > If IPv8 was going to be a solution, it should have been a
>>>> > solution 10
>>>> > >> > > > years
>>>> > >> > > > > ago.
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > In the last 12 months, ~5% of traffic migrated to IPv6.
>>>> At that
>>>> > >> > rate,
>>>> > >> > > > IPv6
>>>> > >> > > > > will be fully implemented by 2035.  I'm not seeing a
>>>> problem
>>>> > that
>>>> > >> > needs
>>>> > >> > > > to
>>>> > >> > > > > be solved, or a credible solution.
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > Andrew
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > On Wed, Apr 29, 2026 at 3:23 PM Jamie Thain via NANOG <
>>>> > >> > > > > [email protected] [[email protected]]>
>>>> > >> > > > > wrote:
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > Hi All,
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > My name is Jamie Thain I'm the creator of IPv8. It's not
>>>> a
>>>> > hoax.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > I joined this list because, as part of IPv8, I am
>>>> creating a
>>>> > BGPv8.
>>>> > >> > > > > Inside
>>>> > >> > > > > > BGPv8, two new protocols CF (Cost Factor), weigh cost
>>>> factors
>>>> > along
>>>> > >> > > the
>>>> > >> > > > > > routes to produce a better metric. It's a hybrid of EIRGP
>>>> > mixed
>>>> > >> > with
>>>> > >> > > > BGP
>>>> > >> > > > > to
>>>> > >> > > > > > create better engineering results.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > I also as part of CF created Sun Tzu which is the
>>>> protocol
>>>> > that
>>>> > >> > > watches
>>>> > >> > > > > CF
>>>> > >> > > > > > and gives you a CF score of reliability.  Do I trust my
>>>> > partnership
>>>> > >> > > > with
>>>> > >> > > > > > you?
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > Now, beyond an on-slaught of IPv8 is stupid, IPv6 solves
>>>> every
>>>> > >> > > problem,
>>>> > >> > > > > > etc, etc. That's not my discussion point. My point isn't
>>>> > "should I
>>>> > >> > > even
>>>> > >> > > > > > propose IPv8" my point is what would be the best result
>>>> for
>>>> > >> > > operators?
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > I believe that since IPv8 solves the duopoly problem, it
>>>> will
>>>> > >> > replace
>>>> > >> > > > > > IPv4.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > So the things to know, IPV8 is NOT a 64 bit addressing
>>>> system.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > It is a 32 bit routing system with a 32 bit addressing
>>>> system.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > A Routing Number = ASNs plus others.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > 8.8.8.8 would become 15169.8.8.8.8
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Farchive%2Fid%2Fdraft-thain-ipv8-02.html&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511069906%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=dqim6N5T5%2FZMzmsrNrmCxCnmR9QAYK2sKjAoWYY5MHQ%3D&reserved=0<https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-thain-ipv8-02.html>
>>>> > >> [https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Farchive%2Fid%2Fdraft-thain-ipv8-02.html&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511102558%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=iwxr3iZzSJ6SBEy06MKVVkHJ%2B%2BkZNi1xqJNAPkUREeI%3D&reserved=0<https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-thain-ipv8-02.html>]
>>>> > >> > > > > > <
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fl.shortlink.es%2Fl%2F3ae384c1b8e2eb92749595407c5cf9b87ea&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511132952%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=0jx%2F%2BF3NRCHIya7LYuuFjKPTxDLb7uTUCrcBug2Gru4%3D&reserved=0<https://l.shortlink.es/l/3ae384c1b8e2eb92749595407c5cf9b87ea>
>>>> > >> [https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fl.shortlink.es%2Fl%2F3ae384c1b8e2eb92749595407c5cf9b87ea&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511162686%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Cj4HsgIVD9Z5zlU2ej6xF5xqgvCUAf1TDMqUdlphh18%3D&reserved=0<https://l.shortlink.es/l/3ae384c1b8e2eb92749595407c5cf9b87ea>]
>>>> > >> > > > > 3372a?u=12457652
>>>> > >> > > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > So each ASN in the world will have 3 Billion available
>>>> > addresses.
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > There is a specially reserved group of internal ASN
>>>> 127.x.x.x
>>>> > so
>>>> > >> > each
>>>> > >> > > > > corp,
>>>> > >> > > > > > org, has 16 Million areas of 3 Billion addresses, to
>>>> replace
>>>> > >> > 10.x.x.x
>>>> > >> > > > and
>>>> > >> > > > > > 100.64.x.x.x
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > I'd appreciate your thoughts on it
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > > Jamie
>>>> > >> > > > > > _______________________________________________
>>>> > >> > > > > > NANOG mailing list
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.nanog.org%2Farchives%2Flist%2Fnanog%40lists.nanog.org%2F&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511194508%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=2FozmsvYsbsDGCJfE3LK%2B%2FAtDJU%2FAz%2Be%2BxLTB%2B%2BZESk%3D&reserved=0<https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/>
>>>> > >> [https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.nanog.org%2Farchives%2Flist%2Fnanog%40lists.nanog.org%2F&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511220674%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=o64vpopskjG3zRgI566tuG%2BQhsW6AtpvvvrTli1rpME%3D&reserved=0<https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/>]
>>>> > >> > > > > message/KPDE4FNBRLQYZOVF5FUAAGJCBSKNS42Q/
>>>> > >> > > > > >
>>>> > >> > > > > _______________________________________________
>>>> > >> > > > > NANOG mailing list
>>>> > >> > > > >
>>>> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.nanog.org%2Farchives%2Flist%2Fnanog%40lists.nanog.org%2F&data=05%7C02%7Cryan%40rkhtech.org%7C87477bf42fe2473d3d5908deaa31e78d%7C81c24bb4f9ec4739ba4d25c42594d996%7C0%7C0%7C639135328511249997%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=rSQwc%2FpPdpWnhEr51H0Y%2Fy65zCTVxU5KqNjfdb7DF2Y%3D&reserved=0<https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/[email protected]/>
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>>>> > >> [
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>>>> > ]
>>>> > >
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