animated story telling with SVG
"'David Dailey' [email protected] [svg-developers]" <[email protected]> Thu, 11 Jun 2015 01:18:20 -0400
| Newsgroups | gmane.text.xml.svg.devel |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <000b01d0a406$08715af0$195410d0$@net> |
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There=92s a pretty picture at the end of this, but you have to click on it =
to
see it. This is a mailing list, and not an SVG-enhanced social network,
after all!
=20
Hearing things about how SVG2.0 won=92t be complete until animation is
impossible,=85 or, is it that SVG2.0 doesn=92t need animation? Or maybe it =
is
that SVG 2.0 is waiting until animation is even better!
=20
This last one is my preferred interpretation. Lots of posts and discussion
are afoot at www-svg. The clearest (and very welcome (following weeks of
silence in response to questions) ) statement from those on the inside seem=
s
to be this from Mozilla=92s Brian Birtles:
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0012.html .=20
[1] [2] [3] Provide additional backdrop and perspective.=20
=20
Brian provides constructive suggestions for how things might move forward.=
=20
=20
Drs. David Duce, Bob Hopgood and Olaf Hoffman (some of the true pioneers =
=96
and inventors -- of SVG) have been making the case for why =93deprecating=
=94 SVG
animation is a bad idea. To me, the idea is so unfathomable that I=92ve bee=
n
keeping a polite distance at the urging of the border guards. There is this
new aerosol goop I=92ve been reading about and am afraid. [5]
=20
Is this someone=92s secret plan for W3C to self-destruct so that WebGL and
animated GIF[6] become the only real standards? Who knows?
=20
I remain optimistic that we=92ll finally get forward movement on graphical
standards (stalled for half a decade while the HTML CSS crowd, numerous and
armed, wrangle what parts of SVG they understand into a model that works fo=
r
the lumpen proletariat =96 a noble venture n=92est-ce pas?).=20
=20
Anyhow, some folks seem not to have gotten the memo about SVG being an
expressive medium. It is only style after all. Just as one from the world
of graphics could say HTML is =93only character strings with optional
vocalization=94=20=20
=20
My point of view is predictable, to those who know me, so what is the point
of stating it one more time?=20
=20
So maybe =93SMIL is dead, long live SMIL=94 as someone wrote here a couple =
of
months ago. Maybe =93SVG is dead. Long live SVG=94 or maybe =93this is, now=
, the
Dark Age of the Internet=94 or, perhaps, the removal of functionality from =
the
SVG 2.0 spec is, in fact, the long-awaited second coming of SVG5.=20=20=20
=20
Curious inequalities coming from W3C these days: SVG1.2 > SVG1.1 > SVG2.0.
But monotonic functions are highly overvalued =BFque no?
=20
Regardless of all the complexities that the future may hold, I grew up in a
place that was a first strike ( real number 1.0st strike) target during the
cold war, and learned to lay on the floor and shield my face with the =BE i=
nch
thick real wood that was used before plastic came into the US classroom, an=
d
I=92ve ridden the Pirates of the Caribbean ride umpteen times while Disneyl=
and
was closed the public! So I will make hay while the sun shines, take Olaf=
=92s
advice and keep old copies of all my browsers, and make some of the last SV=
G
movies the Internet will ever know, if it must come to that.=20
=20
I was disappointed to learn that there is no meaning to SVG. Like Euclid
said =93from mere points comes space, and space is all empty=94.=20
=20
Here is some geometry I=92ve been playing with. Like math, it has no meanin=
g,
but it=92s kinda pretty, I think.
=20
https://ello.co/ddailey/post/AEkf4gwULIDckw3ZIuV1JA=20
=20
I want to make a new language called =93bumpersticker=94 and start tweeting=
in
it.
=20
Regards,
David
=20
PS I am reminded of the wonderful stories, using SVG animation, that have
been told by such as Bob Hopgood, Erik Dahlstom, Domenico Strazzulo, David
Duce, Vincent Hardy, Marek Raida, and others. They are are not just
anecdotes but full-fledged stories. I myself have made hundreds of small
anecdotes, but for those who tell real stories, I am grateful .=20
=20
=20
[1] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0039.html=20
[2] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0030.html=20
[3] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0041.html=20
[5]
http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2015/04/americas-police-will-fight-nex=
t
-riot-these-stink-bombs/111430/=20
[6] The patent on GIF has expired. This implies GIF may be the only truly
open graphical standard for the web that remains! It is certainly the only
animation format (other than video=97with its corporate intrigue) that work=
s
in most social media and as the src of an HTML <img>.=20
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<div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal>There’s a pretty pictu=
re at the end of this, but you have to click on it to see it. This is a mai=
ling list, and not an SVG-enhanced social network,=A0 after all!<o:p></o:p>=
</p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Hearing =
things about how SVG2.0 won’t be complete until animation is impossib=
le,… or, is it that SVG2.0 doesn’t need animation? Or maybe it =
is that SVG 2.0 is waiting until animation is even better!<o:p></o:p></p><p=
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>This last one =
is my preferred interpretation. Lots of posts and discussion are afoot at w=
ww-svg. The clearest (and very welcome (following weeks of silence in respo=
nse to questions) ) statement from those on the inside seems to be this fro=
m Mozilla’s Brian Birtles:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><a href=
=3D"https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0012.html">https:/=
/lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0012.html</a> . <o:p></o:p></=
p><p class=3DMsoNormal>[1] [2] [3] Provide additional backdrop and perspect=
ive. <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMs=
oNormal>Brian provides constructive suggestions for how things might move f=
orward. <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal>Drs. David Duce, Bob Hopgood and Olaf Hoffman (some of the tru=
e pioneers – and inventors -- of SVG) have been making the case for w=
hy “deprecating” SVG animation is a bad idea. To me, the idea i=
s so unfathomable that I’ve been keeping a polite distance at the urg=
ing of the border guards. There is this new aerosol goop I’ve been re=
ading about and am afraid. [5]<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Is this someone’s secret plan for W3=
C to self-destruct so that WebGL and animated GIF[6] become the only real s=
tandards? Who knows?<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></=
p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I remain optimistic that we’ll finally get for=
ward movement on graphical standards (stalled for half a decade while the H=
TML CSS crowd, numerous and armed, wrangle what parts of SVG they understan=
d into a model that works for the lumpen proletariat – a noble ventur=
e n’est-ce pas?). <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:=
p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Anyhow, some folks seem not to have gotten the m=
emo about SVG being an expressive medium. =A0It is only style after all.=A0=
Just as one from the world of graphics could say HTML is “only chara=
cter strings with optional vocalization” =A0<o:p></o:p></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>My point of view is =
predictable, to those who know me, so what is the point of stating it one m=
ore time? <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal>So maybe “SMIL is dead, long live SMIL” as someone=
wrote here a couple of months ago. Maybe “SVG is dead. Long live SVG=
” or maybe “this is, now, the Dark Age of the Internet” o=
r, perhaps, the removal of functionality from the SVG 2.0 spec is, in fact,=
the long-awaited second coming of SVG5. =A0=A0<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMs=
oNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Curious inequalities comi=
ng from W3C these days: =A0SVG1.2 > SVG1.1 > SVG2.0. =A0But monotonic=
functions are highly overvalued =BFque no?<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNor=
mal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Regardless of all the complex=
ities that the future may hold, I grew up in a place that was a first strik=
e ( real number 1.0<sup>st</sup> strike) target during the cold war, and le=
arned to lay on the floor and shield my face with the =BE inch thick real w=
ood that was used before plastic came into the US classroom, and I’ve=
ridden the Pirates of the Caribbean ride umpteen times while Disneyland wa=
s closed the public! So I will make hay while the sun shines, take OlafR=
17;s advice and keep old copies of all my browsers, and make some of the la=
st SVG movies the Internet will ever know, if it must come to that. <o:p></=
o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I wa=
s disappointed to learn that there is no meaning to SVG. Like Euclid said &=
#8220;from mere points comes space, and space is all empty”. <o:p></o=
:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Here =
is some geometry I’ve been playing with. Like math, it has no meaning=
, but it’s kinda pretty, I think.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>=
<o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><a href=3D"https://ello.co/ddaile=
y/post/AEkf4gwULIDckw3ZIuV1JA">https://ello.co/ddailey/post/AEkf4gwULIDckw3=
ZIuV1JA</a> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p cla=
ss=3DMsoNormal>I want to make a new language called “bumpersticker=
221; and start tweeting in it.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Regards,<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNorma=
l>David<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3D=
MsoNormal>PS I am reminded of the wonderful stories, using SVG animation, t=
hat have been told by such as Bob Hopgood, Erik Dahlstom, Domenico Strazzul=
o, David Duce, Vincent Hardy, Marek Raida, and others. They are are not jus=
t anecdotes but full-fledged stories. I myself have made hundreds of small =
anecdotes, but for those who tell real stories, I am grateful . <o:p></o:p>=
</p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nb=
sp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>[1] <a href=3D"https://lists.w3.org/Archi=
ves/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0039.html">https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/=
www-svg/2015Jun/0039.html</a> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>[2] <a hr=
ef=3D"https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0030.html">https=
://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jun/0030.html</a> <o:p></o:p></=
p><p class=3DMsoNormal>[3] <a href=3D"https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/=
www-svg/2015Jun/0041.html">https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/201=
5Jun/0041.html</a> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>[5] <a href=3D"http:=
//www.defenseone.com/technology/2015/04/americas-police-will-fight-next-rio=
t-these-stink-bombs/111430/">http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2015/04/a=
mericas-police-will-fight-next-riot-these-stink-bombs/111430/</a> <o:p></o:=
p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>[6] The patent on GIF has expired. This implies =
GIF may be the only truly open graphical standard for the web that remains!=
It is certainly the only animation format (other than video—with its=
corporate intrigue) that works in most social media and as the src of an H=
TML <img>. <o:p></o:p></p></div>
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