Re: [SycamoreCanyon] My query on the national peace movement

"'[email protected]' [email protected] [marxist]" <[email protected]> Sun, 23 Nov 2014 17:03:35 -0500
Newsgroups gmane.politics.marxism.analysis
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 One minor point on this: The guy from UNAC was talking about a broad group=
 getting together to plan a demo in Spring.

I think that is inadequate in a lot of ways, but I would think that the gro=
up would be fairly broad at this point

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=20

-----Original Message-----
From: David McReynolds [email protected] [SycamoreCanyon] <Sycamor=
[email protected]>
To: SycamoreCanyon <[email protected]>
Cc: bearwithoutborders <[email protected]>; marxist <ma=
[email protected]>; newgreencanada <[email protected]>; re=
dbadbear <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Nov 23, 2014 4:55 pm
Subject: Re: [SycamoreCanyon] My query on the national peace movement


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I share the concern about a national peace movement. I don't think UNAC is =
it - meaning no disrespect, it does not involve the national peace groups (=
FOR, AFSC, WRL, WILPF, Peace Action). Some of those involved (and may still=
 be) in UFPJ (United for Peace and Justice) but that, also, is not what Hun=
ter is looking for (nor what I want to see).


One problem is that groups on the left, whether we mean the Communist Party=
, the Socialist Party, Democratic Socialists of America, Revolutionary Comm=
unist Party, Workers World Party, Party for Socialism and Liberation, or ot=
her left groups, cannot substitute for the peace movement.=20


No matter how good the intentions of these groups may be (and as important =
as they were in the mass Vietnam peace movement) they cannot substitute for=
 the peace groups.


I don't think it can be blamed on Obama. The first year or so, yes - I did =
not vote for Obama but I rejoiced in his election, as the first black Ameri=
can and as someone who had pledged to end the Iraq War and close Guantanamo=
.


But we need to remember that the massive Vietnam movement began under Jack =
Kennedy and reached its peak under LBJ. One of the primary forces was the d=
raft and when Nixon ended the draft it helped silence the movement.


Where I'd place the blame (not with any joy!) is on the peace movement itse=
lf. To take one example, the Fellowship of Reconciliation - one of the grou=
ps that is important in bringing in the religious community - has fallen in=
to the trap of the computer age, with its executive director working from C=
alifornia, when the national office is in Nyack, New York.


One of my problems is simply age - at 85, and retired, I don't even know wh=
o the key people are at AFSC, or the FOR or Peace Action. I'd fault the gro=
up I worked for, the War Resisters League, as failing to help bring togethe=
r any kind of informal coalition (which UFPJ was at one point). And that is=
n't because of Obama - it is because none of the groups seem to see the nee=
d for such informal consultative groups, which we had when I was on staff a=
t WRL.


So, Hunter, I don't have a good answer - but I don't think Obama is the rea=
son. I think the groups - the broad liberal community - that was willing to=
 give him a year, is now disillusioned and perhaps demoralized - as if, des=
pite all the promises he made, and the hopes we had, Obama himself seems as=
 trapped by the war machine as any of us.


We have to keep trying - but to focus on Obama delays focusing on the need =
for deeper and more radical change in the society.


David McReynolds



On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 8:40 AM, 'Hunter Gray' [email protected]=
 [SycamoreCanyon] <[email protected]> wrote:

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The other day, I asked about theexistence of a bona fide national peace mov=
ement.  That was a reasonable inquiry, given the factthat the country is no=
w well into a new and fast broadening Iraq War.  It=E2=80=99s  now even mor=
e timely, at this moment inhistory, as Obama abrogates his latest of severa=
l pledgse to end U.S. militarycombat involvement in Afghanistan.
Aside from two comments onRedbadbear, which were essentially localized in n=
ature, I received no responsesto my query.  This would seem to bear outmy f=
eeling that the national peace movement ended =E2=80=93 at least for the ti=
me =E2=80=93when Barack Obama took office. Certainly, there are valiant loc=
al efforts and a few genuinely leftgroups that haven=E2=80=99t been co-opte=
d by Obama and the Democratic Party.
The broad silence in this country onthe peace issue is both tragic and dang=
erous. Hopefully, that will change as matters abroad are seen as more dire,=
U.S. military involvement is recognized as increasingly futile =E2=80=93 an=
d the fiscalexpenditures for the Wars rival the heights of the Rockies.
A very personal observation:  I came of radical age in early 1955.  Even wi=
th Red Scare fear and hysteria ragingacross this country, there was more ge=
nuinely radical activism =E2=80=93 =E2=80=9Cto the roots=E2=80=9Dstuff =E2=
=80=93 than the oft empty verbal militancy of today and the even morepervas=
ive silence.
H.

HUNTER GRAY [HUNTER BEAR/JOHN R SALTER JR] Mi'kmaq / St. Francis Abenaki / =
St. Regis Mohawk=20
Protected by Na=C2=B4shdo=C2=B4i=C2=B4ba=C2=B4i=C2=B4=20
and Ohkwari' . Check out our massive social justice website:=20
www.hunterbear.org=20=20
Member, National Writers Union AFL-CIO=20

Core dimensions of my Community Organizing course:
http://www.labornet.org/news/0000/hbear.htm

My expanded/updated "Organizer's Book,"=20
JACKSON MISSISSIPPI -- with a new 10,000=20
word introduction by me. Covers much of my=20
confrontational social justice organizing life to=20
date. Contains much how-to grassroots organizing=20
methodology: http://hunterbear.org/jackson.htm

See this for mini-bio, efforts to prevent JM=E2=80=99s appearance in
Mississippi,  a wide range of its many reviews, and some
photos:   http://www.amazon.com/John-R.-Salter/e/B001KMEHWY/ref=3Dntt_dp_ep=
wbk_0

The Stormy Adoption of an Indian Child [My Father]:=20
http://hunterbear.org/James%20and%20Salter%20and%20Dad.htm
=20=20
(Photos)=20


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<font color=3D'black' size=3D'2' face=3D'arial'>

<div> <font size=3D"2">One minor point on this: The guy from UNAC was talki=
ng about a broad group getting together to plan a demo in Spring.<br>
<br>
I think that is inadequate in a lot of ways, but I would think that the gro=
up would be fairly broad at this point<br>
</font>
</div>



<div> <br>

</div>



<div> <br>

</div>



<div style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">-----=
Original Message-----<br>

From: David McReynolds [email protected] [SycamoreCanyon] &lt;Syca=
[email protected]&gt;<br>

To: SycamoreCanyon &lt;[email protected]&gt;<br>

Cc: bearwithoutborders &lt;[email protected]&gt;; marxi=
st &lt;[email protected]&gt;; newgreencanada &lt;newgreencanada@yahoo=
groups.com&gt;; redbadbear &lt;[email protected]&gt;<br>

Sent: Sun, Nov 23, 2014 4:55 pm<br>

Subject: Re: [SycamoreCanyon] My query on the national peace movement<br>

<br>






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<div>

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<div>

<div><font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,ser=
if">I share the concern about a national peace movement. I don't think UNAC=
 is it - meaning no disrespect, it does not involve the national peace grou=
ps (FOR, AFSC, WRL, WILPF, Peace Action). Some of those involved (and may s=
till be) in UFPJ (United for Peace and Justice) but that, also, is not what=
 Hunter is looking for (nor what I want to see).<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">O=
ne problem is that groups on the left, whether we mean the Communist Party,=
 the Socialist Party, Democratic Socialists of America, Revolutionary Commu=
nist Party, Workers World Party, Party for Socialism and Liberation, or oth=
er left groups, cannot substitute for the peace movement. <br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">N=
o matter how good the intentions of these groups may be (and as important a=
s they were in the mass Vietnam peace movement) they cannot substitute for =
the peace groups.<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">I=
 don't think it can be blamed on Obama. The first year or so, yes - I did n=
ot vote for Obama but I rejoiced in his election, as the first black Americ=
an and as someone who had pledged to end the Iraq War and close Guantanamo.=
<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">B=
ut we need to remember that the massive Vietnam movement began under Jack K=
ennedy and reached its peak under LBJ. One of the primary forces was the dr=
aft and when Nixon ended the draft it helped silence the movement.<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">W=
here I'd place the blame (not with any joy!) is on the peace movement itsel=
f. To take one example, the Fellowship of Reconciliation - one of the group=
s that is important in bringing in the religious community - has fallen int=
o the trap of the computer age, with its executive director working from Ca=
lifornia, when the national office is in Nyack, New York.<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">O=
ne of my problems is simply age - at 85, and retired, I don't even know who=
 the key people are at AFSC, or the FOR or Peace Action. I'd fault the grou=
p I worked for, the War Resisters League, as failing to help bring together=
 any kind of informal coalition (which UFPJ was at one point). And that isn=
't because of Obama - it is because none of the groups seem to see the need=
 for such informal consultative groups, which we had when I was on staff at=
 WRL.<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">S=
o, Hunter, I don't have a good answer - but I don't think Obama is the reas=
on. I think the groups - the broad liberal community - that was willing to =
give him a year, is now disillusioned and perhaps demoralized - as if, desp=
ite all the promises he made, and the hopes we had, Obama himself seems as =
trapped by the war machine as any of us.<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">W=
e have to keep trying - but to focus on Obama delays focusing on the need f=
or deeper and more radical change in the society.<br>

<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>

<font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">D=
avid McReynolds<br>

</font></font></b></font></div>



<div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br>



<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 8:40 AM, 'Hunter Gray' <=
a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]=
</a> [SycamoreCanyon] <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:SycamoreCanyo=
[email protected]">[email protected]</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left:1px #ccc solid;">


<u></u>









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<div><font face=3D"Verdana"></font></div>




<div><font face=3D"Verdana">&nbsp;<font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"=
>

</font>

<div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri">The other day, I asked about the
existence of a bona fide national peace movement.<span>&nbsp; </span>That w=
as a reasonable inquiry, given the fact
that the country is now well into a new and fast broadening Iraq War.<span>=
&nbsp; </span>It=E2=80=99s <span>&nbsp;</span>now even more timely, at this=
 moment in
history, as Obama abrogates his latest of several pledgse to end U.S. milit=
ary
combat involvement in Afghanistan.</font></span></b></div>

<font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3">

</font>

<div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri">Aside from two comments on
Redbadbear, which were essentially localized in nature, I received no respo=
nses
to my query.<span>&nbsp; </span>This would seem to bear out
my feeling that the national peace movement ended =E2=80=93 at least for th=
e time =E2=80=93
when Barack Obama took office.<span>&nbsp;
</span>Certainly, there are valiant local efforts and a few genuinely left
groups that haven=E2=80=99t been co-opted by Obama and the Democratic Party=
.</font></span></b></div>

<font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3">

</font>

<div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri">The broad silence in this country on
the peace issue is both tragic and dangerous.<span>&nbsp;
</span>Hopefully, that will change as matters abroad are seen as more dire,
U.S. military involvement is recognized as increasingly futile =E2=80=93 an=
d the fiscal
expenditures for the Wars rival the heights of the Rockies.</font></span></=
b></div>

<font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3">

</font>

<div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri">A very personal observation:<span>&nbsp; </span>I came of=
 radical age in early 1955.<span>&nbsp; </span>Even with Red Scare fear and=
 hysteria raging
across this country, there was more genuinely radical activism =E2=80=93 =
=E2=80=9Cto the roots=E2=80=9D
stuff =E2=80=93 than the oft empty verbal militancy of today and the even m=
ore
pervasive silence.</font></span></b></div>

<font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3">

</font>

<div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font=
 face=3D"Calibri">H.</font></span></b></div>

<font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3">

</font></font></div>



<div>
HUNTER GRAY [HUNTER BEAR/JOHN R SALTER JR] Mi'kmaq / St. Francis Abenaki / =
St. Regis Mohawk=20
<br>


Protected by Na=C2=B4shdo=C2=B4i=C2=B4ba=C2=B4i=C2=B4=20
<br>


and Ohkwari' . Check out our massive social justice website:=20
<br>


<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.hunterbear.org">www.hunterbear.org<=
/a>&nbsp;&nbsp;
<br>


Member, National Writers Union AFL-CIO=20
<br>



<br>


Core dimensions of my Community Organizing course:
<br>


<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.labornet.org/news/0000/hbear.htm">h=
ttp://www.labornet.org/news/0000/hbear.htm</a><br>


<br>


My expanded/updated "Organizer's Book,"=20
<br>


JACKSON MISSISSIPPI -- with a new 10,000=20
<br>


word introduction by me. Covers much of my=20
<br>


confrontational social justice organizing life to=20
<br>


date. Contains much how-to grassroots organizing=20
<br>


methodology: <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://hunterbear.org/jackson.htm=
">http://hunterbear.org/jackson.htm</a>
<br>



<br>


See this for mini-bio, efforts to prevent JM=E2=80=99s appearance in
<br>


Mississippi,  a wide range of its many reviews, and some
<br>


photos:   <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.amazon.com/John-R.-Salter=
/e/B001KMEHWY/ref=3Dntt_dp_epwbk_0">http://www.amazon.com/John-R.-Salter/e/=
B001KMEHWY/ref=3Dntt_dp_epwbk_0</a>
<br>



<br>


The Stormy Adoption of an Indian Child [My Father]:=20
<br>


<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://hunterbear.org/James%20and%20Salter%20a=
nd%20Dad.htm">http://hunterbear.org/James%20and%20Salter%20and%20Dad.htm</a=
></div>



<div>&nbsp;=20
<br>


(Photos)=20
<br>

</div>





<div></div>



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