Re: [UG-ADMINS] [VOTE] Move to a private life off of php.net

Hi Ben,
    Thank you for explaining your vote. Where do you think it would be appropriate to discuss more sensitive ug-leader issues, like the member issue I brought up recently or disciplinary issues? Also, people keep saying they are voting against this because they don't want to membership restricted, but I haven't seen anything proposed that would restrict membership to the list. Did I miss a message that brought that up?
Beth

Beth Tucker Long
Treeline Design, LLC
807 Arbor Vitae Place
Verona, WI 53593
608-770-6677
http://www.TreelineDesign.com

> On Jan 30, 2016, at 17:32, Ben Ramsey <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> I didn't explain my -1 vote, but if wondering, it was for the same reasons Mike and Eric voiced. I think open source communities should remain open and transparent.
> 
> Sensitive discussions probably shouldn't be on the list, even if it's a private list, since we've already stated there won't be any vetting of membership for that list, so the discussions, even if not searchable, are still public and can be leaked by those lurking on the list.
> 
> Additionally, vendors and other non-organizers enjoy being on this list to provide aid and offer help to user groups, as needed. Will we deny them access to the private list?
> 
> - Ben
> 
> 
>> On Jan 30, 2016, at 17:11, Mike Stowe <[email protected]> wrote:
>> 
>> -1
>> 
>> Eric put into words my thoughts perfectly (see below). 
>> 
>> I believe transparency is key, as well as the openness of the group (especially for those who may be considering starting a user group). 
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Jan 30, 2016, at 2:58 PM, Ben Ramsey <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> If moved outside the realm of php.net, I believe this list would no longer fall under the jurisdiction of the PHP project and no longer be subject to its code of conduct―at least that's how I read some of the drafts, unless the PHP project considers all related user groups to be under the same code of conduct, since they deal with PHP.
>>> 
>>> - Ben
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 30, 2016, at 14:44, Adam Culp <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Just putting this here because it does relate to the content we are concerned with keeping private, and how it may be governed: Doesn't the current wording in the proposed CoC of php.net indicate the content of this list and all users of it must also abide.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Adam Culp
>>>> 561-870-6361
>>>> Twitter: @adamculp
>>>> Tech Blog: http://geekyboy.com
>>>> Podcast: http://rungeekradio.com
>>>> Running Blog: http://crazyfloridian.com
>>>> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/adamculp
>>>> 
>>>>> On 01/30/2016 03:29 PM, Eric wrote:
>>>>> I am on the fence with this. Where I understand the desire to have a private channel and people feeling more at ease opening discussing sensitive topics, at the same time, the Open Source in me says, ‘No, for better or worse we air it all out. We share and build a stronger community’ Complete transparency. Let everyone know all the issues we work on addressing, how we address them, and how much we all care.
>>>>> 
>>>>> My other concern would be vetting of the private list if we went that way. I do think, at very less, the list of the members of the private group should be public. Then we can police it a little ourselves making sure admin are not missed, and people trying to get on the list have several avenues of contact they can reach out to with questions.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I am holding off on any voting, for now, to see if there are any more opinions on the topic but will place a vote by the end of the day tomorrow.
>>>>> 
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Eric
>>>>> 
>>>>> twitter <http://twitter.com/#%21/shocm>: @shocm <http://twitter.com/#%21/shocm> | @sdphp <https://twitter.com/sdphp> | http://www.sdphp.org <http://www.sdphp.org/>
>>>>> /No trees were killed in sending this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced./
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On January 30, 2016 at 10:25:43 AM, Jonathan Sundquist ([email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>) wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I am +1 for making the list more private.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Can we consider those that are +0 as a -1 since they show concerns and are
>>>>>> not fully in favor of it?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Sat, Jan 30, 2016, 12:11 PM Ben Ramsey <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -1
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Jan 30, 2016, at 02:48, Cal Evans <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Please cast your vote +1 or -1 to move off of php.net to a private (but
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>> secret) list.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Voting will remain open until Feb 6th.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I will moderate the vote and tally the votes. Beth, if she will, will
>>>>>>>> double check my math and certify the vote.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> This is a voting thread only. If you want to discuss use the other
>>>>>>> thread.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Cheers!
>>>>>>>> =C=
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Usergroup Coordination Mailing List (http://ug.php.net)
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Usergroup Coordination Mailing List (http://ug.php.net)
>>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
> 
> -- 
> Usergroup Coordination Mailing List (http://ug.php.net)
> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>