RE: Re: Innovation

"ron.hilton" <[email protected]> Mon, 2 Jul 2012 10:15:43 -0600
Newsgroups gmane.comp.emulators.hercules390.advocacy
Message-ID <0DCAE95DFD9744B4851AB27C491CEBF4@ronhp1> 
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There are a number of technical disclosure publications out there that
charge on a per-page basis. The typical submission is a few pages at a cost
of several hundred dollars. Supposedly they are routinely searched by the
USPTO during patent examination, making them more likely to be found and
cited as prior art than some random post on the Internet, such as by a
Hercules developer describing the invention and uploading some code. USPTO
patent searches are far from exhaustive, which is why we get so many issued
patents of dubious quality leading to frivolous litigation (this is a major
pet peeve of mine - I could go on at length about what I believe is needed
for real patent reform).

 

Back to the original question, using Hercules patents as leverage to get IBM
to provide a non-commercial hobbyist license may be a feasible goal, since
by definition such a license would not pose a significant competitive threat
to IBM's business. But companies don't tend to act out of charity, even when
it might cost them very little to do so. A Hercules patent would give them a
valid business reason to act. They may also be induced to pay reasonable
royalties, since a non-commercial license by definition has little or no
commercial value to the licensee, and there has to be some financial
consideration for the commercial value to IBM of the Hercules patent.
Microsoft or whoever the deep-pocketed investor(s) might be would presumably
insist upon that. As for the inventor/developer(s), I presume that their
primary motivation would be the hobbyist license, but there is no reason
that they should not be able to participate financially as well by receiving
a reasonable incentive for assigning their patent rights, such as shares in
the Hercules patent holding company established by the investor(s) for this
purpose.

 

  _____  

From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Roger Bowler
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 6:23 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [hercules-advocacy] Re: Innovation

 

  

--- In [email protected]
<mailto:hercules-advocacy%40yahoogroups.com> , Ron Hilton wrote:
> The goal of a Hercules patent effort would be two-fold:
> 1. Induce IBM to license its mainframe IP to Hercules, including
> patents and software, at low or no cost for _non-commercial_ use
> only (a "hobbyist" license).
> 2. Receive enough cash royalties from IBM to return a profit to
> Hercules investors who underwrote the cost of patent filing and
> litigation.

Ron,

Somehow I just cannot see IBM giving Hercules enthusiasts rights to its
alleged IP while at the same time paying royalties to Microsoft (or whoever
the investor is) for Hercules inventions.

And if the Hercules invention really does turn out to be so valuable that
Microsoft can still make a profit out of it after paying millions in legal
expenses for the patent litigation, why would the inventor want to go
through all that bother just to line the pockets of Microsoft and the
lawyers?

A colleague has suggested that a Hercules Technical Disclosure Bulletin,
along the lines of 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Technical_Disclosure_Bulletin
might be a more achievable goal, the goal being to try and prevent IBM from
obtaining further patents which they could use against Hercules in the
future.

Roger Bowler
Hercules "I can't believe it's not a mainframe"





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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      <p>There are a number of technical disclosure publications out there that<br>
charge on a per-page basis. The typical submission is a few pages at a cost<br>
of several hundred dollars. Supposedly they are routinely searched by the<br>
USPTO during patent examination, making them more likely to be found and<br>
cited as prior art than some random post on the Internet, such as by a<br>
Hercules developer describing the invention and uploading some code. USPTO<br>
patent searches are far from exhaustive, which is why we get so many issued<br>
patents of dubious quality leading to frivolous litigation (this is a major<br>
pet peeve of mine - I could go on at length about what I believe is needed<br>
for real patent reform).<br>
<br>
Back to the original question, using Hercules patents as leverage to get IBM<br>
to provide a non-commercial hobbyist license may be a feasible goal, since<br>
by definition such a license would not pose a significant competitive threat<br>
to IBM's business. But companies don't tend to act out of charity, even when<br>
it might cost them very little to do so. A Hercules patent would give them a<br>
valid business reason to act. They may also be induced to pay reasonable<br>
royalties, since a non-commercial license by definition has little or no<br>
commercial value to the licensee, and there has to be some financial<br>
consideration for the commercial value to IBM of the Hercules patent.<br>
Microsoft or whoever the deep-pocketed investor(s) might be would presumably<br>
insist upon that. As for the inventor/developer(s), I presume that their<br>
primary motivation would be the hobbyist license, but there is no reason<br>
that they should not be able to participate financially as well by receiving<br>
a reasonable incentive for assigning their patent rights, such as shares in<br>
the Hercules patent holding company established by the investor(s) for this<br>
purpose.<br>
<br>
_____  <br>
<br>
From: <a href="mailto:hercules-advocacy%40yahoogroups.com">[email protected]</a><br>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:hercules-advocacy%40yahoogroups.com">[email protected]</a>] On Behalf Of Roger Bowler<br>
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 6:23 AM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:hercules-advocacy%40yahoogroups.com">[email protected]</a><br>
Subject: [hercules-advocacy] Re: Innovation<br>
<br>
--- In <a href="mailto:hercules-advocacy%40yahoogroups.com">[email protected]</a><br>
&lt;mailto:hercules-advocacy%40yahoogroups.com&gt; , Ron Hilton wrote:<br>
&gt; The goal of a Hercules patent effort would be two-fold:<br>
&gt; 1. Induce IBM to license its mainframe IP to Hercules, including<br>
&gt; patents and software, at low or no cost for _non-commercial_ use<br>
&gt; only (a &quot;hobbyist&quot; license).<br>
&gt; 2. Receive enough cash royalties from IBM to return a profit to<br>
&gt; Hercules investors who underwrote the cost of patent filing and<br>
&gt; litigation.<br>
<br>
Ron,<br>
<br>
Somehow I just cannot see IBM giving Hercules enthusiasts rights to its<br>
alleged IP while at the same time paying royalties to Microsoft (or whoever<br>
the investor is) for Hercules inventions.<br>
<br>
And if the Hercules invention really does turn out to be so valuable that<br>
Microsoft can still make a profit out of it after paying millions in legal<br>
expenses for the patent litigation, why would the inventor want to go<br>
through all that bother just to line the pockets of Microsoft and the<br>
lawyers?<br>
<br>
A colleague has suggested that a Hercules Technical Disclosure Bulletin,<br>
along the lines of <br>
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Technical_Disclosure_Bulletin">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Technical_Disclosure_Bulletin</a><br>
might be a more achievable goal, the goal being to try and prevent IBM from<br>
obtaining further patents which they could use against Hercules in the<br>
future.<br>
<br>
Roger Bowler<br>
Hercules &quot;I can't believe it's not a mainframe&quot;<br>
<br>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]<br>
<br>
</p>

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