Amnesia/ was ]Another Bush Crime against humanity and Gaia

Forest, you say most of us would not tolerate tribal male dominated
politics as usual today, but that's exactly what most people put up with in
our society - isn't it? We are too spoiled by individualism and freedom?
How much freedom do you think the individual has as a cog in the economic
machine today?  The mortgage, the school loan, the credit cards - all tie
people in perpetual servitude to their masters. You will die in debt. Its
easy to believe the myth of progress, to believe life in the past was
nasty, brutal, and short - that before our modern enlightenment tribes of
ignorant savages warred constantly the world over. Except it's just not
accurate history.  Yes, life was that bad in England when the Industrial
Revolution enclosed the commons and forced millions into diseased ghettoes
for the profit of the few. But not the world over throughout history.  The
textbook writers have a lot of vested interest in the myth of progress. And
we have a great collective amnesia, which serves our masters well.

>well, i think in this modern world now, it is not going to work to go back
>to the past....i think/feel it best to keep pushing the envelope for
>huWoMan
>rights and cooperation and imh-bs consensus and idealism are some of our
>important keys to that evolution....imh-bs we need to get spiritual fast
in
>order to deal with the dangers in the modern technological world now in
>control of male dominant businessmen and military industrial
>complex....

Not being able to go back to the past is a poor excuse for refusing to
learn from the past. As the historian said, those who will not learn from
the past are condemned to repeat it.  In our hubris we imagine that we have
to invent workable, sustainable social structures, when they've been around
for centuries in other places. We can push the envelope all we want but we
do not have the luxury of time to reinvent the wheel.  All that idealism
won't help your survival if you don't join those who are doing what has to
be done, right here, right now.  Spirituality is something you learn by
doing, not by talking.


paul [email protected]
http://largocreekfarms.com
http://medicinehill.net

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 1/29/2005 at 4:47 AM forest wrote:

>on 1/28/05 5:15 PM, Globalcircle at [email protected] wrote:
>
>> 
>> I agree and promote " the paradigm shift to small decentralized
>bioregional
>> consensus group land based actions...." but without the consensus group
>> part.  Historically, stable societies in general have been composed of
>> small, close-knit communities made up primarily of extended families.
>
>imh-bs without consensus it is mostly male dominant hierarchical politics
>as
>usual, even in small tribes there were alpha male and/or female bullies
who
>forced the group by some hierarchical methods....most of us today would
>not/
>could not tolerate such systems....imh-bs we are too spoiled by
>individualism and freedom....with the world populations so large, there
>just
>ain't enough space to play those old hierarchical games anymore imh-bs,
>plus
>they did not really promote an evolution of human rights and spirituality
>for all....
>
>> Such
>> communities usually had the independence to decide their own governance
>> without ideas of democracy, consensus, or dictatorship shoved down their
>> throats from outside.
>
>no, but they shoved hierarchy down each others throats from inside...then
>they also had to deal with similar small tribes nearby competing for land,
>for food, and shelter....and that was back when there was a lot more room
>available, and they still fought/competed within the tribe and with
>neighboring tribes....there may have been a few isolated cases where land
>and food was abundant in the tropics where egalitarian societies evolved,
>but eventually neighbor bullies came along and disrupted them....
>
>>  This is the general pattern of most societies
>> worldwide throughout recorded history.
>
>i just don't see it as viable or fun anymore really, women were opressed,
>and the hierarchies created competition and stress in between battles with
>the neighboring tribes....
>
>> Those who didn't fit in were free
>> to go their own way.
>
>but where could they go?????...back then they needed each other for
>survival.....some of the more smarter ones left and lived on the fringes
>and
>became the shamans of the tribe searching their souls for better ways to
>live and offering advice to the competitive tribes people....
>
>> Today the same type of local organization would rise
>> naturally if roadblocks were removed.
>
>ya, but most of us would not tolerate that pecking order mentality....it
>still exists in the modern world for the masses and they stress and
grumble
>about it much.....
>
>> And as in the past, it would
>> certainly need to be land based. But the form of ownership and
allocation
>> of labor and rewards would always have to be worked out among the people
>> concerned, not pre-determined by idealists or imposed from outside. And
>it
>> would vary from place to place.
>
>well, i think in this modern world now, it is not going to work to go back
>to the past....i think/feel it best to keep pushing the envelope for
>huWoMan
>rights and cooperation and imh-bs consensus and idealism are some of our
>important keys to that evolution....imh-bs we need to get spiritual fast
in
>order to deal with the dangers in the modern technological world now in
>control of male dominant businessmen and military industrial
>complex....aloha, 
>
>-- 
>forest
>[email protected]
>http://www.lavazone2.com/forest/
>
>
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