Re: Troubleshooing advice, please...

It's turning out different than I anticipated. After my computer died, 
I figured that that PSU was bad and I replaced it. When it still 
wouldn't boot up I figured the motherboard was bad, too. Time to make a 
new computer sez I, so today I bought a new motherboard and CPU, and, 
because I still had a sneaking suspicion, yet another PSU.

When I got home, to check my suspicion, I put PSU #3 in the old 
computer... and it booted up! So, it turns out that new PSU #2, the 
first replacement, was defective. The guy at the checkout at Micro 
Center had actually warned me that he had recently seen a lot of those 
Corsair PSUs come back as DOA, but I had already paid and was in a 
hurry and (wrongly) figured the odds were in my favor.

So, everything would be hunky-dory now except that I discovered that 
when the original PSU died, it killed my D hard drive where some of my 
most precious data was stored. My most recent backup is not all that 
recent. Nothing I can do about that now.

Now I have a motherboard (ASUS Prime B550-PLUS) and CPU (AMD Ryzen 7 
5700G) that I can either return to the store or go ahead and build a 
new computer. I need to sleep on it.


On 22 Mar 2024, Nil <[email protected]> wrote in
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt: 

> I've let the panic fade away and after checking out the cost of
> off- the-shelf systems, my persecutive today is that I can do
> better for less if I build myself one. I should be able to recycle
> the case, RAM, cooler, and drives. I already have this new PSU a
> home. So I'll need a new motherboard and CPU, and I guess a new
> Windows license and I can be back in business. I'll have a better
> system for no more than the flimsy Dell-types.
> 
> One of the main duties for this computer has been music recording.
> I had been clinging to my beloved ancient PCi audio adapter, but
> it was a problem even in this computer and I've been casually
> searching for a USB replacement. This situation will force the
> issue. But at least I can permanently forget the PCi requirement.
> 
> I actually have another desktop (a Dell!) that I can make my main 
> computer until the new build comes together. My first task is to
> get some data off the SSD in the dead computer. I have a SSD
> adapter on its way - after that I can relax and take my time to
> make the right choices.
> 
> Thanks for your good ideas. I needed someone to bounce this off of
> and nobody around hear understands or cares about this kind of
> computer nerd stuff. To most people I know, a desktop computer is
> an antique curiosity, like a rotary telephone.
> 
> 
> On 21 Mar 2024, Paul <[email protected]> wrote in
> alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt: 
> 
>> You have some DDR4 in hand. You could look for a different
>> solution, and try to reuse the RAM at least.
>> 
>> A lot of the boards now, no longer have a PCI slot. They may
>> still have a kbd/mouse PS/2 hole, for at least one of the two
>> appliances to go. Some even have a serial RS232 port. Both my
>> machines have RS232, even though it was hardly advertised as
>> being present. On one machine, I just noticed it one day while
>> examining USB2 headers, and I noticed "one header has a strange
>> pinout". And that was an RS232 when I looked it up. 
>> 
>> The PCI Express slots may not be as useful as before. Before, we
>> had x8/x8 on two slots, and bifurcation logic. Today, the
>> mainstream boards are still sporting x16 on one slot (no external
>> logic for it), and x4 (off the PCH) for the second x16 slot. The
>> bandwidth is not shared any more, to the same extent it once was.
>> Any arch changes, the extra lanes are used for NVMe devices,
>> rather than as card slots. 
>> 
>> You have to watch modern machines, for how they're doing VCore.
>> The heatsinks are too small. The processor draws over 200W under
>> turbo, and this stresses the VCore a bit. I prefer to add cooling
>> so it is less stressed, but, they don't make it easy. To do it
>> properly, I'd have to change cases to make room for a fan in the
>> right position. On the Test machine, I did a kind of "blower",
>> mounted off the end of the drive bay, to get cooling onto VCore
>> on that one. I burned my finger on VCore while testing on the
>> kitchen table on the Test Machine, and that's when I determined I
>> had not made a clever product choice. 
>> 
>> If you get a Dell or an HP, you know the VCore is going to be
>> "even thinner". And at least in the case of Dell, the BIOS is
>> likely to be some sort of unacceptable piece of work.
>> 
>> I guess I still prefer to build, but for slightly different
>> reasons than before. Getting a good BIOS is part of the puzzle,
>> one with settings that work.
>> 
>> A relatively cheap way to build a system, would be a good AM4
>> board, an AMD Zen3 5600G, and your DDR4 RAM reused. But I suspect
>> the 5600G are out of production, because they're too cheap and
>> don't make AMD enough money. You could go upscale a bit, and get
>> the one with additional L3 on it.
>> 
>>    [Picture] 5600G
>> 
>>    https://i.postimg.cc/BZYR3B7x/cpuz.gif
>> 
>> Another thing to watch, is the CPU cooler. The 5600G system in
>> that picture, it uses the stock aluminum cooler. the adaptive
>> cooling system in the BIOS, doesn't even modulate the fan at all,
>> because there isn't enough stress for it to track what is going
>> on. 
>> 
>> When you put a 200W CPU in there, the instructions say "AMD
>> recommends a water cooler". I thought this was some kind of joke,
>> but if you want the Turbo to get close to the "rating on the
>> tin", it really appears you do need water.
>> 
>> For a cooler, I decided to skip the Noctua and tried a AK620 Zero
>> Dark (deepcool.com) and it was a bit cheaper than a Noctua would
>> have been. And it actually handles the heat OK. If the cooler is
>> under-sized on a high power processor, you might see weird
>> "thermal spikes" in a temperature trace. With the more capable
>> cooler fitted, the control loop settles right down. With water, I
>> would guess I'd get more than 4.55GHz, but not enough for me to
>> want water inside the poor thing. I guess I just like air
>> cooling. 
>> 
>>    [Picture] 5950x at idle and full power (62C) on Deepcool AK620
>> 
>>    https://i.postimg.cc/XJbVph8f/power-control-recent-CPU.gif
>> 
>> You don't get to use the cores all that often, and I got the
>> setup just for 7ZIP.
>> 
>>    [Picture]
>> 
>>    https://i.postimg.cc/RVJz4kZC/cpu-flat-out.gif
>> 
>> It still takes all day, to compress a backup file. And at
>> 224W wall power measured, you only want to be doing that
>> sort of compression in winter, when the air is cooler in here.
>> 
>> Maybe an Alienware would give you some of the properties of
>> an enthusiast machine, but then you're paying $1000 more for
>> the name (like "Cadillac").
>> 
>> With your experience, I'm sure it won't take you that
>> long to pick something.
>> 
>>    Paul