RE: Amnesia/ was ]Another Bush Crime against humanity and Gaia

Hey folks,

As regards the gist of this thread...

I joined the list because of my interest in the whole eco-village concept
out of participation in an Environmental Science class on my way to a
'late-in-life' master's degree (and if my patience holds, to now finish a
PhD <wg>). Unfortunately, the political bickering I see here is the same
problems perpetuated by the current 'extreme-liberal' Democratic Party,
which no longer resembles the conservative party I was raised on... one that
sought to balance individual freedoms with the politics necessary to support
society, one that promoted freedom from political oppression with respect
for those peoples whose political choices would otherwise seem to prefer a
political system different than ours. Those problems are intellectual
elitism, unreasonable judgmental-ism (ironically), political
complacence/appeasement (see article below), and a lack of congruence
(infighting)... IOW, the honor, compassion, generosity, integrity, and
steadfastness I grew up with are on the edge and sorely missed. I'm exposed
to a lot of pretty bright folks in business and elsewhere, and most,
including a lot repubs, wanted to vote for someone other than W... but in
the end, most just couldn't for these reasons, and voted for him because the
alternative was lacking. Destiny? Maybe. A sad reflection? Definitely... but
a reality because of a perceived congruence that the dem party doesn't
currently display (not my posit alone by any means), especially when it
comes to a willingness to support/promote appeasement. 

We can change the system from within the system much more realistically than
we can from without, and by being well informed, proactive, by building
consensus, and potentiating positive change. Genetic Engineering of crops
today is not what it was ten years ago... some forms are acceptable
(strictly natural - grafting, etc), while others are not... and those that
are not are on the way out. Wired mag has ran a number of great articles in
the last few years on the changes and the current reality of gm and those
companies and individuals working within the system to change the system.
One such article...

	http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,64089,00.html

In the end, a world-wide eco-village model seems to me to be the only real
solution... but as a means of moving forward in our then current scientific
and political realities, not as a step backwards in time, because those
methods simply won't scale to current population demands. To that end, we
need to find reasonable congruence (idealistically and politically) and
eco-posits adoptable by the masses if we are to collectively make a true and
lasting impact, no? Otherwise, it's just more noise...

Les 

---------------



Matthias Döpfner, Chief Executive of German publisher Axel Springer AG, has
written a blistering attack in the daily WELT against the cowardice of
Europe in the face of the Islamic threat. Hartmut Lau translated the article
for us. 

Europe - Thy Name is Cowardice 

Commentary by Mathias Döpfner 

A few days ago Henryk M. Broder wrote in Welt am Sonntag, "Europe - your
family name is appeasement." It's a phrase you can't get out of your head
because it's so terribly true. 

Appeasement cost millions of Jews and non-Jews their lives as England and
France, allies at the time, negotiated and hesitated too long before they
noticed that Hitler had to be fought, not bound to agreements. Appeasement
stabilized communism in the Soviet Union and East Germany in that part of
Europe where inhuman, suppressive governments were glorified as the
ideologically correct alternative to all other possibilities. Appeasement
crippled Europe when genocide ran rampant in Kosovo and we Europeans debated
and debated until the Americans came in and did our work for us. Rather than
protecting democracy in the Middle East, European appeasement, camouflaged
behind the fuzzy word "equidistance," now countenances suicide bombings in
Israel by fundamentalist Palestinians. Appeasement generates a mentality
that allows Europe to ignore 300,000 victims of Saddam's torture and murder
machinery and, motivated by the self-righteousness of the peace-movement, to
issue bad grades to George Bush. A particularly grotesque form of
appeasement is reacting to the escalating violence by Islamic
fundamentalists in Holland and elsewhere by suggesting that we should really
have a Muslim holiday in Germany. 

What else has to happen before the European public and its political
leadership get it? There is a sort of crusade underway, an especially
perfidious crusade consisting of systematic attacks by fanatic Muslims,
focused on civilians and directed against our free, open Western societies. 
It is a conflict that will most likely last longer than the great military
conflicts of the last century-a conflict conducted by an enemy that cannot
be tamed by tolerance and accommodation but only spurred on by such
gestures, which will be mistaken for signs of weakness. 

Two recent American presidents had the courage needed for anti-appeasement:
Reagan and Bush. Reagan ended the Cold War and Bush, supported only by the
social democrat Blair acting on moral conviction, recognized the danger in
the Islamic fight against democracy. His place in history will have to be
evaluated after a number of years have passed. 

In the meantime, Europe sits back with charismatic self-confidence in the
multicultural corner instead of defending liberal society's values and being
an attractive center of power on the same playing field as the true great
powers, America and China. On the contrary-we Europeans present ourselves,
in contrast to the intolerant, as world champions in tolerance, which even
(Germany's Interior Minister) Otto Schily justifiably criticizes. Why?
Because we're so moral? I fear it's more because we're so materialistic. 

For his policies, Bush risks the fall of the dollar, huge amounts of
additional national debt and a massive and persistent burden on the American
economy-because everything is at stake. 

While the alleged capitalistic robber barons in American know their
priorities, we timidly defend our social welfare systems. Stay out of it! It
could get expensive. We'd rather discuss the 35-hour workweek or our dental
health plan coverage. Or listen to TV pastors preach about "reaching out to
murderers." These days, Europe reminds me of an elderly aunt who hides her
last pieces of jewelry with shaking hands when she notices a robber has
broken into a neighbor's house. Europe, thy name is cowardice. (emphasis
added) 

Here's a link to the story:
http://medienkritik.typepad.com/blog/2004/11/europe_thy_name.html





-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Globalcircle
Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2005 8:08 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Ecobal]Amnesia/ was ]Another Bush Crime against humanity and Gaia


Forest, you say most of us would not tolerate tribal male dominated
politics as usual today, but that's exactly what most people put up with in
our society - isn't it? We are too spoiled by individualism and freedom?
How much freedom do you think the individual has as a cog in the economic
machine today?  The mortgage, the school loan, the credit cards - all tie
people in perpetual servitude to their masters. You will die in debt. Its
easy to believe the myth of progress, to believe life in the past was
nasty, brutal, and short - that before our modern enlightenment tribes of
ignorant savages warred constantly the world over. Except it's just not
accurate history.  Yes, life was that bad in England when the Industrial
Revolution enclosed the commons and forced millions into diseased ghettoes
for the profit of the few. But not the world over throughout history.  The
textbook writers have a lot of vested interest in the myth of progress. And
we have a great collective amnesia, which serves our masters well.

>well, i think in this modern world now, it is not going to work to go back
>to the past....i think/feel it best to keep pushing the envelope for
>huWoMan
>rights and cooperation and imh-bs consensus and idealism are some of our
>important keys to that evolution....imh-bs we need to get spiritual fast
in
>order to deal with the dangers in the modern technological world now in
>control of male dominant businessmen and military industrial
>complex....

Not being able to go back to the past is a poor excuse for refusing to
learn from the past. As the historian said, those who will not learn from
the past are condemned to repeat it.  In our hubris we imagine that we have
to invent workable, sustainable social structures, when they've been around
for centuries in other places. We can push the envelope all we want but we
do not have the luxury of time to reinvent the wheel.  All that idealism
won't help your survival if you don't join those who are doing what has to
be done, right here, right now.  Spirituality is something you learn by
doing, not by talking.


paul [email protected]
http://largocreekfarms.com
http://medicinehill.net

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 1/29/2005 at 4:47 AM forest wrote:

>on 1/28/05 5:15 PM, Globalcircle at [email protected] wrote:
>
>> 
>> I agree and promote " the paradigm shift to small decentralized
>bioregional
>> consensus group land based actions...." but without the consensus group
>> part.  Historically, stable societies in general have been composed of
>> small, close-knit communities made up primarily of extended families.
>
>imh-bs without consensus it is mostly male dominant hierarchical politics
>as
>usual, even in small tribes there were alpha male and/or female bullies
who
>forced the group by some hierarchical methods....most of us today would
>not/
>could not tolerate such systems....imh-bs we are too spoiled by
>individualism and freedom....with the world populations so large, there
>just
>ain't enough space to play those old hierarchical games anymore imh-bs,
>plus
>they did not really promote an evolution of human rights and spirituality
>for all....
>
>> Such
>> communities usually had the independence to decide their own governance
>> without ideas of democracy, consensus, or dictatorship shoved down their
>> throats from outside.
>
>no, but they shoved hierarchy down each others throats from inside...then
>they also had to deal with similar small tribes nearby competing for land,
>for food, and shelter....and that was back when there was a lot more room
>available, and they still fought/competed within the tribe and with
>neighboring tribes....there may have been a few isolated cases where land
>and food was abundant in the tropics where egalitarian societies evolved,
>but eventually neighbor bullies came along and disrupted them....
>
>>  This is the general pattern of most societies
>> worldwide throughout recorded history.
>
>i just don't see it as viable or fun anymore really, women were opressed,
>and the hierarchies created competition and stress in between battles with
>the neighboring tribes....
>
>> Those who didn't fit in were free
>> to go their own way.
>
>but where could they go?????...back then they needed each other for
>survival.....some of the more smarter ones left and lived on the fringes
>and
>became the shamans of the tribe searching their souls for better ways to
>live and offering advice to the competitive tribes people....
>
>> Today the same type of local organization would rise
>> naturally if roadblocks were removed.
>
>ya, but most of us would not tolerate that pecking order mentality....it
>still exists in the modern world for the masses and they stress and
grumble
>about it much.....
>
>> And as in the past, it would
>> certainly need to be land based. But the form of ownership and
allocation
>> of labor and rewards would always have to be worked out among the people
>> concerned, not pre-determined by idealists or imposed from outside. And
>it
>> would vary from place to place.
>
>well, i think in this modern world now, it is not going to work to go back
>to the past....i think/feel it best to keep pushing the envelope for
>huWoMan
>rights and cooperation and imh-bs consensus and idealism are some of our
>important keys to that evolution....imh-bs we need to get spiritual fast
in
>order to deal with the dangers in the modern technological world now in
>control of male dominant businessmen and military industrial
>complex....aloha, 
>
>-- 
>forest
>[email protected]
>http://www.lavazone2.com/forest/
>
>
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