Re: [PHP-GTK-DEV] History, "Dead" and community

I will look into the timezone in my area.=20

--MGage--

> On Jun 23, 2015, at 6:07 AM, Mr L. Pegg <[email protected]> wrote:
>=20
> I can make myself available on IRC Thursday between 11:00 GMT - 13:00 GMT
>=20
>> On Tue, Jun 23, 2015 at 9:21 AM, Gage Morgan <[email protected]> wro=
te:
>> YESSSSSS PLEASSSE WE NEED IT MAN
>>=20
>> --MGage--
>>=20
>>> On Jun 23, 2015, at 4:48 AM, Mr L. Pegg <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>=20
>>> Elizabeth,
>>>=20
>>> It's been a long time :D things have picked up here though the IRC
>>> channel has remained rather quiet when ever i have popped in.
>>>=20
>>> As for the documentation I have a working knowledge of the system if
>>> anyone is interested in learning but it would be much more advised to
>>> upgrade the documentation to a new docbook version.
>>>=20
>>> Regards Leon
>>>=20
>>>> On Mon, Jun 22, 2015 at 5:22 PM, Gage Morgan <[email protected]> w=
rote:
>>>> Not for Long:
>>>>=20
>>>> We're gonna bring this back around, even if it kills us (I hope; this c=
ommunity needs some revitalization badly). Bruno is testing some stuff, and A=
lexandre is working on an actual implementation. I hope to help both at two p=
oints in time, particularly mid- to late-July. Thank you for your support, a=
nd I appreciate those of you that stayed theough the darker times to help us=
her me in.
>>>>=20
>>>> --MGage--
>>>>=20
>>>>> On Jun 22, 2015, at 12:35 PM, Elizabeth M Smith <[email protected]=
om> wrote:
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Hi folks.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> The mailing list got REALLY busy all of the sudden.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> I've been having issues with php mailing lists (they REALLY don't like=

>>>>> my email) and just realized all the stuff going on here.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> First of all it's great to have people interested in the project.  For=

>>>>> a LONG time it's been 1 or 2 people... with a few popping up here or
>>>>> there to get interested and then moving on quickly (usually when they
>>>>> realize how much work needs to be done)
>>>>>=20
>>>>> And although there's been someone keeping track of the actual code
>>>>> itself - the website was completely abandoned (thanks for taking that
>>>>> monstrosity on) and the documentation has been similarly abandoned
>>>>> (it's in old docbook and uses xsl to generate) - the people who once
>>>>> knew how that worked are gone
>>>>>=20
>>>>> There have actually been a couple of attempts to start up a php-gtk3
>>>>> project before.  But it's a BIG undertaking and only having 1 or 2
>>>>> people work on it makes it difficult to get off the ground.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> There's also the fact that a fully introspected version of the
>>>>> extension (like pythons gobject) have some pretty deep underlying
>>>>> issues (mostly related to the typelibs and the fact that they are
>>>>> strongly linked in many aspects to the python gobject wrapping
>>>>> implementation) - which is why although there's a prototype of an
>>>>> introspected solution it doesn't really work well.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> If you're interested in some of the code you can find it
>>>>> https://github.com/gtkforphp/ - some of it was actually working once
>>>>> upon a time.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> I think it's a good idea to do a "new" gtk for php but I think there
>>>>> are some things to keep in mind.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 1. We do have an irc channel on freenode #php-gtk - this is a great
>>>>> way to connect with the people who still work on the project and know
>>>>> the code - not  only the php-gtk code and php internals code, but the
>>>>> gnome libraries as well.  Especially when talking technical details
>>>>> it's nice to do it in realtime.
>>>>> 2. The project has never been completely dead - it just basically only=

>>>>> had one dev  (who is poor at recruiting) for a long time - which is
>>>>> never a good thing
>>>>> 3. The php-gtk source code is on php.net and mirrored on github -
>>>>> there have been some prs but not a lot - and none from the people now
>>>>> currently conversing on the list -  and it's also limited to the
>>>>> problem of basically 1 developer to look at and pull them
>>>>> 4. Discussions on the future should be all on list - not in private em=
ails :)
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Some thoughts on a complete rewrite
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 1. a monolithic extension is not very useful - php-gtk should become
>>>>> several small extensions
>>>>>=20
>>>>> right now php-gtk has wrappings for gtk, gdk, some glib, atk, some
>>>>> cairo integration (although most of cairo was pulled into it's own
>>>>> extension)  and many others
>>>>>=20
>>>>> parts of glib, cairo, and other gnome libraries such as clutter make
>>>>> sense to use not only in a gui environment, but even in a server
>>>>> environment
>>>>>=20
>>>>> This would even allow for things like a gtk2 and gtk3 extension
>>>>>=20
>>>>> the extension(s) should probably mirror the underlying libraries
>>>>>=20
>>>>> glib, gobject, gio, cairo(exists, is getting a php7 fix), pango (also
>>>>> exists), atk, gtk2, gtk3, gdk, clutter, gstreamer, etc.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 2. If you're rewriting from scratch, a PHP7 only version is probably a=
 good idea
>>>>>=20
>>>>> The internal apis of php have changed an incredible amount from 5 -> 7=

>>>>> and it would be both very ugly and very hard to support both PHP7 and
>>>>> PHP 5.6(and higher) in the same code base
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 3. PHP-gtk has very very few tests... and needs them
>>>>>=20
>>>>> This is probably as important as the rewrite - although you really
>>>>> don't need to test the functionality of the gtk library itself, it IS
>>>>> important to make sure the bindings are tight.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> As far as getting php-gtk commit karma, that's really not that hard
>>>>> Submit some PR's - usually 2 or 3 good ones with tests
>>>>> Discuss things on list and/or in IRC
>>>>> As long as stuff doesn't break the build and works it gets pulled -
>>>>> but remember right now there's 1 dev... so expect lag time (maybe a
>>>>> week) until there are 2 or 3 or more devs capable of code reviewing,
>>>>> building, and testing - because you need those checks
>>>>>=20
>>>>> If you need help getting an environment for compiling set up on
>>>>> windows or linux - I'm happy to help.  Pop into irc.  If you're really=

>>>>> ambitious someone could update the documentation :)
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Also php-gtk could really use someone to roll releases.  We actually
>>>>> should have had about 3-4 - there's been new functionality added and
>>>>> build fixes done and features integrated.. just no release.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> For example - there is complete gtkbuilder integration in the git
>>>>> version of php-gtk (that's the format glade3 outputs btw) - but none
>>>>> of that is documented beyond some demo files.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Elizabeth M Smith
>>>>>=20
>>>>> --
>>>>> PHP-GTK Development Mailing List (http://gtk.php.net/)
>>>>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>>>>=20
>>>> --
>>>> PHP-GTK Development Mailing List (http://gtk.php.net/)
>>>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>=20
> --=20
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>=20