Re: [SycamoreCanyon] My query on the national peace movement
"'[email protected]' [email protected] [marxist]" <[email protected]> Sun, 23 Nov 2014 17:03:35 -0500
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----------MB_8D1D5807677D95C_C94_12D841_webmail-va164.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" One minor point on this: The guy from UNAC was talking about a broad group= getting together to plan a demo in Spring. I think that is inadequate in a lot of ways, but I would think that the gro= up would be fairly broad at this point =20 =20 -----Original Message----- From: David McReynolds [email protected] [SycamoreCanyon] <Sycamor= [email protected]> To: SycamoreCanyon <[email protected]> Cc: bearwithoutborders <[email protected]>; marxist <ma= [email protected]>; newgreencanada <[email protected]>; re= dbadbear <[email protected]> Sent: Sun, Nov 23, 2014 4:55 pm Subject: Re: [SycamoreCanyon] My query on the national peace movement =20 =20=20 =20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 I share the concern about a national peace movement. I don't think UNAC is = it - meaning no disrespect, it does not involve the national peace groups (= FOR, AFSC, WRL, WILPF, Peace Action). Some of those involved (and may still= be) in UFPJ (United for Peace and Justice) but that, also, is not what Hun= ter is looking for (nor what I want to see). One problem is that groups on the left, whether we mean the Communist Party= , the Socialist Party, Democratic Socialists of America, Revolutionary Comm= unist Party, Workers World Party, Party for Socialism and Liberation, or ot= her left groups, cannot substitute for the peace movement.=20 No matter how good the intentions of these groups may be (and as important = as they were in the mass Vietnam peace movement) they cannot substitute for= the peace groups. I don't think it can be blamed on Obama. The first year or so, yes - I did = not vote for Obama but I rejoiced in his election, as the first black Ameri= can and as someone who had pledged to end the Iraq War and close Guantanamo= . But we need to remember that the massive Vietnam movement began under Jack = Kennedy and reached its peak under LBJ. One of the primary forces was the d= raft and when Nixon ended the draft it helped silence the movement. Where I'd place the blame (not with any joy!) is on the peace movement itse= lf. To take one example, the Fellowship of Reconciliation - one of the grou= ps that is important in bringing in the religious community - has fallen in= to the trap of the computer age, with its executive director working from C= alifornia, when the national office is in Nyack, New York. One of my problems is simply age - at 85, and retired, I don't even know wh= o the key people are at AFSC, or the FOR or Peace Action. I'd fault the gro= up I worked for, the War Resisters League, as failing to help bring togethe= r any kind of informal coalition (which UFPJ was at one point). And that is= n't because of Obama - it is because none of the groups seem to see the nee= d for such informal consultative groups, which we had when I was on staff a= t WRL. So, Hunter, I don't have a good answer - but I don't think Obama is the rea= son. I think the groups - the broad liberal community - that was willing to= give him a year, is now disillusioned and perhaps demoralized - as if, des= pite all the promises he made, and the hopes we had, Obama himself seems as= trapped by the war machine as any of us. We have to keep trying - but to focus on Obama delays focusing on the need = for deeper and more radical change in the society. David McReynolds On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 8:40 AM, 'Hunter Gray' [email protected]= [SycamoreCanyon] <[email protected]> wrote: =20 =20 =20=20 =20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =20 The other day, I asked about theexistence of a bona fide national peace mov= ement. That was a reasonable inquiry, given the factthat the country is no= w well into a new and fast broadening Iraq War. It=E2=80=99s now even mor= e timely, at this moment inhistory, as Obama abrogates his latest of severa= l pledgse to end U.S. militarycombat involvement in Afghanistan. Aside from two comments onRedbadbear, which were essentially localized in n= ature, I received no responsesto my query. This would seem to bear outmy f= eeling that the national peace movement ended =E2=80=93 at least for the ti= me =E2=80=93when Barack Obama took office. Certainly, there are valiant loc= al efforts and a few genuinely leftgroups that haven=E2=80=99t been co-opte= d by Obama and the Democratic Party. The broad silence in this country onthe peace issue is both tragic and dang= erous. Hopefully, that will change as matters abroad are seen as more dire,= U.S. military involvement is recognized as increasingly futile =E2=80=93 an= d the fiscalexpenditures for the Wars rival the heights of the Rockies. A very personal observation: I came of radical age in early 1955. Even wi= th Red Scare fear and hysteria ragingacross this country, there was more ge= nuinely radical activism =E2=80=93 =E2=80=9Cto the roots=E2=80=9Dstuff =E2= =80=93 than the oft empty verbal militancy of today and the even morepervas= ive silence. H. HUNTER GRAY [HUNTER BEAR/JOHN R SALTER JR] Mi'kmaq / St. Francis Abenaki / = St. Regis Mohawk=20 Protected by Na=C2=B4shdo=C2=B4i=C2=B4ba=C2=B4i=C2=B4=20 and Ohkwari' . Check out our massive social justice website:=20 www.hunterbear.org=20=20 Member, National Writers Union AFL-CIO=20 Core dimensions of my Community Organizing course: http://www.labornet.org/news/0000/hbear.htm My expanded/updated "Organizer's Book,"=20 JACKSON MISSISSIPPI -- with a new 10,000=20 word introduction by me. Covers much of my=20 confrontational social justice organizing life to=20 date. Contains much how-to grassroots organizing=20 methodology: http://hunterbear.org/jackson.htm See this for mini-bio, efforts to prevent JM=E2=80=99s appearance in Mississippi, a wide range of its many reviews, and some photos: http://www.amazon.com/John-R.-Salter/e/B001KMEHWY/ref=3Dntt_dp_ep= wbk_0 The Stormy Adoption of an Indian Child [My Father]:=20 http://hunterbear.org/James%20and%20Salter%20and%20Dad.htm =20=20 (Photos)=20 =20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20 ----------MB_8D1D5807677D95C_C94_12D841_webmail-va164.sysops.aol.com Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <head> <style type=3D"text/css"> <!-- /* start of attachment style */ .ygrp-photo-title{ clear: both; font-size: smaller; height: 15px; overflow: hidden; text-align: center; width: 75px; } div.ygrp-photo{ background-position: center; background-repeat: no-repeat; background-color: white; border: 1px solid black; height: 62px; width: 62px; } div.photo-title=20 a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div.photo-title a:visited { text-decoration: none;=20 } div.attach-table div.attach-row { clear: both; } div.attach-table div.attach-row div { float: left; /* margin: 2px;*/ } p { clear: both; padding: 15px 0 3px 0; overflow: hidden; } div.ygrp-file { width: 30px; valign: middle; } div.attach-table div.attach-row div div a { text-decoration: none; } div.attach-table div.attach-row div div span { font-weight: normal; } div.ygrp-file-title { font-weight: bold; } /* end of attachment style */ --> </style> </head> <html> <head> <style type=3D"text/css"> <!-- #ygrp-mkp { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; font-family: Arial; margin: 10px 0; padding: 0 10px; } #ygrp-mkp hr { border: 1px solid #d8d8d8; } #ygrp-mkp #hd { color: #628c2a; font-size: 85%; font-weight: 700; line-height: 122%; margin: 10px 0; } #ygrp-mkp #ads { margin-bottom: 10px; } #ygrp-mkp .ad { padding: 0 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad p { margin: 0; } #ygrp-mkp .ad a { color: #0000ff; text-decoration: none; } --> </style> </head> <body> <font color=3D'black' size=3D'2' face=3D'arial'> <div> <font size=3D"2">One minor point on this: The guy from UNAC was talki= ng about a broad group getting together to plan a demo in Spring.<br> <br> I think that is inadequate in a lot of ways, but I would think that the gro= up would be fairly broad at this point<br> </font> </div> <div> <br> </div> <div> <br> </div> <div style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">-----= Original Message-----<br> From: David McReynolds [email protected] [SycamoreCanyon] <Syca= [email protected]><br> To: SycamoreCanyon <[email protected]><br> Cc: bearwithoutborders <[email protected]>; marxi= st <[email protected]>; newgreencanada <newgreencanada@yahoo= groups.com>; redbadbear <[email protected]><br> Sent: Sun, Nov 23, 2014 4:55 pm<br> Subject: Re: [SycamoreCanyon] My query on the national peace movement<br> <br> <div id=3D"AOLMsgPart_1_7f15932f-07b8-41bb-a507-3ce4bd3f99de"> =20 <div class=3D"aolReplacedBody" style=3D"background-color: #fff;"> <span style=3D"display:none"> </span> <div id=3D"ygrp-mlmsg" style=3D"position:relative;"> =20=20 <div id=3D"ygrp-msg" style=3D"z-index: 1;"> =20=20=20=20 <div id=3D"ygrp-text"> =20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20 <div></div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div> <div><font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,ser= if">I share the concern about a national peace movement. I don't think UNAC= is it - meaning no disrespect, it does not involve the national peace grou= ps (FOR, AFSC, WRL, WILPF, Peace Action). Some of those involved (and may s= till be) in UFPJ (United for Peace and Justice) but that, also, is not what= Hunter is looking for (nor what I want to see).<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">O= ne problem is that groups on the left, whether we mean the Communist Party,= the Socialist Party, Democratic Socialists of America, Revolutionary Commu= nist Party, Workers World Party, Party for Socialism and Liberation, or oth= er left groups, cannot substitute for the peace movement. <br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">N= o matter how good the intentions of these groups may be (and as important a= s they were in the mass Vietnam peace movement) they cannot substitute for = the peace groups.<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">I= don't think it can be blamed on Obama. The first year or so, yes - I did n= ot vote for Obama but I rejoiced in his election, as the first black Americ= an and as someone who had pledged to end the Iraq War and close Guantanamo.= <br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">B= ut we need to remember that the massive Vietnam movement began under Jack K= ennedy and reached its peak under LBJ. One of the primary forces was the dr= aft and when Nixon ended the draft it helped silence the movement.<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">W= here I'd place the blame (not with any joy!) is on the peace movement itsel= f. To take one example, the Fellowship of Reconciliation - one of the group= s that is important in bringing in the religious community - has fallen int= o the trap of the computer age, with its executive director working from Ca= lifornia, when the national office is in Nyack, New York.<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">O= ne of my problems is simply age - at 85, and retired, I don't even know who= the key people are at AFSC, or the FOR or Peace Action. I'd fault the grou= p I worked for, the War Resisters League, as failing to help bring together= any kind of informal coalition (which UFPJ was at one point). And that isn= 't because of Obama - it is because none of the groups seem to see the need= for such informal consultative groups, which we had when I was on staff at= WRL.<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">S= o, Hunter, I don't have a good answer - but I don't think Obama is the reas= on. I think the groups - the broad liberal community - that was willing to = give him a year, is now disillusioned and perhaps demoralized - as if, desp= ite all the promises he made, and the hopes we had, Obama himself seems as = trapped by the war machine as any of us.<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">W= e have to keep trying - but to focus on Obama delays focusing on the need f= or deeper and more radical change in the society.<br> <br> </font></font></b></font></div> <font color=3D"#0000ff"><b><font size=3D"4"><font face=3D"garamond,serif">D= avid McReynolds<br> </font></font></b></font></div> <div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br> <div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Nov 23, 2014 at 8:40 AM, 'Hunter Gray' <= a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]= </a> [SycamoreCanyon] <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:SycamoreCanyo= [email protected]">[email protected]</a>></span> wrote:<br> <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left:1px #ccc solid;"> <u></u> =20 <div style=3D"background-color:#fff;"> <span> </span> <div> =20=20 <div> =20=20=20=20 <div> =20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20 <div></div> <div><font face=3D"Verdana"></font></div> <div><font face=3D"Verdana"> <font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"= > </font> <div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font= face=3D"Calibri">The other day, I asked about the existence of a bona fide national peace movement.<span> </span>That w= as a reasonable inquiry, given the fact that the country is now well into a new and fast broadening Iraq War.<span>= </span>It=E2=80=99s <span> </span>now even more timely, at this= moment in history, as Obama abrogates his latest of several pledgse to end U.S. milit= ary combat involvement in Afghanistan.</font></span></b></div> <font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"> </font> <div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font= face=3D"Calibri">Aside from two comments on Redbadbear, which were essentially localized in nature, I received no respo= nses to my query.<span> </span>This would seem to bear out my feeling that the national peace movement ended =E2=80=93 at least for th= e time =E2=80=93 when Barack Obama took office.<span> </span>Certainly, there are valiant local efforts and a few genuinely left groups that haven=E2=80=99t been co-opted by Obama and the Democratic Party= .</font></span></b></div> <font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"> </font> <div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font= face=3D"Calibri">The broad silence in this country on the peace issue is both tragic and dangerous.<span> </span>Hopefully, that will change as matters abroad are seen as more dire, U.S. military involvement is recognized as increasingly futile =E2=80=93 an= d the fiscal expenditures for the Wars rival the heights of the Rockies.</font></span></= b></div> <font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"> </font> <div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font= face=3D"Calibri">A very personal observation:<span> </span>I came of= radical age in early 1955.<span> </span>Even with Red Scare fear and= hysteria raging across this country, there was more genuinely radical activism =E2=80=93 = =E2=80=9Cto the roots=E2=80=9D stuff =E2=80=93 than the oft empty verbal militancy of today and the even m= ore pervasive silence.</font></span></b></div> <font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"> </font> <div style=3D"margin:0in 0in 8pt;"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;"><font= face=3D"Calibri">H.</font></span></b></div> <font face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D"3"> </font></font></div> <div> HUNTER GRAY [HUNTER BEAR/JOHN R SALTER JR] Mi'kmaq / St. Francis Abenaki / = St. Regis Mohawk=20 <br> Protected by Na=C2=B4shdo=C2=B4i=C2=B4ba=C2=B4i=C2=B4=20 <br> and Ohkwari' . Check out our massive social justice website:=20 <br> <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.hunterbear.org">www.hunterbear.org<= /a> <br> Member, National Writers Union AFL-CIO=20 <br> <br> Core dimensions of my Community Organizing course: <br> <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.labornet.org/news/0000/hbear.htm">h= ttp://www.labornet.org/news/0000/hbear.htm</a><br> <br> My expanded/updated "Organizer's Book,"=20 <br> JACKSON MISSISSIPPI -- with a new 10,000=20 <br> word introduction by me. Covers much of my=20 <br> confrontational social justice organizing life to=20 <br> date. Contains much how-to grassroots organizing=20 <br> methodology: <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://hunterbear.org/jackson.htm= ">http://hunterbear.org/jackson.htm</a> <br> <br> See this for mini-bio, efforts to prevent JM=E2=80=99s appearance in <br> Mississippi, a wide range of its many reviews, and some <br> photos: <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.amazon.com/John-R.-Salter= /e/B001KMEHWY/ref=3Dntt_dp_epwbk_0">http://www.amazon.com/John-R.-Salter/e/= B001KMEHWY/ref=3Dntt_dp_epwbk_0</a> <br> <br> The Stormy Adoption of an Indian Child [My Father]:=20 <br> <a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://hunterbear.org/James%20and%20Salter%20a= nd%20Dad.htm">http://hunterbear.org/James%20and%20Salter%20and%20Dad.htm</a= ></div> <div> =20 <br> (Photos)=20 <br> </div> <div></div> </div> =20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20 <div style=3D"color:#fff;min-height:0;"></div> </div> =20=20 </div> </div> </blockquote></div> <br> </div> <div></div> </div> =20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20 <div style=3D"color: #fff; height: 0;"></div> </div> =20=20 </div> </div> </font> <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> <br> <br> <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| --> <div width=3D"1" style=3D"color: white; clear: both;"/>__._,_.___</div> =20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20 =20=20=20=20 <div id=3D"fromDMARC" style=3D"clear:both; margin-top: 10px;"> <hr style=3D"height:2px ; border-width:0; color:#E3E3E3; backgroun= d-color:#E3E3E3;"> Posted by: "[email protected]" <[email protected]= > <hr style=3D"height:2px ; border-width:0; color:#E3E3E3; backg= round-color:#E3E3E3;"> </div> <!-- Start Recommendations --> <!-- End Recommendations --> <!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| --> <br><br> <tt> "[C]apital comes dripping from head to foot, from every pore, with blo= od and dirt."<BR> --Marx, Capital, Vol. 1, Chapter 31<BR> <BR> </body> </html> ----------MB_8D1D5807677D95C_C94_12D841_webmail-va164.sysops.aol.com--