Re: [UG-ADMINS] Slack-Team for Usergroups available - IRC <=> Slack gateway

Am 23.03.15 um 15:47 schrieb Ben Ramsey:
> On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 9:01 AM, Yitzchok Willroth <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> 
>>
>> These seems like a great solution.  For those whom IRC is a barrier to
>> connecting with the community, we can offer the "new sexy" and for the
>> curmudgeons, we can get off their lawn. ;-)
>>
> 
> 
> For that to happen, we'd have to create a Slack channel for each user group
> and connect it to their corresponding IRC channel. It'd be up to each user
> group to decide whether that's useful for them.

That's what the intention was. Allow a usergroup to connect their
IRC-channel to their Slack-Channel IF THEY USE BOTH. there's some
handwork required, but we'll manage that.
> 
> From past experience, too many channels of communication can be
> overwhelming to maintain and can ultimately hurt your communication. You
> end up creating small groups of disconnected communities within your user
> group. Since they don't cross lines, some groups talk about things that
> other groups never benefit from. I've tried multiple mailing lists, a
> FUDforum forum, a Facebook group, a Google+ page, Meetup.com forums,
> Twitter accounts, etc. All of this in the name of trying to reach the
> largest audience possible, but it stretches too thin.

I've made that "mistake" also a while ago and it showed that there is no
need to split up your communication into too many tools. In the end
focus on two or three (ok, mabe even four, but you get the picture)
channels and that's it.
> 
> I've learned that it's valuable to consolidate and encourage your members
> to use the tools you choose, rather than trying to use as many tools as
> possible to reach potential members. Quality vs. quantity, and all that.
> IRC is not really a barrier to newcomers—participating is. Folks who want
> to participate will always participate, regardless of the tools you choose.
> Folks who aren't participating yet (but might) would benefit from the
> greater exposure to the open source community that comes from learning how
> to use IRC (for example) and other tools that are staples of open source
> project communication.

I'm experiencing the opposit. Newecomers often don't see it as a benefit
to learn a "new" tool when they can get the information they want via
other channels. You are definitely right that people WOULD benefit but
they can only do so when you convince them and that takes time and
effort we often do not have.
> 
> For example, how many on this list know that top-posting is frowned upon on
> PHP mailing lists? (I'm not trying to call people out on this—just making a
> point.) A lot of people don't even know what "top-posting" is, but many
> open source projects still maintain rules of etiquette, and one of those is
> "do not top post."  I think exposing our members to the way open source
> projects are run and how they communicate can benefit them when they first
> get involved in a project. It sets them up for success in their first
> exposure to that project so that they don't come away feeling like a fool
> for breaching some esoteric netiquette rule.

Yes, that would be a benefit. But shouldn't we try to fetch people from
where they are? Instead of requiring them to meet an - in their eyes -
high standard before they are "allowed" to talk to someone give them the
possibility to chat away freely and then, when they feel comfortable, we
can slightly push them into the right direction.

The internet is everywhere and everyone now has access to that medium.
People growing up nowadays don't necessarily know how to behave as they
didn't ever get into contact with the technologies that build the
internet underneath. They are using 'LOL' in their everyday language
without knowing where the phrase comes from. It's not their fault that
for most of them "internet" and "WorldWideWeb"  are synonyms and using
mail (or any other well known service) involves nothing else than
downloading an app and entering a username and password. Therefore we
have to fetch them from there and tell them that there is far more to
the internet than loading an app. (Might be a bit ranty, but I think you
get the picture)
> 
> [...]
> To play my own Devil's Advocate, this illustrates the reverse scenario. We
> had to start using a communication tool that had become the ubiquitous
> place for people to look for user group meetings. I am sure that when Slack
> becomes ubiquitous, we may find ourselves in a similar situation. However,
> while user groups had nothing like Meetup.com before, open source projects
> have had the free (as in freedom), open, and distributed IRC networks as
> their primary real-time communication tools for over 20 years. I feel that
> switching to a proprietary, closed, and centralized network to manage
> communication runs counter to the spirit of open source. Perhaps we are
> losing something with this transition. Only time will tell.
> 
> So, perhaps this is just the $0.02 of someone who is shouting "get off my
> lawn" to the newcomers. I don't see myself as having that attitude. On the
> contrary, I think tools like Slack and HipChat are excellent for remote
> teams. They work great for businesses and closed teams. I am not convinced
> they are the right tools for open, distributed teams building open source
> software, and our user groups, for the most part, focus on open source
> software and being involved in open source communities.

I just can not emphasize that enough: No one wants to shift
communication from IRC to Slack! (at least no one I know)

The idea is just to allow users that are more at home on slack to gather
together in one place AND to connect them with the IRC-world. That way
we can combine forces! So it's not about "get off my lawn" but - to keep
the image - add a gate to the playground for the littles to come over
onto the lawn when they are ready!

But that - of course are just my 2 cent.

Cheers

Andreas

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| Andreas Heigl                                                       |
| mailto:[email protected]                  N 50°22'59.5" E 08°23'58" |
| http://andreas.heigl.org                       http://hei.gl/wiFKy7 |
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